3
25
112
-
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Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Thomson, Thomas
T Thomson
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2016-03-03
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. Some items have not been published in order to protect the privacy of third parties, to comply with intellectual property regulations, or have been assessed as medium or low priority according to the IBCC Digital Archive collection policy and will therefore be published at a later stage. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal, https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collection-policy.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Thomson, T
Description
An account of the resource
18 items. The collection concerns Flight Sergeant Thomas Thomson (1919 - 1991, 1366937 Royal Air Force) He flew operations as a wireless operator with 49 Squadron. It contains photographs, documents, a brief biography and a copy of E J Haddow's log book.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Suzanne Fletcher and catalogued by Barry Hunter.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Provisional Authority to wear a 1939/45 Star, Aircrew Europe Star and Clasp
Description
An account of the resource
An advice note authorising Thomas Thomson to wear medals.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Wing Commander 97 Squadron
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
1943-12-18
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
One double sided printed slip
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
OThomsonT1366937-160303-010001,
OThomsonT1366937-160303-010002
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1943-08-30
97 Squadron
RAF Coningsby
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/1027/26179/LMcVickersCG1042135v1.1.pdf
2345da87e3c847e2ac316c46eb50751b
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
McVickers, Christopher George
C G McVickers
Description
An account of the resource
Five items. An oral history interview with Flight Sergeant Christopher George McVickers (1922 - 2018, 1042135 Royal Air Force), his log book identity card and disks and his decorations. He completed a tour of operations as a wireless operator with 218 Squadron.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Christopher McVickers and catalogued by Nigel Huckins.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2017-10-06
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
McVickers, CG
Dublin Core
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Title
A name given to the resource
Christopher George McVickers' flying log book
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Great Britain. Royal Air Force
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Mike Connock
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Format
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One booklet
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Text. Log book and record book
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
LMcVickersCG1042135v1
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Egypt
France
Germany
Great Britain
Oman
Singapore
Atlantic Ocean--Baltic Sea
Atlantic Ocean--English Channel
North Africa
England--Cornwall (County)
England--Cumbria
England--Lincolnshire
England--Norfolk
England--Nottinghamshire
England--Rutland
England--Suffolk
England--Yorkshire
England--Wiltshire
France--Calais
France--Le Havre
France--Saint-Omer Region (Pas-de-Calais)
Germany--Borken (North Rhine-Westphalia)
Germany--Braunschweig Region
Germany--Castrop-Rauxel
Germany--Chemnitz
Germany--Dortmund
Germany--Dresden
Germany--Frankfurt am Main
Germany--Gelsenkirchen
Germany--Hattingen
Germany--Kiel
Germany--Kleve (North Rhine-Westphalia)
Germany--Krefeld
Germany--Merseburg
Germany--Mönchengladbach
Germany--Neuss
Germany--Recklinghausen (Münster)
Germany--Saarbrücken
Germany--Wesel (North Rhine-Westphalia)
Germany--Wilhelmshaven
Gibraltar
Northern Ireland--Ballykelly
Oman--Masirah Island
Scotland--Kinloss
Wales--Bridgend
Germany--Wuppertal
Egypt--Suez Canal
Great Britain
Germany--Ruhr (Region)
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1943
1944
1945
1946
1947
1948
1949
1950
1951
1952
1953
1954
1955
1956
1957
1958
1959
1960
1961
1962
1963
1964
1965
1944-07-08
1944-09-05
1944-09-06
1944-09-08
1944-09-12
1944-09-13
1944-09-28
1944-10-05
1944-10-07
1944-10-15
1944-12-31
1945-01-01
1945-01-03
1945-01-06
1945-01-13
1945-01-15
1945-01-29
1945-02-01
1945-02-03
1945-02-13
1945-02-14
1945-02-15
1945-02-18
1945-02-19
1945-02-23
1945-02-27
1945-03-09
1945-03-12
1945-03-18
1945-03-22
1945-03-29
1945-04-04
1945-04-05
1945-04-09
1945-04-10
Description
An account of the resource
Flying log book for C G McVickers, Wireless operator, covering the period from 6 April 1943 to 16 August 1965. Detailing his flying training, operations flown and post war flying duties with 90, 97, 12, 100, 101, 199, 192, 220, 210, 224 and 205 squadrons. He was stationed at RAF Compton Bassett, RAF Stormy Down, RAF Topcliffe, RAF Millom, RAF Ossington, RAF Bircotes, RAF Gamston, RAF Chedburgh, RAF Wratting Common, RAF Stradishall, RAF Woolfox Lodge, RAF Methwold, RAF Feltwell, RAF Tuddenham, RAF Full Sutton, RAF Binbrook, RAF Scampton, RAF Hemswell, RAF Shallufah, RAF Watton, RAF St Mawgan, RAF St Eval, RAF Kinloss, RAF Ballykelly, RAF Gibraltar, RAF North Front, RAF Masirah Island and RAF Changi. Aircraft flown in were Dominie, Proctor, Anson, Wellington, Stirling, Lancaster, Lancastrian, Lincoln, Mosquito, Washington, Canberra, Shackleton, Prentice, Neptune, Varsity, Viking and Comet. He flew a total of 31 operations with 218 squadron, 21 Daylight and 10 night. Targets were Wemars/Capel, Le Havre, Frankfurt, Calais, Saarbrucken, Kleve, Wilhelmshaven, Vohwinkel, Castrop Rauxel, Neuss, Gelsenkirchen, Krefeld, Mönchengladbach, Dortmund, Dresden, Chemnitz, Wesel, Datteln, Hattingen, Bocholt, Hallendorf, Merseburg and Keil. His pilots on operations were Flying Officer Lloyld, Flying Officer Hill and Flying Officer Boome.
100 Squadron
101 Squadron
12 Squadron
1651 HCU
1653 HCU
1657 HCU
192 Squadron
199 Squadron
205 Squadron
210 Squadron
218 Squadron
220 Squadron
82 OTU
90 Squadron
97 Squadron
Advanced Flying Unit
Air Gunnery School
aircrew
Anson
B-29
bombing
bombing of Dresden (13 - 15 February 1945)
Dominie
Heavy Conversion Unit
Lancaster
Lancaster Finishing School
Lancaster Mk 1
Lancaster Mk 3
Lancastrian
Lincoln
Mosquito
Normandy campaign (6 June – 21 August 1944)
Operational Training Unit
Proctor
RAF Binbrook
RAF Chedburgh
RAF Compton Bassett
RAF Feltwell
RAF Full Sutton
RAF Gamston
RAF Hemswell
RAF Kinloss
RAF Methwold
RAF Millom
RAF Ossington
RAF Scampton
RAF Shallufa
RAF St Eval
RAF St Mawgan
RAF Stormy Down
RAF Stradishall
RAF Topcliffe
RAF Tuddenham
RAF Watton
RAF Woolfox Lodge
RAF Wratting Common
Shackleton
Stirling
training
Wellington
wireless operator
-
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Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Pritchard, Arthur
A Pritchard
Description
An account of the resource
Six items. An oral history interview with Carolyn Pritchard about her father, Arthur Pritchard (2206806 Royal air Force) documents and photographs. He flew operations as a flight engineer with with 463, 467 and 97 Squadron until he was shot down. He was hidden by the French Resistance until the liberation of Paris.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Carolyn Pritchard and catalogued by Barry Hunter.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2017-08-23
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Pritchard, A
Transcribed document
A resource consisting primarily of words for reading.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
97 (Straits Settlements) Squadron,
Royal Air Force,
CONINGSBY,
Lincolnshire.
10th June, 1944.
Dear Mr. Pritchard,
It is with deep regret that I must confirm that your son, Sergeant A. Pritchard, failed to return from operations this morning, the 10th June, 1944, and I wish to express the great sympathy which the Squadron feel with you during the anxious time which must pas before any news comes through.
Your son was taking part in an operation against a military target near Etemps, France, the Flight Engineer of the aircraft. No news has been received since the crew left base last night; we can only hope that they had the chance to bale out and are safe, even as prisoners of war.
Sergeant Pritchard had only been serving with this Squadron for a sort while, but during that period he was able to operate with us on the opening of the Second Front. He had operated with another Squadron prior to coming here, and had taken part in fifteen sorties, many of which were against major objectives in Germany. On this occasion he was working with his usual crew. Your son was keen and capable as a flight engineer, and he and his crew will be a great loss to the Squadron; we shall all miss them very much.
It is desired to explain that the request in the telegram notifying you of the casualty was included with the object of avoiding your son's chance of escape being prejudiced by undue publicity in case he is still at large. This is not to say that any information about him is available, but is a precaution adopted in the case of all personnel reported missing.
His kit and personal effects are being carefully collected and will be sent to the R.A.F. Central Depository, Colnbrook, Slough, from whom you will hear in due course.
If any news is received you will be communicated with immediately, and in the meantime I join with you in hoping that we shall soon hear favourable news of your son and the remainder of the crew.
Yours sincerely,
[signature]
Squadron Leader, Commanding,
No. 97 (Straits Settlements)
[underlined] Squadron, R.A.F. CONINGSBY. [/underlined]
Mr. A. Pritchard,
10, Rhyd Fenai,
PORT DINORWIC,
N. Wales.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Letter to Arthur Pritchard's Father
Description
An account of the resource
A letter to Arthur's father explaining that his son is missing in action.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Squadron Leader 97 Squadron
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
1944-06-10
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
One typed letter
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Text. Correspondence
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
EVaughnJHPritchardA440610
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
Wales--Y Felinheli
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1944-06-10
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Jan Waller
97 Squadron
missing in action
RAF Coningsby
-
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Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Pritchard, Arthur
A Pritchard
Description
An account of the resource
Six items. An oral history interview with Carolyn Pritchard about her father, Arthur Pritchard (2206806 Royal air Force) documents and photographs. He flew operations as a flight engineer with with 463, 467 and 97 Squadron until he was shot down. He was hidden by the French Resistance until the liberation of Paris.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Carolyn Pritchard and catalogued by Barry Hunter.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2017-08-23
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Pritchard, A
Transcribed document
A resource consisting primarily of words for reading.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
THE EXPOITS OF
WARRANT OFFICER
ARTHUR PRITCHARD
By his daughter, CAROLYN PRITCHARD
My father, Warrant Officer Arthur Pritchard, passed away on May 28, 2010, aged 86 years.
His life story is of humour, luck, and courage. It is also a story of the heroism of the French people who took him under their protection at great risk to themselves.
He was born in Beach Road, Y Felinheli (Port Dinorwig), on April 13, 1924, one of seven children of Arthur and Hannah May Pritchard.
[Photograph of an airman] Arthur Pritchard in his Flight Sergeant uniform
He joined the Royal Air Force before his 18th birthday, and did his training at R.A.F. St. Athan in South Wales, where he passed out as a Flight Sergeant and was posted to R.A.F. Winthorpe in Lincolnshire, where he was introduced to his Australian crew as a Flight Engineer. On February 29, 1944 the crew joined 463 Squadron based at RAF Waddington. During their time there they completed 17 sorties over Germany and France.
On May 7, 1944, Pilot Officer Bryan Giddins and crew were posted to 97 Pathfinder Force at RAF Coningsby. They completed a further three missions, seeing action on D-Day.
On their twenty-first sortie on June 9/10, 1944, on a night raid over a railway junction at Etampes, south of Paris, pilot Officer Giddings and his crew failed to return. After releasing flares over the target their Lancaster, ND764, was hit by flak and then attacked from below by a night fighter.
Many years later when he was able to relate his story, my father recollected the moment at the time when the aircraft was hit:- “The inner or outer port side engine was on fire, - it could have been either as there wasn’t much space between the engines. The suicidal height at which we were flying, the noise, the cabin full of smoke and partially lit, communications cut, cramped conditions in the cockpit, no place to wear your parachute (it had to be stored on the floor), frantically searching for it, the rush of cold air from the open back door, trying to prise open the escape hatch at the front, every second wasted making survival more improbable, the whole episode could not have lasted for more than a few minutes, and before we realised it was a doomed machine, we would have had even less time to make our getaway. The Lancaster was not air-crew friendly!”
Out of a crew of seven there were only two survivors. Pilot officer Bryan Giddings and Navigator Bryce Webb bailed out of the blazing plane but their parachutes did not deploy in time. The Lancaster finally crashed in a field near the village of Souzy la Briche. Carrying with it the remaining three crew members – Mid-Upper Gunner John McGill, Rear-Gunner Johnny Seale and H2S Operator Charles Clement. Wireless Operator Bob Bethell had baled out through the rear door, but was captured by a German patrol and ended up in Stalag Luft 7 Bankau, near Kreulberg.
When my father and the crew failed to return from the mission my grandparents Arthur and Hannah Mary received a telegram followed by a letter advising them that their son was missing presumed killed. During the time he was missing they and the family never gave up hope that he was still alive. On one occasion the local vicar called on them to ask permission for a memorial service for him to be arranged in the village. They declined saying “Our son is coming home”.
[Underlined] Their faith was rewarded because Flight-Engineer Arthur Pritchard evaded capture. [/underlined]
The aircraft was on fire and perilously low when he bailed out and he made a heavy landing, spraining his ankle. After wondering around the French countryside with his damaged ankle and famously asking villagers for a way to the coast, he eventually arrived at the village of Egly and entered the local church. Seeing a man by the alter he told him that he was an injured RAF airman. The Frenchman was unable to speak English, but gave him some water and pointed towards a café opposite the church. On entering the café, Dad waving a 100 Franc note from his RAF kit, ordered champagne, as this was the only French word he knew. Panic broke out as
[Boxed] [Photograph of a Lancaster]
The first Lancaster bomber came off the production line at the beginning of 1942. It was designed by AVRO’s chief designer, Roy Chadwick. The plane started out as Avro Manchester, a twin engine model, but in anticipation of the greater range that Bomber Command would require as the RAF took the war to the German heartland, Chadwick modified the Manchester to house four engines. Apart from the engine changes, the Manchester design was so good it did not take much work to come up with the new model, renamed the Lancaster.
The plane came famous later of course following the well-documented Dambuster Raid, when 617 Squadron attacked the Eder and Ruhr dams. [/boxed]
[Page break]
[Boxed] 97 (Straits Settlements) Squadron,
Royal Air Force,
CONINGSBY,
Lincolnshire.
10th June, 1944.
Dear Mr. Pritchard,
It is with deep regret that I must confirm that your son, Sergeant A. Pritchard, failed to return from operations this morning, the 10th June, 1944, and I wish to express the great sympathy which this Squadron feel with you during the [indecipherable] any news comes through.
Your son was taking part in an operation against a military target and [indecipherable] France, Flight Engineer of the aircraft. No news has been received since the aircraft left base last night – we can only hope that they had the chance to bale out and are safe, even as prisoners of war.
Sergeant Pritchard had only been serving with this Squadron for a short while, but during that period he was able to operate with us on the opening of the Second Front. He had operated with another Squadron prior to coming here, and had taken part in fifteen sorties, many of which were against major objectives in Germany. On this occasion he was working with his usual crew. Your son was keen and capable as a flight engineer, and he and his crew will be a great loss to the Squadron; we shall all miss them very much.
It [indecipherable] to explain that the request in the telegram notifying you of this casualty was [indecipherable] your son’s chance of escape being prejudged by [indecipherable] he is still at large. This is not to say that any information about him is available, but us a precaution adopted in the case of all personnel reported missing.
His kit and personal effects are being carefully collected and will be sent to the R.A.F. Central Depository, Colebrook, Slough, from whom you will hear in due course.
If any news is received you will be communicated with immediately, and in the meantime I join with you in hoping that we shall soon hear favourable news of your son and the remainder of the crew.
Yours sincerely,
[Signature]
Squadron Leader, Commanding,
No. 97 (Straits Settlements)
[Underlined] Squadron, R.A.F. CONINGSBY. [/underlined]
Mr. A. Pritchard,
10, [indecipherable];
PORT [indecipherable]
N. Wales.
[/boxed]
[Boxed] On the left is the letter dated June 10, 1944, that Arthur and Hannah Mary Pritchard received from the RAF confirming that their son had not returned from his latest mission and stating that his loss and those of the crew would be very much missed. It goes on to say that he may be still at large but that no information about him was available.
It concludes by stating that if any favourable news about him was received that the RAF would communicate immediately with the family in Felinheli. [/boxed]
there were Germans in the village, and he was hastily ushered into a back room. A young teenage boy, who could speak a little English, was brought to the café, and Dad explained his plight and was then taken to a nearby wood where he was hidden overnight in a small air-raid-type shelter in the ground whilst his identity was being checked out.
Once the o.k. was received from London, the local leader of the French Resistance was summoned. Arthur Pritchard was put into the care of Monsieur George Dantan and his family who risked being shot if caught hiding a British airman. He was given civilian clothing; ID as a deaf and dumb Frenchman, and a bicycle. He was told that he was to be moved to a safe house in Antony, near Paris. His instructions were to follow the parcel tied to the back of Monsieur Dantan’s bicycle – but not necessarily follow Monsieur Dantan. On arriving at the safe house several hours later, Monsieur Dantan entered the building, and several minutes later came out and removed the parcel from the bicycle and re-entered the house. This was the signal for Das that it was safe for him to enter. When he did so, the two men embraced, – relieved to have reached their destination safely.
He evaded capture for over two months, being moved several times to safe houses, until the Liberation of Paris on August 24.
On the liberation of Paris his parents received another telegram, this time stating that my father had been found safe and well. On seeing him for the first time, as he came down the steps to his home in an emaciated state, my grandmother fainted with the shock and relief of his safe return.
Whilst in hiding he had many adventures and kept a diary, and his story is told in the book Achieve Your Aim by Kevin Bending, and in a book written in French by Georges Dantan Junior, the English version of which is available on the 97 Squadron Association’s website.
My father was unaware of the fate of his fellow-crew members and he was constantly worried over their safety. He would not be told that they had perished in the crash until his return home. The only Welshman in an Australian crew, he was inevitably called Taffy, and they did everything together – ate, slept, fought, drank and danced. It was a tremendous blow to him when he learned of their fate.
After he was repatriated to the UK, he was posted to RAF West Freugh in Scotland as an Air Traffic Controller. He left the RAF with the rank of Warrant Officer.
Arthur Pritchard met his future wife, Edna May Cardwell, from Liverpool, whilst both were stationed at RAF Waddington, and were married in December 1947 at Llanfairisgaer Church, just outside Y Felinheli. Both are interred in the churchyard there, Edna having predeceased him on October 10, 2001.
Loyal to his wartime crew he made several visits to their war graves, near to where they perished. He was always warmly welcomed by the Mayor and villagers near the crash site, and he always laid wreaths at the well-attended graves of his wartime “family”. On one occasion he was presented with parts from the Lancaster wreckage, including the cam-shaft. The French and Australian families kept in touch over the years and visited him at his home in Wales.
[Photograph of a man wearing medals] Arthur Pritchard (the civilian) in his latter days
In his latter years he took delight in visiting his former air bases in Lincolnshire and was always warmly welcomed by the RAF personnel. On one memorable visit he was privileged to go on board the Lancaster Bomber based at RAF Coningsby – for him an unforgettable experience.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
The Exploits of Warrant Officer Arthur Pritchard
Description
An account of the resource
A biography of Arthur Pritchard written by his daughter. It covers his training, operations and the night he was shot down. Despite speaking no French he was assisted to a hideout in Paris where he remained until Paris was liberated in August 1944.
Creator
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Carolyn Pritchard
Format
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Two printed sheets
Language
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eng
Type
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Text
Text. Memoir
Identifier
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MPritchard2206805-171108-030001, MPritchard2206805-171108-030002
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Spatial Coverage
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France--Paris
Great Britain
England--Liverpool
Wales--Y Felinheli
France--Étampes (Essonne)
France
England--Lancashire
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1944-06-09
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Contributor
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Anne-Marie Watson
463 Squadron
617 Squadron
97 Squadron
air gunner
aircrew
anti-aircraft fire
bale out
Chadwick, Roy (1893-1947)
crash
evading
final resting place
flight engineer
H2S
killed in action
Lancaster
Manchester
missing in action
navigator
Normandy campaign (6 June – 21 August 1944)
Pathfinders
pilot
prisoner of war
RAF Coningsby
RAF St Athan
RAF Waddington
RAF West Freugh
RAF Winthorpe
Resistance
shot down
Stalag Luft 7
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/501/22535/MCurnockRM1815605-171114-010.2.pdf
ceca0a67127007a05d837a67b8652f2f
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Curnock, Richard
Richard Murdock Curnock
R M Curnock
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Curnock, RM
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2016-04-18
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Description
An account of the resource
92 items. An oral history interview with Warrant Officer Richard Curnock (1924, 1915605 Royal Air Force), his log book, letters, photographs and prisoner of war magazines. He flew operations with 425 Squadron before being shot down and becoming a prisoner of war.
The collection has been licenced to the IBCC Digital Archive by Richard Curnock and catalogued by Barry Hunter.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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The Kriegie March 2007
Description
An account of the resource
The news-sheet of the RAF ex-POW Association. This edition covers the award of an OBE to the Association's President, the Prisoners of War memorial at Hendon, Trooping the Colour, the annual parade of the Air Cadets, a visit to RAF Cranwell, Lunches, the Long March Re-enacted, the retirement of Robbie Stewart, an obituary for Frank Harper, requests for lost friends, Book reviews, and Recco report on ex-POWs
Creator
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The RAF ex-POW Association
Date
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2007-03
Format
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16 printed sheets
Language
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eng
Type
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Text
Identifier
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MCurnockRM1815605-171114-010
Coverage
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Royal Australian Air Force
United States Army Air Force
Royal Canadian Air Force
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
England--London
England--Hampshire
England--High Wycombe
Germany--Hannover
Germany--Mannheim
Malta
Germany--Duisburg
Belgium--Antwerp
Belgium--Brussels
Germany--Luckenwalde
Poland--Żagań
North Africa
Libya--Banghāzī
Poland
Libya
Germany
Belgium
Germany--Ruhr (Region)
England--Buckinghamshire
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
102 Squadron
103 Squadron
138 Squadron
139 Squadron
150 Squadron
18 Squadron
207 Squadron
32 Squadron
50 Squadron
625 Squadron
7 Squadron
77 Squadron
78 Squadron
83 Squadron
9 Squadron
97 Squadron
air gunner
aircrew
Anson
Blenheim
bomb aimer
ditching
Dulag Luft
flight engineer
Halifax
Harris, Arthur Travers (1892-1984)
Hurricane
Ju 88
Lancaster
Me 109
memorial
mine laying
navigator
Pathfinders
pilot
prisoner of war
RAF Cosford
RAF Cranwell
RAF Halton
RAF Marham
RAF Northolt
RAF St Eval
RAF Wittering
Red Cross
Special Operations Executive
Stalag Luft 3
Stalag Luft 4
Stalag Luft 7
Stirling
the long march
Typhoon
Wellington
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/483/19134/BBullockWEJBullockWEJv1.2.pdf
c6610ae666cf526b25116a161780062b
Dublin Core
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Title
A name given to the resource
Bullock, William
William Edward James Bullock
W E J Bullock
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Identifier
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Bullock, WEJ
Description
An account of the resource
Two items. An oral history interview with Flight Lieutenant William Bullock (1916 - 2017, 566069 Royal Air Force) and a memoir. He served in Egypt and Iraq before serving as an engineering officer at RAF East Kirkby and Coningsby.
The collection has been licenced to the IBCC Digital Archive by William Bullock and catalogued by IBCC Digital Archive staff.
Transcribed document
A resource consisting primarily of words for reading.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
Bits & Pieces from a Long Career – William Edward James Bullock (Bill)
I joined the RAF on 6 September 1932 shortly before my 16th birthday, as a Halton Aircraft Apprenticeship, to be trained as an Aircraft Fitter. Training over, I was posted in July 1935 to No 13 Army Coop Squadron at Old Sarum, just north of Salisbury. No 16 AC Squadron, and the School of Army Coop, were also based there. Although we were closely linked to the Army, Sarum kept ship’s time. The times for changing the watch were rung on a big ship’s bell hanging outside the Guard Room. We even took a bell with us on joint manoeuvres with the Army. This was no doubt a legacy from the days of the Royal Naval Air Service, forerunner of the RFC and RAF.
I was posted to No 4 Flying Training School at Abu Sueir in Egypt in March 1937. This was a ‘desert station’ 12 miles west of Ismailia, a small town on the west bank of the Suez Canal. During my two and a half years there I enjoyed sand yacht racing, also sailing on Lake Timsah near Ismailia. I did the usual tourist sights – Cairo Museum housing all the King Tutankhamen exhibits etc, and out to Gizeh to see the Pyramids and Sphinx. I could not climb the 450-foot Great Pyramid of Cheops as a sand storm was blowing, but I spent time exploring inside.
With the threat of war looming, No 4 FTS was moved to Iraq to the big RAF base at Habbaniya, on the west bank of the River Euphrates, 55 miles west of Baghdad. From here I got to see the ruins of Babylon, Nebuchadnezzar’s Palace etc, and also the remains of The Hanging Gardens, one of the Seven Wonders of the World. For some time the Iraqi Government had been plotting with Germany to get the British out of Iraq and let in the Germans, especially promising them the Habbaniya base. This would have given Germany access to the oil supplies of Iraq and Iran, a crippling blow to the Allies. Negotiations and threats having failed to move us, the Iraqi Army moved up overnight on the 29 April 1941 and occupied the Plateau, a large 200 foot high ridge of ground less than a mile from the camp. An aerial survey on the 30 April showed that there were 27 field guns and howitzers trained down on the camp, supported by armoured cars and light tanks, assembled there with an estimated 2,000 troops, and more guns could be seen coming from Baghdad.
Meanwhile No 4 FTS had been busily converting its trainer aircraft to act as bombers. A mixture of 28 planes could carry 2x250lb bombs, and another 36 could carry just 8x20lb anti-personnel bombs. As we could only muster 39 pilots from all sources, including the Embassy in Baghdad, we could not deploy the full strength of our bombers at the same time. However we had the support of ten Wellington bombers operating from Shaibah, near Basra, 300 miles south, plus nine Gladiator single-seat fighters loaned to us, with pilots, from Egypt.
Our bombers took to the air at first light and circled the Plateau then, at precisely 5am on 2 May, started bombing. The Iraqi Army immediately started shelling the camp with all their guns, aiming mostly at the hangar area from where a lot of our planes operated. The rest of the planes were on the polo pitch, well dispersed and screened by trees. The RAF suffered heavy causalities that day, losing 22 aircraft and ten pilots, either killed or too seriously injured to fly, as the Iraqi Air Force had also attacked us, with their far superior aircraft.
We stopped our bombing operations at dusk, but the Iraqis kept up their shelling, continuing all through the night. Some estimated that we had a shell every minute from 8pm to 5am next day. So we bombed them heavily every day for the next four days, whilst they bombed and machine-gunned us daily, and continued to shell us day and night. On 6 May the Iraqi Army started to leave
1
[Page break]
the Plateau, thoroughly beaten and demoralised by our determined efforts, and we also hammered them well in their retreat.
Peace at last, we thought, but NO! There were a few isolated raids from the Iraqi Air Force for the next ten days then, on the 16 May, we were rather shaken to find that we were attacked by Heinkel 111 bombers and Messerschmitt 110 fighters from the German Luftwaffe. These had sneaked into Iraq and were based at Mosul, an ex-RAF station, 200 miles north of us. By then we had been loaned two long-range cannon-firing Hurricanes from Egypt, which could cope with the Luftwaffe. Once they followed the Luftwaffe back to Mosul after one of their raids, and caught them defenceless on the ground, destroying at least one and seriously damaging others. The Luftwaffe suffered various other mishaps and by 26 May they no longer posed a serious threat to us. We were at peace at last and the very crucial Battle of Habbaniya had been won, with No 4 FTS having played a very important part in it.
I was about due home, having completed my overseas tour, and eventually sailed from Basra on 17 June 1941, the start of what turned out to be a 17-week sea voyage.
We stopped and changed ships, having several days ashore at Bombay, Mombassa, Durham and Cape Town. At Cape Town I managed a trip to the tip of 3,500-foot Table Mountain, via a mile-long cable railway starting from a level area halfway up the mountain – with spectacular views from the top.
I finally arrived at Liverpool on 11 October 1941 and was posted to Cranwell, then on to Wigsley to a Lancaster Conversion Unit. I was commissioned as an Engineer Officer in July 1943 and after various courses finished up early in November as Technical Adjutant at East Kirkby. Here I was in charge of the Technical Library doing technical returns, reports and miscellaneous paper work. I was in charge of the Station workshops, power plant and propeller bays supporting two Lancaster Squadrons at East Kirkby, two at Spilsby and one at Strubby, with replacement engines and propellers. Units for overhaul or repair came back to me at Kirkby, from where I sent the engines to either Derby or Glasgow and propellers to Bolton, Lancashire for overhaul or repair.
Whilst at Kirkby I attended a Hunt Ball at Revesby Abbey where I met my future wife, Mary Brackenbury, a farmer’s daughter from Claxby Pluckacre. Mary was a Leading Firewoman in the Auxiliary Fire Service, on leave from her station at Seaford at the time.
After a year at East Kirkby I was moved to Metheringham as Engineer Office to No 106 Squadron and a hanger full of small single-engined [sic] planes used for navigation training – these were no bother at all and I could just leave their Flight Sergeant to deal with them.
No 106 Squadron had received some of No 617 Squadron’s ‘gutless wonders’. These were Lancasters with their big bomb-doors removed to accommodate Dr Barnes Wallis’s ‘bouncing bomb’ used in the Dam Busters’ Raid. They were very suitable for carrying the big sea mines, which No 106 dropped on their mine-laying ops off the German and Dutch coasts.
On 7 Janurary 1945, after two months’ hard work, I got my big move – posted to Coningsby as Engineer Officer to Nos 83 and 97 Pathfinder Squadrons and promoted to Flight Lieutenant. My job was to supervise the day-to-day servicing of the 40 odd Lancasters from the two Squadrons and ensure that they had whatever aircraft were needed for their ops. Occasionally the call was for ‘maximum effort’, which meant they needed all 40 Lancasters. I copied and always supplied what was needed, though it was a bit of a struggle at times. With the end of the war in Europe in May I
2
[Page break]
was eventually posted to Strubby where ‘Tiger Force’ was being assembled. This was a Lancaster Wing, scheduled to go to Okinawa, a Japanese island captured by the Americans. From here we were to bomb the Japanese mainland. My job was to supervise the repair of damaged aircraft and collect any which crashed on return from ops. With the surrender of Japan, Tiger Force was not needed, and I was posted at the end of August to a workshop’s unit 54 RU (Plant) of the Airfield Construction Service. Their job to service and repair Civil Engineering Equipment, such as bulldozers, excavators and suchlike required for building runways. The Wing was scheduled to go to Singapore four days after I arrived but, fortunately, an Advance Party went from 54 RU (Plant) and I was given 14 day’s leave.
Mary and I got a Marriage Licence from the office of the Bishop of Lincoln, allowing us to marry without waiting for Banns to be called in church. We were married in the tiny church at Wilksby on Wednesday 26 September, and on Saturday I was recalled from leave and the following Wednesday I embarked at Liverpool on a ship for Singapore. However we were disembarked at Bombay to wait for the next stage. A week or more later we proceeded on our final stage on the aircraft carrier HMS Venerable. Arriving at Singapore we were accommodated at Seletar, a flying boat base on the east of the island. Our workshop machinery had not arrived and after a couple of months at Seletar we were moved on, eventually settling on Changi Airfield, in tents, very near the temporary runway running out into the sea. This was covered in PSP – large sheets of perforated steel planking – which made a terrible rattling when anything landed or took off. On 3 July 1946 I was sent on a Junior Commander’s Course at Kandy, Ceylon, the last stage of the move being ten hours on a Sunderland flying-boat from Penang to Lake Kogala, in the south of Ceylon. Kandy was a small town, high up in the hills; the RAF unit was just a small training school with no aircraft facilities. Whilst I was there the ‘Perahera’ took place. This was a big religious festival, culminating in a long procession through the streets of Kandy. The procession was made up from the contingents from several temples, each contingent having a large group of priests, led by men cracking long whips, fire-eaters, dancers and a group of elephants. From our vantage point on a hotel balcony I counted over 70 elephants – quite a procession!
The entire procession was led by a sacred elephant from Kandy’s own ‘temple of the tooth’ – so called because it house a casket said to contain a tooth from Buddha. This sacred elephant, reputedly over 100 years old, was not allowed to walk barefoot on the road, so teams of men laid long, wide strips of white silk ahead of him to walk on.
My five-week course over, I moved down to Colombo, capital of Ceylon, and had several interesting days waiting for a ship back to Singapore, five very pleasant days, and much better than the Sunderland.
Arriving back at Changi, I found that with the completion of the runways at Tengah the Airfield Construction Wing was being disbanded. The big majority of the personnel were returning to the UK, and all the plant and transport was being transferred to Air Ministry Works Directorate- the civilian part of the RAF. I was given the job of supervising the rounding up and handing over of all this equipment. At the same time I was to prepare all the plant and equipment required to lay a permanent runway at Changi – the so-called Changi Runway Project.
At the same time, with the runways at Kai Tak (the RAF station on the Chinese mainland opposite Hong Kong) having been completed, their entire stock of plant and transport was to be shipped down to Singapore and the Construction Wing disbanded.
3
[Page Break]
I was given the job of getting everything collected and somehow hauling it out to Changi, 18 miles away. Our compound at Changi Point was on the sea edge, very near where a fresh water creek joined the sea. At some high tides a group of crocodiles would gather there, probably enjoying the fresh water. They were only 100 yards or so away, about eight or ten of them, up to around 16 feet long as far as we could estimate. They did not really bother us but one man, working in his boat, looked up to see a big crocodile steadily watching him, just a few feet away – he swore that it was as long as his boat – 16 feet and quite capable of taking a bite out of his boat to get at him. We were also paid a visit by a young five-footer, which swam up an open drain into the compound. We tried to fence him in with some tent floorboards but he smashed his way out, and back out to sea at top speed!
At this time the Air Ministry was settling its peacetime establishment of Engineers. The senior, older men were offered permanent commissions, the Air Ministry knowing that in a few years they would all be retiring. To us younger 25-30 year olds they would only offer short service commissions, giving time to sort out whom they wanted to keep. They offered me a short service commission, but back on aircraft, and refused to let me stay in airfield construction. I wanted a workshop’s job, so refused the offer and did things my way. I relinquished my War Emergency Commission, came home, had three months’ leave, and then rejoined [sic] ‘in the ranks’. I then changed trades – from aircraft fitter to general engineer – and spent the next 18 years a Warrant Officer in charge of various workshop units, at home and in Germany. I had a ‘Mentioned in Despatches’ from war service and, in my post war service, had three Commander in Chief’s Commendations, with cash awards for technical inventions and an AOC Commendation for Efficiency. To me, that justified the decision I had made regarding my career. I finally retired from the RAF in April 1966 and joined Horncastle RDC as a Clerical Officer.
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Title
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Bits and Pieces from a Long Career
Description
An account of the resource
Covers the period from joining as a Halton Apprentice in September 1932 for training as an Aircraft Fitter. Through the completion of his training and posting to 16 squadron, before being transferred to Egypt in 1937 and on to Iraq with No 4 Flying Training School. In April 1941 he was present at the Battle of Habbaniya when the Iraqi army and German Luftwaffe attempted to capture the base. On return to the United Kingdom he was commissioned as an Engineering Officer and served at East Kirkby, Metheringham, Coningsby and Strubby. Post war he was involved with airfield construction in the Far East. When the Air Ministry re-structured the post war RAF, he relinquished his wartime commission re-mustered to General Engineer and spent the next eighteen years running station workshops in the UK and Germany.
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Format
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Four typewritten sheets
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Text. Memoir
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
BBullockWEJBullockWEJv1
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Egypt
Great Britain
Iraq
England--Lincolnshire
Iraq--Mosul
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1937
1941
1943
1945
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
William Bullock
Conforms To
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Pending review
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Bradley Froggatt
106 Squadron
83 Squadron
97 Squadron
fitter airframe
ground crew
ground personnel
Pathfinders
RAF Coningsby
RAF East Kirkby
RAF Halton
RAF Metheringham
-
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Stephenson, Stuart
Stuart Stephenson MBE
S Stephenson
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Identifier
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Stephenson, S
Description
An account of the resource
20 items. An oral history interview with Stuart Stephenson MBE, Chairman of the Lincs-Lancaster Association, and issues of 5 Group News.
The collection was catalogued by Barry Hunter.
In accordance with the conditions stipulated by the donor, some items are available only at the International Bomber Command Centre / University of Lincoln.
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Transcribed document
A resource consisting primarily of words for reading.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
Copies sent to:
Stns. 9
S Th 10
B 6.
[Indecipherable] 2
Base 1
[Stamp] Base Copy.
V GROUP NEWS V
JUNE * 1944 * [deleted] SECRET [/deleted] * NO * 23
FOREWORD by A.O.C.
June has proved to be a month of record achievements. For the first time in its history the Group despatched 3,000 sorties of which a very high percentage were successful. Much of this success is due to the flare and marking teams who are now getting into their stride, and there has been a similar improvement in bombing. For the first time the average crew bombing error from 20,000 feet for the whole Group is below 200 yards. If the reduction of 50 yards which was achieved during June can be repeated during July, the number of bombs falling on the average target will be increased by something in the order of 50. This can be seen by looking at any P.R.U. photograph and counting the number of craters which are shown in open fields on either side of the target.
I therefore ask all crews to continue with their efforts to reduce bombing errors in the knowledge that by doing so they will add to the striking power of the Group to an extent which could be achieved by no other means. The new orders for maintenance which have recently been issued should help the Instrument Section, upon whom so much depends, to improve the serviceability of the sight, and eliminate minor inaccuracies.
On two occasions during the month the Group came up against the main strength of the German Night Fighter Defences, and on both occasions suffered serious losses; although over the whole month the missing rate was below the average for previous months. Nevertheless these instances show the vital importance of gunnery and the need for improving results by every means in our power.
There is ample evidence that the combined power of the rear and mid-upper turrets will bring down enemy fighters if the aim is correct. As an example, there is the case of “M” of 207 Squadron whose crew on the night of June 9/8th destroyed two JU. 88 and one ME.110. Although results such as this will always remain exceptional, it should be possible to improve the accuracy of aim over the present general standard. Fighters are now available in 1690 Flight for affiliation exercises and every chance must be taken whenever the weather is suitable especially at night. The bombing team has shown how greatly it can improve its results by methodical training and analysis and I now look to the gunnery team to do likewise. I will do everything in my power to provide them with means and facilities for training, but much is a matter for each gunner. Night vision, methodical search, aircraft recognition, turret manipulation, clearing stoppages, can only be improved by hard individual work.
The effort which the Group has put in during the month had been made possible by the high standards of serviceability which have been achieved, and I congratulate all ranks who have helped to get aircraft and equipment into the air. The Armament sections have loaded a record tonnage of bombs while all other sections on each station have contributed their full share to the success achieved.
Finally, I congratulate No. 51 Base on completing more than 8,000 hours of training and passing out a record number of crews. In particular I would mention No. 5 L.F.S. who completed a month’s flying with no avoidable flying accidents.
[Page break]
GUNNERY
[Underlined] BASE GUNNERY LEADERS [/underlined]
June has seen the establishment of a S/Ldr Air Gunner at each Base, and a list of the officers concerned is appended at the foot of this paragraph. Whilst these officers will be concerned with all Gunnery matters, their main functions is to improve the standard of training throughout the Group, as it has long been realised that with long periods of operations the Squadron Gunnery Leaders are fully occupied and can find little time for all the other aspects of Gunnery. The Base Gunnery Leaders will, therefore, be able to devote their time to improve training facilities and equipment, and to ensure that the equipment is available in sufficient quantity to ensure the maximum benefit being obtained from it. They will also be able to supervise the preparation of Gunners for Gunnery Leader, A.G.I. and Specialist Sighting Courses, to enable the candidates to have the best possible chance of passing these courses, thus avoiding wastage of valuable vacancies. The appointment of these Officers to S/Ldr posts offers more advancement for Gunnery Leaders, and is an indication that the importance of air gunnery is receiving recognition. We wish the officers concerned good luck in their new appointments, and hope that very shortly dividends will be paid by this new establishment.
51 BASE – S/LDR HIPKIN
52 BASE – F/LT McCURDY
53 BASE – F/LT BEALE
54 BASE F/LT HOWARD
55 BASE – F/LT BREAKEY
[Underlined] GUNNERY LEADERS’ MOVEMENTS [/underlined]
An error appeared in the Movement’s column for May, regarding 467 and 44 Squadrons, and is corrected below.
F/Lt Clarke ex 1660 Con. Unit to 44 Sqdn.
F/Lt Cleary ex 27 O.T.U. to 467 Sqdn.
Other movements are:-
S/Ldr Undery ex 1690 B.D.T.F. to H.Q. No. 5 Group.
F/Lt Cass, ex L.F.S. to 630 Sqdn.
[Underlined] COMBAT REPORTS [/underlined]
Considerable time is wasted in returning incorrect combat reports to Squadrons, through claims being made which do not conform to the standards laid down by Bomber Command, as issued to all Units. The Gunnery Leaders must ensure that information entered is correct in every detail and that all claims are submitted under one of the headings, i.e. “Destroyed”, “Probably Destroyed” or “Damaged”. Numerous incidents occur when information regarding Tail Warning Devices is incomplete, and it is emphasised that this is most important and must be included in combat reports. Combat reports could be forwarded to Headquarters 5 Group more quickly than at present; the standard pro-forma is now in general use and should help in the preparation of reports. Units should check that only this amended pro-forma is used for this purpose.
This Month’s Bag
[Cartoon]
[Underlined] DESTROYED [/underlined]
Sqdn. A/C Letter Date Type of E/A
207 “M” 7/8.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
207 “M” 7/8.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
207 “M” 7/8.6.44. ME. 410 (c)
630 “Y” 9/10.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
44 “O” 9/10.6.44. ME. 109 (c)
97 “D” 9/10.6.44. DO. 217 (c)
50 “U” 15/16.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
207 “F 21/22.6.44. ME. 109
57 “G” 24/25.6.44. ME. 109
57 “G” 24/25.6.44. JU. 88
97 “Q” 24/25.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
207 “B” 24/25.6.44. ME 109
[Underlined] PROBABLY DESTROYED [/underlined]
106 “G” 6/7.6.44. ME. 110 (c)
467 “X” 21/22.6.44. T/E.
[Underlined] DAMAGED [/underlined]
207 “J” 1.6.44. T/E (c)
57 “P” 1.6.44. JU. 88
50 “D” 6.6.44. ME. 410
9 “O” 6/7.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
630 “O” 6/7.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
630 “V” 9/10.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
97 “Q” 9/10.6.44. JU. 88 (c)
106 “F” 14/15.6.44. FW. 190 (c)
207 “D” 24/25.6.44. ME. 109
Claims annotated (c) have been confirmed by Headquarters, Bomber Command.
[Underlined] ODD JOTTINGS [/underlined]
A new type of two-piece flying suit is on trial in 53 Base, and the results will, in due course, be made available.
Replies have been received from all Units in the use of the Pilot type parachute for rear gunners and recommendations forwarded to H.Q. Bomber Command. With slight modification to the turret, this idea seems feasible, but may call for a revision in the type of clothing to be worn.
Ampro projectors are appearing in operational units for assessing Cine Gyro films. The establishment is one per station.
Units are again reminded that filters suitable for the Shadowgraph and 16 m.m. projector for use in night vision training are available. When requesting an issue of these filters from H.Q. 5 Group, units are to confirm that they have a [underlined] fully [/underlined] blacked out room for night vision training.
CLAY PIGEON SHOOTING
Instructions have now been issued to all Stations to construct a sandbag traphouse for clay pigeon shooting, and full details given for the layout of the range. Severn P.F.O’s are attending the Instructor’s Course on the 7th July, and the remainder on the 23rd July; these instructors will pass on to Unit Gunnery Leaders instructions for these practices, to ensure that at least two officers are available for conducting the exercises. Gunnery Leaders should press for the construction of the traphouses and ensure that all equipment is overhauled and ready for use.
AIR TRAINING CARRIED OUT IN CONVERSION UNITS AND SQUADRONS DURING JUNE.
[Table of Fighter Affiliation and Air Firing Exercises by Squadron]
Fighter Affiliation Grand Total = 1493
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 2
[Page break]
AIR BOMBING
[Underlined] ATTACKS ON LIMOGES MARSHALLING YARDS [/underlined]
1,424 bombs were dropped. Of this total 844 craters have been counted on the P.R.U. photographs. We can therefore only consider 59% of the total number of bombs dropped.
The M.P.I. of all craters was established and a circle of radius 150 yards was drawn. Inside this circle the number of craters that could be counted totalled 152 and the remaining 692 craters were counted outside the circle. Therefore the Pilot and Air Bomber’s error for 692 bombs was greater than 150 yds.
With our 152 bombs inside the 150 yards circle we achieved 10 hits per acre and if we assume that of the bombs not counted, we obtained the same percentage inside 150 yards our hits per acre would increase to 17.
There were 211 bombs between the 150 yards and 250 yards circles. The maximum errors permissible for these bombs to get them into the 150 yards circle are:-
125 yards – average line error
160 yards – average range error
We all agree that these limits are reasonable and that crews should not have errors in excess.
Now, if the bombs had been contained in the limits of 125 yards line and 160 yds. range, our resultant average radial error about the M.P.I. would be 175 yards. This would mean that instead of sending the 96 aircraft to Limoges that we had to, we need only have sent 59 aircraft to achieve the same number of hits. We would then have had 37 aircraft free to attack the factory at ??? There were, of course, 330 bombs seen outside the 250 yards circle and great effort must be made to eliminate the errors that were responsible.
The Moral! – You must practice, practice and practice until you are a certain “A” category crew.
!!! [Underlined] CREW CATEGORISATION [/underlined] !!!
A+ Crews – 60 yards or less
A Crews – 100 yards or less
B Crews – 100 yds. to 150 yds.
C Crews – 150 yds. to 200 yds.
D Crews – Over 200 yards.
[Underlined] RESULTS [/underlined]
[Table of Crew Categories by Base]
[Underlined] “GEN” FROM THE BOMBING RANGES [/underlined]
[Underlined] EPPERSTONE: [/underlined] Plotted 1597 bombs aimed by 309 aircraft.
[Underlined] OWTHORPE: [/underlined] Plotted 1510 bombs aimed by 319 aircraft.
[Underlined] WAINFLEET: [/underlined] Plotted 2056 bombs aimed by 440 aircraft.
HIGH LEVEL BOMBING TRAINING
[Table of High Level Bombing Training Statistics by Squadron and Conversion Unit]
THE BEST RESULTS FOR JUNE
In the April “News” it was threatened that owing to the improvement in Crew Errors, it may be necessary to lower the qualifying figure for the inclusion of errors in this column. June has produced the largest number of below 100 yards errors yet, and in consequence only those crews who have obtained crew errors of 80 yards or less, converted to 20,000 ft. can receive publicity.
Squadron or Con. Unit. Pilot Air Bomber Navigator Error at 20,000 feet.
9 F/O Blackham F/O Elphick F/O Wenger 72 yards
44 F/L White Sgt Jenkins F/S Jones 66 yards
P/O Baxter W/O Young W/O Rutherford 50 yards
P/O Stewart Sgt Stubbs Sgt Wright 65 yards
49 P/O Appleyard F/S Jameson F/S Blumfield 78 yards
P/O Arnold F/O Dewar W/O Fleming 72 yards
57 F/S Clark Sgt Johnson Sgt Lugg 65 yards
83 P/O Meggeson W/O Franklin F/O Wicker 65 yards
F/O Kelly F/O Irwin Sgt Burleigh 58 & 64 yards
97 F/L Van Raalte F/O Arnold F/S Williams 52, 69 & 78 yards
S/L Ingham F/O Perkins F/L Chatten 69 yards
467 P/O Waugh F/S Southgate F/O Semple 67 yards
F/L Brine F/S Luton F/S Sutton 80 yards
617 P/O Duffy F/O Woods F/O Bell 42 yards
F/O Knights P/O Bell F/O Rhude 48 yards
P/O Jingles F/S Hazell F/O Beal 63 yards
619 P/O Johnson Sgt Vaughton F/S Tranter 79 yards
F/L Howes F/O Baker F/L Harrison 74 yards
1654 C.U. F/S Beharrie Sgt Dean Sgt Brownhall 74 yards
F/S McKechnie F/S Wallace Sgt Little 53 yards
1660 C.U. P/O Dyer F/S Howard F/S Lemaire 74 yards
F/S Millar F/O Banks W/O Wilday 70 yards
1661 C.U. F/O Franks F/O Orry Sgt Roe 78 yards
F/O Furber Sgt Le Marquand F/O Hassel 78 yards
5 L.F.S. S/L Smith Sgt Wallis Sgt Page 49 yards
F/O Edwards F/S Wallace F/O Nunn 54 yards
Congratulations to F/L Van Raalte and crew, 97 Squadron for the outstanding 3 exercises!!!
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 3
[Page break]
AIR BOMBING (CONTD.)
[Underlined] “GEN” FROM THE SQUADRONS [/underlined]
[Underlined] 50 Squadron (F/Lt Hearn, D.F.C) [/underlined] report that to try and reduce bombing errors to a minimum a system of practice bomb plotting on small perspex covered boards is being inaugurated. The errors will be plotted on this board and the reason explained verbally to the Air Bomber, Captain and Navigator. In case of suspected instrument error the Bombing Section will examine the results plotted with the Instrument Section.
[Underlined] 57 Squadron (F/L Keats) [/underlined] report that a modification to permit the emergency jettisoning of smaller H.E. bombs only when a mixed load of 4,000 H.C. and other H.E. bombs is carried has been suggested by an Air Bomber and submitted for approval. An isolation switch would be incorporated in the circuit between the Connell Pre-Selector and No. 13 Station. This switch would be permanently wired down except when the special load of 4,000 H.C. and other H.E. bombs is carried, in which case it would be left up for take-off and put down by the crew when a height of 4,000 feet is reached. In the event of engine failure at take-off, the pilot could jettison the smaller H.E. bombs safe with the jettison toggle instead of the normal jettisoning of containers by Type H Jettison.
[Underlined] 52 Base [/underlined] report that [underlined] 12 [/underlined] aircraft took off between [underlined] 08.30 hours and 09.30 hours [/underlined] on 4th July to carry out High Level Practice Bombing. Early morning details can be sure of the best bombing weather!!
[Underlined] 106 Squadron (F/L Morgan) [/underlined] report the following outstanding exercise:-
Pilot:- F/O Meredith
Air Bomber:- F/O Mitchell.
As the port outer engine had to be feathered before completion of the cross country, bombing was carried out on only three engines. As Gee was thus u/s and as petrol was running short, no wind was found, but the wind velocity found on the last leg of the cross country was used for bombing. This wind velocity was found at 18,000 feet, whereas the bombing was carried out at 14,000 feet owing to having only three engines. Thus a fairly large vector error of 214 yards (Converted to 20,000 feet) resulted, but the bomb aimer’s error was only 16 yards at 14,000 feet, which is an error of 19 yards when converted to 20,000 feet.
[Underlined] BOMBING LEADERS’ CORNER [/underlined]
Bombing Leaders in 54 Base are:-
83 Squadron – F/L Bedell
97 Squadron – F/L Rogers, D.F.C.
627 Squadron – F/L Mitchell
[Underlined] F/L Harris, D.F.C. [/underlined] has arrived from H.Q. 6 Group to take over Bombing Leader duties at No. 5 L.F.S. Syerston.
[Underlined] F/L Honnibal [/underlined] (ex 92 Group) has succeeded F/L Keats as Bombing Leader to 57 Squadron.
[Underlined] F/L Keats [/underlined] (57 Squadron) has moved to H Q 92 Group.
[Underlined] BOMBING LEADERS’ COURSES [/underlined]
F/O Clegg (44 Squadron), F/S. Booth (619 Squadron) and F/O Linnett (207 Squadron) obtained “B” Categories on No. 84 Course and F/O Nugent (61 Squadron) obtained “B” Category on No. 85 Course.
[Underlined] SQUADRON BOMBING COMPETITION [/underlined]
The month of June was notorious for bad weather, numerous operations and stand-by’s. Hence the competition entries were fewer in number than of late. It has been decided to include the Conversion Units in the Competition under the same rules as for the Squadrons. It is realised, however, that they have an advantage over Squadrons in so far as they have considerably more qualifying entries from which to make selection. However it is hoped that squadrons will make determined efforts to beat the Conversion Units in July. Out [sic] congratulations are extended to 51 Base for their high standard, and their commanding positions in this, their first entry!!
PILOT AND AIR BOMBER’S ERROR AT 20,000 FEET
1st 1654 C.U. – 60 yards
2nd 619 Squadron – 62 yards
3rd 1660 C.U. – 68 yards
4th 1661 C.U. – 69 yards
5th 44 Squadron – 70 yards
6th 467 Squadron – 78 yards
7th 5 L.F.S. – 83 yards
8th 49 Squadron – 85 yards
9th 83 Squadron – 90 yards
10th 9 Squadron – 92 yards
11th (630 Squadron- 96 yards
(106 Squadron 96 yards
13th 463 Squadron- 107 yards
14th 97 Squadron – 109 yards
15th 207 Squadron – 116 yards
16th 57 Squadron – 124 yards
Non-qualifying Squadrons:-
17th 50 Squadron (6 exercises)- 106 yards
18th 61 Squadron (3 exercises)- 91 yards
[Underlined] BOMBING LEADER COMPETITION [/underlined]
F/Lt Walmsley, D.F.C. – 52 Base – 76 yards
[Underlined] BIGCHIEF COMPETITION [/underlined]
G/Capt Johnson, D.F.C., A.F.C. – 88 yards
(R.A.F. Station, Syerston)
[Underlined] ? ? AIR BOMBERS’ QUIZ ? ? [/underlined]
1. What can cause an apparent Vector error in practice bombing?
2. List the possible causes of Large Random Errors.
3. What errors in practice bombing will be caused by low suction?
4. If you set the wrong T. V. what kind of error will you get?
[Underlined] MARK XIV BOMBSIGHT – DO’S AND DON’T’S [/underlined]
DO:- (i) set Bomb T.V. (the TV’s of all bombs likely to be dropped should be recorded on the levelling card on the top right-hand corner of the computor).
(ii) Set Target height against Q.F.E. ([underlined] SEA LEVEL PRESSURE [/underlined]).
(iii) Set [underlined] INDICATED [/underlined] Wind Speed because Bombsight Computor works on Indicated Air Speed and indicated height (indicated wind can be found from true wind by SUBTRACTING 1.5% per 1000 ft of height).
(iv) Synchronise bombsight compass with Pilot’s D.R. repeater (by pressing in and turning the synchronising knob on the side of the Computor box.)
(v) Check that sufficient suction is reaching the bombsight gyros.
(vi) Remember to turn on air supply to the bombsight by means of the Bombsight Cock.
(vii) Be sure that the Pilot puts main control cock of “George” to OUT when Bombsight is to be used, or no compressed air will be available.
(viii) Keep the bombsight clean and check all the loads are correctly attached.
(ix) Liaise with the Instrument Section who maintenance [sic] your bombsight.
DON’T (i) Use the Emergency Computor until you have checked the bombsight and tried to correct the fault.
(ii)Touch the reflector glass of the Sighting Head when the gyro is running (the gyro is always running when the engines are running).
(iii) Forget to adjust the levelling scales for the all-up weight. (The Flight Engineer will know the A.U.W.).
(iv) Put any pressure on the reflector glass – even the edge of a map may lead to the toppling of the gyro when the engines are running.
(v) Let anything, not even your oxygen mask, press on the Sighting Head. (The upper part is supported on anti-vibration mountings which prevent the bearings of the gyro being damaged – the least pressure can make the alignment inaccurate).
(vi) Stow parachute, window, etc. near any of the leads to the Computor Box or Sighting Head.
(vii) Forget to liaise with the bombsight maintenance staff.
[Underlined] OPERATIONS (Continued from back page) [/underlined]
were daylight attacks) with varying degrees of success. Notable among these attacks were the operations in daylight against WATTEN and SIRACOURT on the 19th and 25th respectively. In both cases direct hits are claimed on the launching ramps involving damage which, it is hoped, will put them out of -commission at least temporarily.
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 4
[Page break]
NAVIGATION
No long range sorties have been carried out during the month; in fact almost all the targets have been in Gee range. No Navigational difficulties therefore have been experienced. Broadcast winds have not been attempted during the month because of shallow penetration.
One major navigational “boob” was, however made during the month by a Navigator of No. 106 Squadron. The aircraft was detailed to attack a Ruhr target, and reached the enemy coast on track and on time. The Navigator then gave the next course to the pilot who in error steered 100° different from that given him. The Navigator was at fault in not checking the course with the pilot. The aircraft continued on the wrong course for six minutes until a Gee fix was obtained. The sortie was eventually abandoned because of the time element. This is another example of what can happen if you do not carry out the correct drills. Immediately the pilot says “on course” make it your first duty to check the true course steered.
[Underlined] ANALYSIS OF WIND FINDING. [/underlined]
During the month an analysis of errors which may arise in windfinding has produced the following probable error:-
Probable Error
(i) Inability to read A.P.I. to nearest half minute of Lat. and Long. 1 mile
(ii) Inability to plot a position in Lat. and Long. accurately (e.g. Air Position and Gee fix) 1/2 mile (at least)
(iii) Inherent error in H2S fixes of at least half a mile. 1/2 mile
(iv) Inability to plot an H2S fix to within 1/2 mile because of mile scale limitations on chart 1/2 mile
(v) Probable error in synchronising of D.R. compass repeaters when airborne. 1 mile
(vi) Error in Compass swing of at least 1°. 1 mile
(vii) Probable error in measuring off length of wind vector, because of mile scale limitations, on chart. 1/2 mile
[Underlined] Total [/underlined] 5
Therefore if a wind was found over a period of 15 minutes it would be possible to obtain an error of 20 m.p.h!! Fortunately, of course, some of the errors will cancel out, but even then there will always be a residue which, multiplied by four, may still give a large error.
It will be noticed that careless errors in taking of Gee and H2S fixes, reading off A.P.I. co-ordinates, incorrect plotting etc. have not been mentioned.
The problem now is, how can we eliminate the above errors. Action has already been taken to eliminate points (iv) and (vii). Station and Squadron Navigation Officers are urged to discuss the above list with all Navigators on the Squadron, and submit any suggestions to Group Headquarters immediately.
Don’t be afraid to give us all your suggestions. Remember, the more accurate w/v’s we obtain, the more accurate the bombing, concentration and timing.
Referring back to careless errors, by far the largest of these are plotting and computing errors. A list of exercises to improve plotting and computation was forwarded to each S.N.O. some weeks ago. It is the responsibility of each S.N.O. to see that these exercises are completed at regular intervals. Short computation tests, lasting 15 – 20 minutes should be completed every morning if this is possible. There is always a spare half hour between assembly at the flights and commencing N.F.T’s. The plotting tests should be carried out at least once every fortnight, particular stress being laid on wind finding. Make it a point always that the tests are analysed immediately after completion, and the results made known as soon as possible.
Many Squadrons have adopted the above procedure, and are being well repaid. There are still one or two Squadron Navigation Officers, however, who say they are too busy to do such things. Don’t let this be your excuse – try it conscientiously and well for the next fortnight, and note the improvement in the work of your Navigator.
[Underlined] AIR POSITION INDICATOR [/underlined]
All Navigators will now be conversant with the resetting modification fitted during the past months. It is hoped that maximum use is being made of this device, which should considerably simplify resetting.
Yet another modification to simplify resetting has been suggested by the Navigation Staff at Syerston. It is the fitting of a “winder handle” to the resetting knob. Only one handle need be used when resetting and, much more important, the time taken to reset will be reduced by at least 2/3rds. The above modification has been submitted to Bomber Command for approval, and as soon as this is obtained, all aircraft will be modified.
Several Squadrons have been persevering with the graphical resetting procedure, but this has not proved very successful. When the modification suggested by Syerston has been fitted to all aircraft, all objections against resetting regularly will have been overcome, and it will be possible to adopt the standard procedure of resetting the A.P.I. regularly.
[Underlined] NAVIGATION TECHNIQUE [/underlined]
During the summer months it is hoped we may further the Navigation technique to such an extent that Navigation will be considerably simplified during the winter period. We must aim for simplification and standardisation in use of A.P.I., H2S and log and chart keeping. This will be of considerable benefit to the Conversion Units. At the present time a Navigator is taught one method at the Conversion Unit and another on the Squadron – consequently he is proficient at neither. Ideas are being collected from Squadrons and it is hoped to present to Squadrons and Conversion Units the ideal Navigation technique. Let us have your suggestions.
[Underlined] PRACTICE BOMBING WINDS [/underlined]
The results of the drive on practice bombing and wind finding have, on the whole, been satisfactory – but in certain cases they have been disappointing. The Conversion Unit Navigators have surpassed many operational Navigators. A vector error of less than 5 m.p.h. should be your aim.
Improvements have been made during the last 7 or 8 weeks, and the average vector error produced this month is 7 3/4 m.p.h. – a commendable effort on the whole but there is still room for improvement.
It was stated in last month’s News that a monthly Bombing Wind Finding Competition would be held. It was the intention to publish the best eight vector errors for the month, but so far there have been 14 instances where NIL vector error was obtained and a further 14 instances of vector errors of 2 m.p.h. and below! It has therefore been decided to issue the AVERAGE vector error obtained by each Squadron and Conversion Unit for the month. The order is as follows:-
[Table of Average Vector Error by Squadron]
[Underlined] Average Error: [/underlined] Squadrons – 7 m.p.h.
Con. Units – 8 m.p.h.
It will be noted that only one Squadron has achieved the ideal, i.e. a mean vector error of 5 m.p.h.
[Underlined] UNION NEWS [/underlined]
S/Ldr Day, D.F.C. Base Nav. Officer, Scampton to Ops.II H.Q. 5 Group.
S/Ldr Mould, D.F.C. S.N.O. Dunholme to Base Nav. Officer, Scampton.
F/Lt. Bray, D.F.C. 207 Sqdn. to S.N.O. Dunholme.
F/Lt. Woodhouse, D.F.M. 44 Squadron Nav. Officer reported missing.
F/Lt. Craven 50 Squadron Nav. Officer reported missing.
F/Lt. R. Adams, D.F.C. 630 Squadron Nav. Officer reported missing.
F/Lt. Lascelles, D.F.C. 1654 C.U. Navigation Leader to be Squadron Nav. Officer No. 50 Squadron.
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 5
[Page break]
ARMAMENT
[Underlined] A RECORD MONTH [/underlined]
The month of June produced two new records when a total of 3000 sorties was flown, resulting in 11,708 tons of bombs dropped on enemy territory, an increase of 3,000 tons over our previous record in May. All armament personnel can be justifiably proud of their contribution, particularly as this phenomenal tonnage represents only a fraction of the tonnage actually handled during the month.
[Underlined] ELECTRICAL BOMBING GEAR [/underlined]
One drop of water in the wrong place may result in several thousands of pounds of high explosive failing to reach the target – a startling yet true statement. Bad weather has necessitated leaving aircraft bombed up for several consecutive days, and as no aircraft can be guaranteed waterproof, it is quite possible that some of our recent “summer weather” has seeped into the bombing circuit.
All Armament Officers are reminded if the correct procedure to be carried out when aircraft are left bombed up after the cancellation of operations, and a quick reference to Air Staff Instructions would not be amiss at this stage. Are your electrical circuits tested each day, and do you always remove pyrotechnics from the aircraft immediately after the cancellation? Check up on these and all other relevant points, and ensure that the [underlined] full [/underlined] load reaches its destination, and not just a small fraction of it.
[Underlined] ARMAMENT BULLETIN [/underlined]
The Bomber Command Armament Bulletin for June has now arrived and contains some very interesting and useful information, particularly the suggestions made for improving the condition of bomb dumps in general. Page 9 of the Bulletin refers to the difficulties encountered in the storage of cluster projectiles and introduces a new type of tracking which is intended form a temporary hard standing in bomb dumps which have no suitable storage space for this particular weapon. Supplies of this Summerville tracking have already arrived at some stations in the Group and although it is, as yet, too early to express an opinion as to the efficiency of this equipment, it is considered that it will prove to be a very great asset.
FAILURES TABLE
[Table of Armament Failures by Types and Squadron]
A= MANIPULATION B = MAINTENANCE C = ICING
D = TECHNICAL E = ELECTRICAL F = OBSCURE
[Underlined] GUN FREEZING [/underlined]
Although the immediate danger of gun failures due to freezing has now passed, the problem of preventing such failures is still being very carefully investigated, and to assist in this investigation samples of hydraulic fluids have been taken from gun turret systems of operational aircraft for analysis by the Ministry of Aircraft Production.
A [indecipherable] of water in suspension in hydraulic fluid is sufficient to cause the oil to freeze at a considerably higher temperature, and consequently the importance of ensuring that oil containers used to fill gun turret systems are free from water, cannot be too strongly stressed. Results of this analysis will be forwarded to all Bases and Stations when received. We hope that they will be negative.
[Underlined] AMMUNITION [/underlined]
The repeated changing of ammunition from night to daylight sequence results in all ammunition bolts being handled several times a week. If ammunition is transported in suitable containers and handled carefully when being loaded into the aircraft, no misalignment should occur.
The necessity for ensuring that only correctly aligned ammunition is loaded into gun turrets should be brought to the attention of all armourers and air gunners.
NAVIGATION TRAINING
The emphasis during the past month has been on wind finding for practice bombing, and we are pleased to say that Navigators on the Training Base have risen to the occasion and produced excellent results. The most notable performances have come from Winthorpe, where seven Navigators obtained a Nil vector error. This drive on wind finding has created a desire to find equally correct winds during Navigational exercises. The result has been a big improvement in track keeping and timing.
From time to time improvements on the A.P.I. are suggested. The latest suggestion comes from F/O Richardson of No.5 L.F.S., who has suggested a modification to facilitate re-setting. This modification, if adopted, will reduce the time taken to reset the A.P.I. by at least 2/3rds. Good work Syerston!
H2S training is getting into its stride at Wigsley, and 1/3rd of each course is now being trained. Only one trainer is available at Wigsley at the moment, but as soon as the second trainer arrives it is the intention to train 50% of all crews. Winthorpe and Swinderby Conversion Units are already training half their inputs. Pupils are receiving approximately 14 hours air training, and at least 20 hours ground training. When more aircraft are available it will be the policy to train more crews rather than increase the number of flying hours per pupil.
Bullseye exercises have been seriously interrupted by bad weather, but 10 and 12 Groups have co-operated to the maximum extent on every possible occasion, and several good exercises have been completed.
[Underlined] THIS MONTH’S “OVER KEENNESS” [/underlined]
A Navigator on a cross country flight who was endeavouring to work the Swinderby system of obtaining six minute fixes and winds, experienced Gee failure. He immediately instructed his W/Operator to obtain a M/F fix every six minutes. The W/Op. found the ether rather congested, so he attempted priority fixes – much to the concern of the M/F Section, R.O.C, 5 Group and No. 51 Base!
Public Relations
Public Relations work during June has been rather confused owing to the altered nature of the Command’s operations, and the uncertainty of many circumstances. Only a few reports were issued to the press at any length by the Air Ministry News Service.
Three war correspondents have flown in Group aircraft on operations: Mr. Ronald Walker, of the “News Chronicle” who went over Caen with S/Ldr. Fairburn of 57 Squadron on June 12/13; Mr. R.J. Kiek, of the Netherlands Press Agency, who flew over a French target with his countryman, F/O Overgaadu of No. 207 Squadron, on June 16/17; and Mr. Kent Stephenson, B.B.C. War Reporter, who unfortunately failed to return with W/Cdr. Crocker of No. 49 Squadron on June 21/22.
(Continued in Column 2)
(Continued from Column 3)
Three parties came to our stations: June 1st, Dunholme, Mrs. Billingham (Reuters), Miss Tredgold (South African Argus) and Mr. Fletcher (Sport and General Press Agency Photographer) for the visit of the Prime Minister of Southern Rhodesia: June 17th, Waddington, Mr. W. Farmer, of the “Melbourne Herald”; and June 22nd, Waddington, Mr. Wilkins and Miss Elizabeth Riddell (journalists) and Mr. J. Warburton (Sport and General photographer), for the visit of the Duke of Gloucester.
A party of employees of the Firma Chrome Plating Co., of Sheffield, visited the Sheffield Squadron (No.49) on June 3rd.
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944.
[Page break]
SIGNALS
[Underlined] WIRELESS OPERATORS (AIR) [/underlined]
June was quite a fair month from the aircraft signals point of view, but improvement can and must be made. It is hoped every endeavour will be made by Signals Leaders to raise the standard of Aircrew Signals operating to a high state of efficiency.
Have all Signals Leaders read and digested 5 Group Signals Instruction No. 13, and acquainted all their operators with its contents?
This instruction lays down the requirements for W/T Control Operators. Endeavour should be made to bring every Operator up to the standard required. Two Squadrons have already carried out air tests with quite satisfactory results. One important point – once an operator reaches the standard required, he must, by constant practice maintain that standard, and to ensure that he does, he may be required to do an air test with Group at any time, without previous warning.
[Underlined] DAILY INSPECTIONS. [/underlined]
Signals Leaders, do you ever take a quick run out to your aircraft and check over the “Daily” done by your W/Ops?
An aircraft of this Group took off on Ops one night, was only airborne a short time when the intercom. failed. Cause – faulty 2v 20 Acc! The W/Op did not carry out the correct drill for the use of emergency intercom. as laid down in 5 Group Aircraft Drill No.11, Appendix “A”. Result – one early return and one load of bombs the Hun did not receive. Was this the only dud 2v 20 Acc. airborne that night? Or was he the unfortunate W/Op. who, through his lack of knowledge or carelessness in carrying out his emergency drill, was found out? We wonder!! It would be worthwhile checking up on these accs. in the aircraft. Yes, there was a lot of truth in the film “BOOMERANG” !
The new Wireless Operators (Air) log has now gone to the printing press and should be available for issue very soon. We hope to see some very neat and fully detailed logs returned, just to show your appreciation.
[Underlined] GOOD SHOWS [/underlined]
This month’s Good Show comes from 57 Squadron, by an operator who showed coolness and initiative in fixing up his broken dinghy aerial (fixed) and operating his dinghy radio, thus enabling the rescue aircraft to “home” on his signal.
The aerial mast was broken while erecting, and the operator fixed his aerial lead into the aerial part while other members of the crew took turns at holding the aerial aloft, by the insulated part which separates the aerial from mast.
This is an excellent example of cool and intelligent thinking under very difficult circumstances.
[Underlined] EARLY WARNING DEVICES [/underlined]
The co-operation of W/Op. and Gunner reporting on unserviceability of Early Warning Devices is improving, but there are still the few cases of discrepancy appearing in these E.W.D. reports and Combat reports. Just a little more drive in this direction will eradicate this, so Signals Leaders and Radar Interrogators, do your stuff.
Manipulation failures are still occurring, mostly due to lack of experience, and every effort must be made to eliminate them. Efforts are being made for every Squadron to have one Early Warning Device Instructor, and quite a few Squadrons have them already. Signals Leaders, get your W/Ops over to them for that little extra instruction which means all the difference between failure and serviceability of your E.W.D. and sends your Squadron percentage of serviceability soaring.
The cards, depicting combats on Monica, sent from this Group to Headquarters Bomber Command, are now in the process of being reproduced and will soon be available for issue to Squadrons and Conversion Units.
[Underlined] GROUP W/T EXERCISE [/underlined]
The alteration to the time of the Group W/T exercise has met with universal approval from all Squadrons, and there has been some good operating. The reallocation of Squadrons to Sections 1 and 2 should also help to make the exercise more interesting by eliminating the possibility of any two transmitters “blotting out” each other due to their close proximity.
[Underlined] VALETE ET SALVETE [/underlined]
Our heartiest congratulations to W/Cdr. Skinner on his promotion and his appointment as Officer Commanding No. 14 Radio School. We wish him every success in his new sphere.
Our congratulations also go to S/Ldr. Andrews on his appointment as Signals Leader, 92 Group.
Five Group are poorer by two very popular officers.
44 Squadron will welcome F/O Hughes (a former 44 Sqdn. W/Op) as Signals Leader.
[Underlined] W/T FAILURES [/underlined]
The W/T failures percentage against total operational sorties has shown a great decrease during the month. There were 27 failures reported out of 3,000 sorties – the percentage being 0.9, the lowest figure for many months. The maintenance personnel are to be commended for repeating last month’s record of zero maintenance failures. Out of this enormous number of sorties, only two aircraft returned early as a result of signals defects. The number of component failures (equipment) was 14. Surprisingly enough, not one condenser or resistor defect was reported; R. 1155 output valves again proved troublesome.
[Underlined] V.H.F. FITTING [/underlined]
At the time of going to press, 200 aircraft are fitted with V.H.F. equipment. The speed of fitting has placed us well ahead of schedule. Units are reporting that they are receiving a considerable number of crystals which on test have been found inactive. R.A.E., Farnborough, have evolved a modification (R.T.I.M. No.629) employing a choke unit type 45, which, in A. D. G. B. aircraft has proved quite successful. When the choke units become available, units will be notified.
[Underlined] MANDREL [/underlined]
There are two main reasons why the total number of Mandrel fitted aircraft in this Group has fallen. They are (a) supplies of Col.9 not forthcoming, and (b) large scale V.H.F. fitting drive, which has absorbed all available Signals manpower in the squadrons. It is emphasised, however, that squadrons must ensure that all their complete Mandrels are fitted as soon as possible. The Countermeasure Party is still available at Group Headquarters in readiness to offer assistance.
[Underlined] CARPET II [/underlined]
Contrary to many beliefs, Carpet II is in no way connected with Persian Markets. It is, however, a new radio countermeasure device fitted to the Illuminating Force aircraft of this Group. It is quite popular with the C.S.O!
[Underlined] RADAR [/underlined]
Base Signals and Radar Officers attended a conference at Group Headquarters on 16th June, to discuss the Bomber Command proposed establishment of Radar personnel. After considerable discussion and divergence of opinion the proposals were accepted. Some alterations were suggested in connection with accommodation and holdings of spare equipment, and these were forwarded to Bomber Command. It is understood that the proposals are now being considered by the Establishment Branch at Bomber Command.
[Underlined] BOOZER [/underlined]
Sufficient Boozer equipment became available during the month to enable fitting to proceed in our two Boozer squadrons. As this equipment is in very short supply, every effort must be made to make immediate use of all that is available. Test equipment is at the moment, difficult to obtain, but a proposed re-distribution of the total Command holdings should ease this situation.
[Underlined] REPEATER INDICATORS [/underlined]
It has become increasingly obvious from scrutiny of combat reports that Tail Warning Devices are not being watched continuously by the Wireless Operator. Originally it had been hoped that with training and experience a W/Op would be able to carry out his W/T work whilst, at the same time keeping one eye on the Tail Warning Device, but this has been found to be very difficult. The possibility of repositioning the Tail Warning Indicator so that two of the crew can watch it, has been thoroughly investigated, and found impracticable. Experiments have been made to ascertain the possibility of using a second indicator. This repeater indicator is located adjacent to the Gee indicator. An indicator standard for both Monica IIIA and V, has been designed and tested by the Group Trouble Shooting Party. It has proved quite satisfactory and Bomber Command have been asked to arrange for its early introduction. The design of a simple Fishpond repeater indicator proved too great a problem, and it is now expected that a second standard Fishpond indicator will be the only answer.
[Underlined] GEE [/underlined]
Gee was once again the leader in serviceability, showing a new high percentage of 97.77 out of 2,639 sorties. This was obtained in spite of the decrease in new equipment available, and a consequent reduction in the spare sets which squadrons were able to hold.
(Continued on Page 8 Column 1)
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 7
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SIGNALS (CONT.)
[Underlined] H 2 S [/underlined]
A total of 1249 sorties was completed by aircraft equipped with H 2 S Mark II, and of these 103 experienced difficulty; the remaining 91.76% were serviceable throughout the sorties. The fitting of this equipment to 619 Squadron has not yet been completed, but it is proceeding as fast as circumstances will allow. The movement of the Bomber Command Fitting Party to Dunholme will ease considerably the strain of fitting now being carried out by squadron personnel. The supply of fitted aircraft is keeping pace with the number of trained crews.
Mark III H 2 S has shown a decided improvement and the 76 sorties completed resulted in a serviceability of 92.11%. Supply of this equipment is still very grim, but does show signs of improving.
[Underlined] FISHPOND [/underlined]
As is to be expected, this equipment followed in step with H2 S, 92.72% of the 1236 sorties being free of difficulty. Training has shown very decided improvement and the operational reports indicate that W/Ops. are having increased success with this equipment.
[Underlined] MONICA [/underlined]
Monica IIIA remained at almost the same level as May. 830 sorties were completed, and there were 39 difficulties reported. The remaining 95.31% gave completely satisfactory results. Monica V came closer than ever to overtaking its predecessor with a percentage serviceability of 93.91. The more prevalent causes of unserviceability have been almost eliminated, and the lesser difficulties will no doubt diminish as further experience is gained by Radar personnel. The supply position of both types of Monica becomes increasingly difficult, so squadrons must do their utmost to conserve their existing equipment, and to keep all sets serviceable. The delivery of a Monica Trainer to the Aircrew School at Scampton should help squadrons considerably in their training programme.
The serviceability figures for the month are very gratifying. They indicate a decided increase in the standard of training and workmanship of Radar personnel. In these days of intensive operations, it requires hard work to keep all our equipment serviceable, but the bombing results are more than worth the effort. With the introduction of the proposed establishment, and an adequate number of Radar vans, we should be able to meet the rain and altitude trials of winter on better than equal terms.
[Underlined] TELEPHONE EXCHANGES [/underlined]
Last month’s issue of the News contained a cartoon for which we, in Signals, accept no responsibility. We are delighted, however, to be given the opportunity to refute the allegation of inefficiency which was inferred by publishing the following bouquet.
Skellingthorpe has produced some surprising figures showing the number of calls handled by the Admin PBK during a 24-hour non-operational period. A total of 3,725 calls was handled during this period, and of these 3,143 were extensions – to – extension calls. The Station Commander comments – “My opinion of our operators, always high, has gone up still further”, and – “at Skellingthorpe we have an exchange staff second to none”. We hope that this latter remark will be accepted as a challenge by other exchanges within the Group.
[Underlined] TELEPRINTER TRAFFIC [/underlined]
In April of this year, this Headquarters Signals Office was handling about 9,000 teleprinter messages per week. A drive was then inaugurated to divert traffic to less congested channels, such as D.R.L.S., and our weekly total fell in five weeks by 4,000 messages!
Now that “D” Day has passed, however, the total is commencing to rise. This must be checked, since as the Western Front develops, our commitments increase – It’s often quicker by postagram – at any rate for Admin messages.
EQUIPMENT
[Underlined] LANCASTER SPARES [/underlined]
This month sees a changeover in our method of demanding spares for Lancasters. Instead of demanding straight on to the M.P.O. demands are now placed on No.207 M.U. who are in a position to supply.
Equipment Officers will help No. 207 M.U. provisioning to a great extent by keeping a close watch upon demands for Lancaster spares, and ensuring that demands are going to No.207 M.U. and not to the M.F.O.
[Underlined] MECHANICAL SWEEPERS [/underlined]
A point to watch is the serviceability of mechanical sweepers. If these machines go u/s it means that runways cannot be kept clear of flints and stones, which means a rise in consumption of tyres. The aircraft tyre situation is still acute, and every care must be taken to get the maximum amount of life out of every tyre.
Equipment officers should therefore look into the holdings of spares for mechanical sweepers, and in conjunction with the M.T. Officers provision wisely on those parts which have a habit of going u/s. This will keep the sweepers serviceable and the consumption of tyres down.
[Underlined] WINTER CLOTHING [/underlined]
Now the English summer is upon us it would be wise to overhaul items of winter clothing such as overcoats, waterproof overalls, leather jerkins etc., and get them into good trim for the forthcoming winter.
It would be better to do it now instead of waiting for the winter when these items will be in great demand.
[Underlined] BLANKETS [/underlined]
Instances have occurred where it has been found that Stations have been holding blankets far in excess of their entitlement as laid down in A.M.O. A. 700/43. A quick check of stocks may mean the release of many blankets with a subsequent saving of man-hours at the factory which manufactures them.
[Underlined] EQUIPMENT (Continued from column 2) [/underlined]
[Underlined] OXYGEN TRANSPORT CYLINDERS [/underlined]
Attention is drawn to Headquarters Bomber Command letter BC/S.21459/E.6, dated 30th June, 1944.
The scale of issue of these items is 32 per squadron. Equipment Officers should make every effort to reduce any surplus holdings and return these cylinders to the M.U.
GARDENING
5 Group’s gardening this month amounted to two small but useful operations by No.44 Squadron against two of the Biscay U-Boat lairs, on the nights of 6/7th and 8/9th. Planting was done in H 2 S from high altitude and some excellent P. P. I. photographs were obtained. A total of 30 vegetables was planted.
Although the record breaking figures of April and May were not reached, the Command planted the considerable total of 1772 vegetables, in some 20 gardens. Over 1,000 were directed against the U-Boats – off their bases and in their approach routes to the Western end of the English Channel. This, combined with vigorous and successful action by air and surface striking forces has brought almost to nothing the threat to our Invasion supply lines, in spite of the massing of the U-Boats to the West of the Channel in the first few days. Nearly 600 vegetables were laid in the Channel itself, to impede enemy surface craft – principally E-Boats – in their anti-invasion operations. (Here, we gratefully admit, we were helped more than a little by the wholesale slaughter of these vermin in their harbours by the bombers). Certain North Sea gardens received some 150 vegetables, and Mosquitos of 8 Group planted a small number in the Kettegat.
During the three months preceding “D” Day well over 7,000 vegetables were planted by the Command, 5 Group being responsible for 908. These figures show that in actual quantity we distributed about one eighth of the Command total. What they do not show is that nearly all our operations were special ones, involving either exceptionally long distances (DANZIG); exceptional accuracy from very low level (KONIGSBURG CANAL); exceptional weight of attack in one night (KEIL BAY) or gardening in daylight (KATTEGAT). We do little routine gardening, and so do not get regular practice, but our recent successes show the value of keeping up to date in slack periods.
Results are beginning to come through, but details of casualties still refer to at latest three months ago; in fact, in the latest list we discover that 5 Group sank a U-Boat in April [underlined] 1943! [/underlined] Fortunately some reports get through more quickly than that, and news of the tremendous indirect effects of the pre-invasion gardening is plentiful. We hear of the route from TRELLEBORG to KIEL (150 miles) being marked with a [underlined] WRECK [/underlined] buoy every 1 – 2 miles; of Swedes and Finns laying up their ships rather than risk out mines, and the Ministry of Economic Warfare states that the mining of the Kiel Canal, backed up by the mining which preceded and followed it in the Baltic and North Sea approaches to the Canal, caused an [underlined] IRRECOVERABLE [/underlined] loss of 3 million tons of overall imports/exports to the German War Machine.
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 8
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AIR SEA RESCUE
June brought a record number of operational sorties and, at the same time, an increase in the known number of incidents involving Safety Drills.
A squadron aircraft disappeared over the Irish Sea on a navigational exercise with the loss of the entire crew. Four crews had occasion to use the Parachute Drill, two were successful; in the third, four members who baled out were lost in the sea; in the fourth the rear gunner had a cannon shell through his parachute, and a gallant attempt by the Air Bomber to share his own parachute was un successful.
[Underlined] 9/10th June. [/underlined] S/44 Squadron returning from operations, got out of control in bad weather. Its position was uncertain, and the captain ordered the crew to abandon the aircraft. Four members had jumped when the pilot regained control. They fell into the Thames Estuary and were drowned. The aircraft landed at base. None of those lost attached their K-type dinghies before jumping. [Underlined] MORAL [/underlined] – If in doubt about your position always take your dinghy with you.
[Underlined] 21/22nd June. [/underlined] Z/44 Squadron was hit in the starboard elevator from extreme range by a night fighter over enemy territory. The aircraft dived sharply with the elevators jammed, and when over the vertical the pilot considered he had no hope of recovery and ordered the crew to abandon. The Air Bomber was jammed against the rear of his compartment. The Rear Gunner was caught in his turret and trapped by piles of ammunition on his lap, caused by a runaway servo feed. Four members baled out and their parachutes were seen to open. The captain eventually regained control and flew the aircraft back to base, navigated by the Air Bomber.
S/630 Squadron was badly shot up by a fighter. Wings and fuselage were riddled, and the rear turret so badly damaged it was a wonder the gunner escaped injury. The rear gunner had a cannon shell through his parachute.
With the assistance of two crew members, the pilot flew the aircraft back to this country where, due to damage, he found he could not turn and so was forced to bale out his crew.
At the risk of grave personal injury, the Air Bomber allowed the Rear Gunner to attach his parachute clips to the “K” Dinghy ”D” rings of his (the Air Bomber’s) harness, and the two went out together. Unfortunately, his “D” rings tore through the webbing when the parachute opened and the Gunner was lost.
[Underlined] SUCCESSFUL DITCHING [/underlined]
A/57 Squadron on the same night was returning across the North Sea at 7000 feet when all engines failed, apparently through shortage of fuel. The Captain immediately warned his crew, and ordered the Wireless Operator to transmit S.O.S. The Wireless Operator switched I.F.F. to “Distress” and transmitted “S.O.S.” and the aircraft callsign about ten times before being ordered to his ditching station.
The aircraft ditched ten minutes later. The pilot made use of his landing light which helped him to judge his height, but having no power the aircraft struck the water very severely breaking off the tail. The Captain’s harness had not been tightened sufficiently and he was flung upwards, making a large hole in the perspex and cutting his face deeply. The pilot left the aircraft by means of this self-made hole. The Flight Engineer was also flung upwards and cut his nose on the fuselage roof. The gunners were flung over the flapjack but were uninjured, falling on top of the Air Bomber who was also unhurt, and the Navigator cut the back of his head.
Exit was made from the aircraft “except-
(continued on page10, col.3)
[Underlined] SAFETY DRILL COMPETITION RESULTS [/underlined]
[Underlined] Place Dinghy Drill Parachute Drill [/underlined]
1 52 Base 52 Base
2 53 Base 55 Base
3 55 Base 53 Base
[Table of Drill Results by Squadron]
No crews in No. 54 Base were tested during the month.
[Underlined] Points arising from Safety Drill Tests. [/underlined]
(a) A number of crews have not thoroughly read “5 Group Aircraft Drills”.
(b) Insufficient use of made of the intercom in practicing “Safety Drills” – the more use that is made of the intercom the more informed and less worried the crew will be.
[Underlined] FOOTNOTE. [/underlined]
The monthly summary of Ditchings in Home Waters for May, 1944, shows that 508 airmen were concerned, of whom 242 (47.2%) were saved – a marked percentage increase in lives saved.
RECENT GOOD SHOWS
An aircraft of No. 207 Squadron, flown by F/O Smart, collided over the target with another Lancaster which broke cloud above on the port quarter. In spite of the fact that the entire port fin and rudder were torn away and the port tail plane, elevator and aileron badly damaged, F/O Smart completed the bombing run and showing great skill, flew the aircraft back to this country where he made a successful landing.
By his prompt action, F/O Sanders of No. 463 Squadron averted what could have been a serious accident. He was taking off with full bomb load when the starboard tyre burst at a speed of approximately 90 m.p.h. Displaying great skill, he controlled the swing and made a successful take off, and after completing the sortie landed his aircraft in such a way that only minor damage was sustained.
P/O. Meggeson of No. 83 Squadron showed a fine example of airmanship. The port inner of his aircraft caught fire. Though he was unable to operate the fire extinguisher or feather the propeller, by maintaining a very low airspeed, he succeeded in controlling the fire and few his aircraft back to base, where he made a successful landing.
As a result of combat with an enemy fighter, and aircraft of No. 61 Squadron, piloted by P/O Passant, was severely damaged. The starboard fin and rudder were shot away, the fuselage and starboard main plane badly damaged, and the starboard tyre burst. P/O Passant displayed great skill and determination in flying the aircraft back to this country where he made a successful landing.
- AND SHOWS NOT SO GOOD
Whilst making a night approach in 7 miles visibility, and aircraft struck a tree 1000 yards from the end of the runway. When the aircraft eventually landed the Pilot stated he had had a successful trip but that the aircraft felt very heavy to handle. This was not surprising as he was still carrying full bomb load when he landed.
Whilst flying at 8000 feet, all four engines of a Stirling cut. The aircraft lost height to 600 feet before the engines were re-started. The First Engineer was changing tanks when the engines cut. They started again when the Second Engineer turned the petrol on!
In broad daylight, after a clear straight run of 200 yards, a pilot taxied his aircraft into an M.T. vehicle standing on the perimeter track.
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 9
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ENGINEERING
The number of sorties carried out totalled exactly 3,000; this constitutes an excellent effort when it is considered that this number of sorties affected serviceability very little and a much larger number could have been laid on had the weather permitted and circumstances required them.
A large number of acceptance checks had to be carried out during the month and some excellent work was carried out by the Group Servicing Section, and the very fine spirit which exists within the Group was made evident by bases which had few acceptance checks to carry out volunteering to accept aircraft for check from other bases. This greatly decreased the period which would normally have elapsed to bring this large number of Lancasters to operational standard.
1.003% of aircraft which either failed to take off or returned early were due to technical faults for which the Engineering Branch is responsible. This 1.003% includes defects beyond our immediate control and remedial modification action is being taken in respect of many of the defects. It is good to know that not one of these aircraft failed due to a maintenance defect, and squadrons are to be congratulated on this aspect. The following squadrons had no early returns or cancellations due to Engineering defects during June, and are awarded a “big hand”:-
44, 83, 97, 467 and 619 Squadrons.
Failures are still occurring of the now famous oil pipe from relief valve to dual drive, and it is hoped that all promises made during June will reach fruition during July.
[Underlined] GROUND EQUIPMENT [/underlined]
The effort which is put in by maintenance personnel to maintain this high standard of aircraft serviceability has been increased on many stations to maintain a similar high standard of serviceability of ground equipment. It is pleasing to see the drive which is progressing to maintain these essential aids to serviceability. When a “set-up” looks efficient, it invariably is efficient. Nothing looks so inefficient as a dirty hangar with trestles, wheels, cowlings and any odd items lying around the floor in pools of oil, whilst engine platforms are oil saturated and the equipment generally filthy. This state of affairs does not exist at any station in this Group, but there is considerable room for improvement on certain stations. Once a high standard of efficiency has been achieved it can easily be maintained, but don’t sit back and maintain your present standard unless it is highly efficient.
Many grand jobs have been carried out during June to keep the serviceability high and it is very difficult to pick out any single base in this News.
[Underlined] ELECTRICAL AND INSTRUMENTS [/underlined]
During the past month a drive was made to improve the maintenance of the Mark XIV Bombsight. Results have shown a marked improvement, but we will not be satisfied until every sight in the Group can be guaranteed accurate. Much more care must be taken in the levelling and lining up, as it is in these operations that most of the errors occur. The Mark XIV Bombsight is one of those instruments which requires plenty of liaison between Electrical officers and the Air Bombers’ Union, and it has been noted that this is now very effective.
Electrical sections deserve a pat on the back for the very intensive efforts they have put in during the latter half of the month. The list of modifications does not get any shorter, yet initial checks are still being completed in 24 hours.
[Underlined] TRAINING UNIT SERVICEABILITY [/underlined]
[Table of Aircraft Serviceability for Stirlings and Lancasters]
Flight Engineers
[Underlined] ADMINISTRATIVE ADJUTANTS [/underlined]
Many more administrative adjutants to the Chief Technical Officer are required; these adjutants will be volunteers from tour expired commissioned Flight Engineers. They will be responsible to the C.T.O. for the efficient administration of the Servicing Wing, and for the discipline and welfare of all the technical personnel on its strength.
Apart from this new post for Flight Engineers, there are also vacancies for administrative duties in the M.T. Section on Base Stations, and the duties will generally be the same as Adjutant to the C.T.O.
It will be seen that these posts have created quite a new avenue for Flight Engineers, but every facility will be given them to improve their engineering knowledge while undertaking administrative duties as their primary roles.
Flight Engineer Leaders must bring those vacancies to the notice of the commissioned Flight Engineers who are about to finish their tour of operations.
[Underlined] NON-COMMISSIONED FLIGHT ENGINEERS [/underlined]
A course of instruction for newly screened N. C. O. ‘s commenced at St. Athan on 7th June 1944. The object of this course is to train screened Flight Engineers to take up their new duties as Instructors in Heavy Conversion Units and Lancaster Finishing Schools.
Revision and technical subjects are included in the syllabus, but the course is designed mainly to teach the technique of lecturing.
As this course is most important to new instructors, it is hoped that all Flight Engineers will be enthusiastic, for much will depend on their results if the standard of lecturing is to improve in our Conversion Units and Schools.
TRAINING
Despite the bad weather towards the end of the month, 51 Base flew a total of over 8,000 hours and produced 130 crews for Squadrons.
Twice during the month, 1654 Conversion Unit, taking a leaf from the book of 1661 for May, laid on “operational” take offs for aircraft on night exercises. They got 17 and 22 off on these occasions in almost as many minutes.
Re-organisation of the Heavy Conversion Units commenced in the last week of the month to ensure that training of crews under the summer output can be increased to the highest level. Under this new system intakes of 11 every six days will go into the Heavy Conversion Units and the Group target figure for the month is 160 crews.
Each Conversion Unit now consists of 3 large flights, each of which is sub-divided into two. The Stirling Academy has also been split up into three parts, each one becoming the nucleus of a small flight at each Conversion Unit.
The Base had a very much better month from the accident point of view, and tyre bursts are now the only chronic complaint left. Undercarriage pylon failures have been reduced and coring has slipped rapidly out of the Base vocabulary.
New appointments within Base include Wing Commander Derbyshire, D.F.C., as Chief Instructor, 1660 Conversion Unit, and Wing Commander Kingsford Smith as Chief Instructor 1654 Conversion Unit.
[Underlined] AIR SEA RESCUE (Continued from page 9) [/underlined]
ionally quickly” and all the crew members were in the dinghy almost before they knew it. The kite container was lost in transit, but all other equipment was transferred to the dinghy – a parachute found its way in, but was afterwards lost in the excitement of getting clear of the aircraft which was keeling over and threatening to come down on top of the dinghy.
This crew merely got their feet wet in boarding the dinghy but later got the seats of their pants wet because of a small hole in the dinghy which was subsequently plugged.
The pilot was weak from loss of blood, and shock, so the Air Bomber took charge and bullied the rest of the crew into activity. They say this did the world of good. The aircraft floated for about 10 minutes.
The dinghy mast was broken when being stepped, but the Wireless Operator managed to connect the aerial to the dinghy radio and almost continuous transmissions were made with other crew members holding the mast erect. Some hours later they were spotted by 91 Group Wellingtons which brought in an A.S.R. Hudson. A Lindholme dinghy was dropped, but failed to inflate though the crew managed to collect three of the ration containers. About 14 1/2 hours later a Naval Launch picked up the crew and took them into Yarmouth.
This crew had done a practice dinghy drill on the day before the incident, and attribute much of the success of this ditching to that fact.
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 10
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ENEMY AGENTS – CARELESS TALKERS
On the 30th January, 1942, there was published a document of some importance – to wit A.M.C.O. A.9 of that year.
It was important because it cleared the air of a good deal of confusion on the subject of security, and it achieved this by defining the functions of Security Organisation – thereby defining what is meant by the term ‘Security’ – and it laid down the organisation by which these functions were to be performed.
Security was by no means a new subject. Prior to the appearance of A.M.C.O. A.9/42, a vast number of thoughts on the subject had already made themselves felt, chiefly in the form of posters. They bore a slogan – “CARELESS TALK COSTS LIVES” – they sought to impress the truth of this slogan by representing pictorially such distressing events as ships being blown up, aircraft being shot down, and so on, all, by implication, the result of the wrong word being spoken at the wrong time in the wrong place. These were reinforced, in lighter vein, by coloured drawings, more or less amusing, of Hitler listening beneath a table at which, presumably, two people were discussing the future plans of the Allies; of Hitler repeated ad infinitum in the pattern of the wall paper; of Hitler looking out of the frames of otherwise harmless pictures: all of them indicative of the ubiquity of Hitler, and of the truth of that apalling [sic] statement “Walls have ears”.
And since the appearance of A.M.C.O. A.9/42, these pictorial exhortations to verbal discretion have been emphasised to us, in the R.A.F., by a quantity of printed matter in the form of lectures, bulletins, reports, instructions which, if expressed in terms of tonnage of paper they consumed, or if placed end to end, or on top of each other in one column, would, one feels sure, provide much indigestible food for thought in the shape of one of those totals which impress more by number of their digits than by any meaning they are able to convey to the ordinary mind. Add to this the number of words which must have been spoken in lectures on this subject since the 30th January, 1942, the countless man-hours devoted to the study and promulgation of this gospel of silence, and our total will become more astronomical and, therefore, more meaningless than ever.
Staggering as this total would be, however, it would never reach the dimensions of those our enemies could provide in the same field of endeavour, for the very good reason that they had been at it long before we commenced piling ours up. Japan, for instance, had been preaching the gospel of silence to her people for something like twenty years before Pearl Harbour. She taught it not only to her soldiers, sailors and airmen, but to the man in the factory, the woman in her home, the pedestrian on the street; with the result, as the writings of any of the foreign newspaper correspondents, some of whom had been in the country for years, will tell you, it was next to impossible to find out anything worth knowing about the country’s strength, or her intentions.
And what of Germany? Those Germans who were not born silent, or had not achieved silence by the time Hitler took them over, had silence so thoroughly thrust upon them that they really came to understand how and to know that even the walls of their own homes could grow ears. They were left in no doubt whatever upon the value of silence when it came to discussing either the affairs of the Party or of the Fatherland.
All of which surely points to the conclusion that silence in war-time, or, in other words, Security of Information, must be a matter of very great importance. Of course it is. You know that already. The meanest intelligence, you will point out, can grasp quite easily the simple truth that, if you prevent the enemy from knowing what you are up to, you place him at a serious disadvantage; you render him, so to speak, both deaf and blind, and, therefore, easier to deal with. Any fool knows that.
They [sic] why do people talk? Why do they write home letters full of chatty information about their stations? Why does one feel so certain that, were it possible to tap, at once all the telephone lines in the vicinity of our stations all over the country, one would become possessed of a mass of service information about all sorts of things and people – whither, why and when such a squadron is moving, who have finished their tours, where people are posted to, who didn’t come back last night, who the new C.O. is, and where he comes from, what the weather is like, what are the chances of a scrub tonight, how the R.A.F. is fed, clothed, housed, organised – and so on and so on? Not to be too depressing about it, let it be stated at once that one would probably, even certainly, gain much less information than would have been the case say two years ago; but who would like to bet that there still wouldn’t be plenty to be picked up?
So, why, after all the effort that has been made, all the money that has been spent, the paper that has been used, the words that have been spoken, should this be so? Now here, it is suggested, lies the root of the matter, and if this root can be dug up and examined, the apparently indestructible weed of Service Gossip, a weed which, while harmless, perhaps, nine times out of ten, can, on that tenth time, produce enough poison to be fatal to precious lives and expensive material, can be understood, and to understand any problem is the first step towards solving it.
Let us examine it then. People talk because that is the easiest and most natural way for them to express their thoughts. They talk their thoughts, they think about their daily lives; therefore, they talk about their daily lives. Now apply that formula to the R.A.F. and what do you find? You discover a service filled, for the most part, with very young people, a number of them still in their formative years. They talk their thoughts, they think their lives, their lives are, at the moment, the R.A.F; therefore they talk about the R.A.F. To go on from here; they are young people who have been brought up in countries in which free speech, outside the debateable limits of the law of scandal, is as instinctive as breathing. They have never had occasion to practice this habit of silence - a most difficult habit to acquire – and finally, they serve in a force which has been publicised, photographed and if one may use such a word, glamourised, more than any other organisation ever has before. Flying, as the R.A.F. flies, is a continual source of wonder to the lay mind. This business of lifting tons of explosive material off the earth at one spot, transporting it at phenomenal heights to another spot hundreds of miles away, and there dropping it in spite of such discouragements as flak, fighters, the weather, and so on, is something of a miracle to the civilian, and, naturally enough, he wants to know about it. The youngsters of the R.A.F. are, of course, the horse’s mouth, which is given every encouragement to open itself, and to remain open. And when a W.A.A.F. goes home on leave Mother wants to know what it’s all like – the food, the quarters, the station, what they do there and that gives her mother something to talk about to somebody who will pass it on to somebody else who will…..why go on?
It is, you see, a personal problem. There is no mass-produced solution to it. It is every man and woman for himself, and only he and she can deal with it. How? Well, try this recipe. Try writing home letters in which you never even refer to the Station upon which you work, beyond, of course, the address in the top left hand corner. Apply the same rule when you leave your Station, even when you meet another R.A.F. type. Regard every telephone you use as a menace because it is you who are using it, and finally, when you have finished your work for the day, don’t make conversation out of it in the mess or the canteen. Try these four riles as an act of self-discipline, and never relax, and you will solve all your problem and, what is far more important, you will solve one of the great problems which confront your country. Difficult? Yes, very. Impossible? No. It has been done. There is a station which once had the privilege of guarding part of a great and important secret. It wrote its letters by the thousand, it went to the nearest town, it went on leave. But never a word got out. No less than 12,500 letters from that Station were opened over a period of three weeks, and only two minor indiscretions were discovered in them, both after the great event. If you were a stranger, you couldn’t get very far on that station without being questioned; every rumour heard on or off it was faithfully reported – just in case. The result is history, not only because the event referred to was one of the best kept secrets and, therefore, one of the most successful undertakings of the war, but because it provided proof that, with the problem fully explained to them, the A.C.2. and A.C.W.2. can keep a secret, can keep their mouths shut and their pens discreet, and can do so as a matter of conscience, and as an act of self discipline.
Now if only the civilian could be persuaded not to make the R.A.F. talk……
(Continued from Col. 3 page 12)
(c) I.A.S. within 2 m.p.h. and height within 50 feet.
It’s practice which, makes perfect.
Gunnery is the order of the day for you and your crew again. Keep a banking search going. See that your guns and gunners are in first class condition. Check up on your corkscrew and patter.
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 11
[Page break]
[Cartoon] SPORTS [Cartoon
[Underlined] CRICKET [/underlined]
June was not a cricketers’ month; the weather was “flaming [sic] but not in the sense of the old adage. Fielders and batsmen alike quailed before wind and rain. As a cricketers’ month it was grand for Rugger. In spite of the weather, however, several stations got in a full programme.
[Underlined] SCAMPTON [/underlined] – This station managed to complete the amazing total of 25 games. In addition, W.A.A.F. personnel played four games. Any challengers for an inter-station W.A.A.F. game? The Aircrew School represented the Station in five of the games, and themselves played 10 inter-course matches.
[Underlined] FISKERTON [/underlined] – had five station matches, one of which, with Woodhall, was abandoned after Fiskerton had knocked up 87 for 8. Their other games were as follows:-
V Dunholme at Dunholme – Fiskerton 72 for 7 Dunholme 68 all out
V Fiskerton Village at the Camp – Fiskerton 108 for 6 Village 29 all out
V Bardney at Fiskerton – Fiskerton 62 all out Bardney 22 all out
V Scampton at Scampton – Scampton 120 for 9 Fiskerton 71 all out
In addition to this successful record several inter-section games were played.
[Underlined] BARDNEY [/underlined] managed five station games, and are now getting into their stride under the captaincy of F/Lt Wardle.
[Underlined] DUNHOLME LODGE [/underlined] had three wins, one draw, and one loss from five games. They beat 5 Group H.Q., Welton Home Guard and Scampton, drew away with 5 Group H.Q. and suffered their only defeat at home with Fiskerton. An inter-section knock out is in full swing, with 12 teams competing.
[Underlined] METHERINGHAM [/underlined] had an unlucky month, with four postponed matches out of the six arranged. Against Coningsby, Metheringham scored 37 for 1 (Coningsby 179 for 7) before rain stopped play. The only completed game was with R.C.A.F. Digby, who hit 60 for 6 against Metheringham 56 all out.
Inter-section games produced some close results, viz:
Flying Control 55 for 7 V R.A.F.Regt. 50 all out
“B” Flight 60 all out V “A” Flight 36 all out
Servicing Wing Fitters 60 all out V Servicing Wing Riggers 65 all out
“B” Flight 43 for 5 V “A” Flight 39 for 9
In the Base Commander’s Trophy, 106 Sqdn dismissed 617 for 70 runs, but they could not bat and the game was abandoned.
[Underlined] 5 Group H.Q. [/underlined] played five games, four of them being away, since the 5 Group pitch has not yet “settled down”. They produced the following results:
V Dunholme, at Morton. 5 Group 148 for 8 Dunholme 89 for 8 (Draw)
V Dunholme at Dunholme. Dunholme 129 for 6 5 Group 64 all out (Lost)
V Swinderby at Swinderby. Swinderby 88 for 7 5 Group 83 all out (Lost)
V 93 M.U. at Collingham M.U. 77 all out 5 Group 84 for 6 (Won)
V Newark Town at Newark Newark 77 for 8 5 Group 72 for 5 (Lost)
There were two intersection games, in one of which the “Hall” beat the rest by 136 for 8 against 99 for 8.
[Underlined] GROUP CRICKET COMPETITION [/underlined]
Woodhall beat Coningsby in the final of “A” Section, so now Syerston (winners of “B” Section) meet Woodhall in the deciding game for the Trophy. The game will probably be decided on Saturday or Sunday (July 15th or 16th) at Woodhall Spa. Woodhall have taken over the town’s local ground, and with the addition of a score board and sight screens now have one of the finest grounds in the Group. The game will be one of the features of Woodhall’s “Wings for Victory” Week, and given good weather will be a highly successful event between two of the strongest Group teams. It is hoped that the A.O.C. will be able to present the handsome silver bowl to the winning side.
[Underlined] ATHLETIC MEETINGS [/underlined]
[Underlined] METHERINGHAM [/underlined] ran a highly successful Athletic Meeting on Saturday, 3rd June, when favourable weather for once coincided with a stand-down. Fourteen events were contested on an inter-section basis, the trophy being a shield presented by Corporal Ward, Instrument Section. The final placings of the teams were as follows:-
Winners: Navigators – 137 points
Second Pilots – 93 points
Third W/Ops. – 83 points
Fourth Rear Gnrs. – 82 points
Fifth Air Bombers – 78 points
Sixth Engineers – 63 points
Seventh M.U.Gunners – 43 points
Mrs. McKechnie presented the shield to F/Sgt. Croft, who assisted the Navigators by winning the 440, 880 and mile. Another outstanding performance was by F/O Gantschi (Air Bomber) who won the 100, 200, 220 and Long Jump.
[Underlined] 54 BASE INTER-SQUADRON SPORTS MEETING [/underlined] was on Saturday 17th June. 83 Squadron won the Base Commander’s Trophy, scoring 35 points, but 106 Squadron, with 33 points and 617 with 32 points, were good losers. 106 Squadron, feeling fit, provided winners for the 440, 880, mile, 3 miles and Long Jump. F/Sgt. Croft again had a field day, winning the 440, mile, 3 miles, and running second in the 880 yards. There was a big crowd at the games, and enthusiasm ran high. Lord Brownlow, Lord Lieutenant of the County, presented the prizes.
[Underlined] 93 M.U. SPORTS [/underlined] 93 M.U., whose work is so completely bound up with 5 Group, ran a highly successful Field Day on June 24th. Besides the usual athletic events, side shows, boxing and dancing made up an excellent programme. They plan another Gala Day, in aid of the P.O.W. Fund on August Bank Holiday Monday, and any personnel who can reach Swinderby will be sure of an enjoyable day.
SECOND THOUGHTS FOR PILOTS
[Underlined] FRESHMEN [/underlined]
Get down to crew Gunnery problems in July. Check your knowledge of the corkscrew, polish up your patter and do all the fighter affiliation you can.
Careful trimming of your aircraft ensures accurate flying. The correct sequence of action is:-
Fly the aircraft straight and level, trim the elevators, trim all load off the rudder and finally trim out any aileron load.
2.5° of skid at 10,000 ft. means an error of 250 yards on the ground. This common bombing error is often unconsciously caused by pilots sitting tense and rigid on the bombing run. Ensure the aircraft is properly trimmed and the [underlined] relax [/underlined] and fly the aircraft naturally and carefully.
If you find it difficult to read the instruments when coned by searchlights, get your navigator to call the airspeed. Make it a standing arrangement with him.
Here are the common faults in night circuits, don’t allow these errors to “creep” in.
(i) Edging in towards the flare path on the down wind leg.
(ii) Not allowing for drift on approach.
(iii) Failing to close the throttles when touching down.
(iv) Going too far across wind before the final turn in.
Should you have to land without flaps, remember to lengthen your downwind leg as the approach will be flatter and therefore longer. Start the final turn in earlier since the turn without flap will be wider, and approach at 125 m.p.h. Touch down as soon as possible and expect a longer landing run, and be prepared to use brake progressively.
[Underlined] VETERANS [/underlined]
Are you brake conscious? Brake efficiency falls off with rise in temperature of – brake shoes and drums. Avoid continual use of brakes, control direction by engine and release brakes as soon as possible to allow heat to go into the air and not up into the tyres. Never apply full brake at once. This induces tyre creep.
If you have to land in a very strong, gusty wind, use only 40° of flap and aim to do a wheel landing. Make a normal approach and when the wheels touch, ease the stick [underlined] slightly [/underlined] forward and keep it steady till the tail sinks on to the ground.
A word on Met; remember that forecast height of cloud base id always height above sea level. Bear this in mind if you are forced to break cloud at a diversion aerodrome, and allow for height of ground.
Have you and your crew an “A” category for bombing? You can have if you accept nothing less than these limitations;
(a) Course within 1° (b) Bank within 2°
(Continued on page 11 Col.3)
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 12
[Page break]
ACCIDENTS
The award of the Silver Model Lancaster to the Unit having the best accident rate for the six months ended June goes to No. 106 Squadron. This squadron had one accident for a total of 6,848 flying hours. Nos. 49 and 57 Squadrons also had one avoidable accident, for a total of 6,743 and 6,294 hours respectively. These squadrons are to be congratulated on a splendid achievement, It’s up to the other Squadrons to dethrone the champions during the next three months. GO TO IT!!
Altogether there was a decided improvement in the number of avoidable accidents during June.
36 aircraft were damaged in the Group by causes other than enemy action. This is a reduction of 15 compared with May, and the improvement is also reflected in the avoidable accident total which stands at 16 for June as opposed to 20 in May.
Of the aircraft damaged, 12 were CAT A, 5 CAT AC, 5 CAT B, and 14 CAT E.
[Underlined] AVOIDABLE ACCIDENTS – 51 BASE RECORD [/underlined]
51 Base are to be congratulated for the lowest number of avoidable accidents for a long time; 4 aircraft were damaged under this category. The squadron total of 12 for the month was an increase of 2 over May’s total. Details are as follows:-
Squadron – Ground collisions (taxying) 3; overshoots landing 2; undershooting 1; Swings landing 1; Flying into high ground 1; Collision in air 1; errors of judgement 3; TOTAL 12.
51 Base – Swings taking off 1; Swings landing 2; Taxying 1; TOTAL 4
[Underlined] ACCIDENT CAUSES [/underlined]
[Underlined] Taxying. [/underlined] 3 of the 4 taxying accidents in the Group follow the usual pattern. One struck a trestle outside dispersal at night, and no taxying light was being used. Another hit an M/T van left unattended just off the perimeter track, while a third (a Stirling) broke its tail wheel when it ran off the perimeter track. The 4th taxying accident was caused by a Flight Engineer starting up the engines of a Lancaster without permission. Brake pressure was low and the aircraft moved forward and struck another parked alongside.
[Underlined] Swings [/underlined] Three of these occurred on landing. One was a Mosquito in which the pilot, flying a Mosquito for the first time, was not quick enough in correcting. The other two landing swings were by pupil pilots on Stirlings, and were due to inexperience more than anything else. They both knew the correct drill, however, but were slow to react. The swing on take off occurred in a Stirling, when a pupil pilot opened the throttles too quickly and failed to control the violent starboard swing which followed. The undercarriage collapsed.
[Underlined] Other Accidents. [/underlined] A Lancaster returning in poor weather descended through cloud and hit a hill 500 feet above sea level. This accident has not yet been fully investigated, but preliminary evidence indicates that the pilot lost height contrary to orders at briefing.
Another Lancaster on return from Ops. in good weather hit a tree 1000 yards from the runway on his approach. The wing tip was torn off but the pilot went round again and made a good landing on his second attempt. In this instance the bombs were still on board unknown to the pilot. His Air Bomber had told him that all bombs had gone. Air Bombers please note!!
Two Lancasters overshot on landing at strange airfields on return from operations. The bomb load exploded after one of them crashed.
A formation flying collision resulted in the destruction of two aircraft this month. Number 3 of a “Vic” formation knocked the tail off the Leader.
The two remaining avoidable accidents cocurred [sic] on operational flights. One pilot lost control in cloud on return and ordered his crew to bale out. Four of them left before control was regained. They had not been told to take their ‘K’ type dinghy packs with them and landed in the sea. The aircraft made a safe landing at base.
A Mid-Upper Gunner firing at searchlights on the ground damaged the port fin of his aircraft with a burst. The solenoid had jumped from its bracket. The gunner was at fault.
RADAR/NAV
[Underlined] GEE [/underlined]
Most operations were within normal Gee range and no exceptional results have been recorded. There has, however, been a substantial decrease in jamming which may be due to the increase in the number of frequencies now in use.
Non-H 2 S squadrons are now equipped with the new R.F. Unit 27 and have had several chances of using it during the month. As yet there has been no opportunity to test its efficiency at long range, but reports indicate the signal strength to be good with little or no interference. It is hoped that the supply position in regard to these new units will improve shortly and H 2 S Squadrons can then be equipped.
Several changes in Gee transmissions have taken place recently, and it would be advisable for all navigators and wireless operators to check upon these and make sure they are using the right frequencies and aerial loading stud at the right time.
One word regarding Gee homing. It is apparent from recent operations that navigators are not checking up with Gee on the position of the markers. There is little excuse for this, as most operations at the present time are within normal Gee range and subject to little or no interference. Navigators would be well advised to check up on their homing procedure now – because sooner or later the time will come when owing to weather conditions bombs may have to be released on Gee.
With regard to Gee training, a modification is being issued shortly which will enable navigators to carry out dry swims and Gee homing procedure with the trainer. The first will be issued to Scampton Aircrew School and should prove an interesting and invaluable “toy”.
[Underlined] H 2 S [/underlined]
The targets this month have been rather disappointing for the H 2 S operator, and H 2 S has been little used. Whilst Gee may seem much simpler to use it is essential for all operators to use H 2 S as much as possible on these short range operations to augment training. We may switch to the longer range targets with little or no notice, and if operators have been relying to a very great extent on Gee, some difficulty with H 2 S may be experienced.
Just a word to Captains; your navigator depends to a very great extent upon the bomb aimer and his efficient manipulation of the equipment. If you are keeping him in the nose the whole of the time on these short operations he is getting little or no H 2 S training. A.S.I. BL/17 dated 26th April, 1944, details the duties of Air Bombers in H 2 S aircraft and however short the operation, Captains must see that this instruction is complied with.
One word with regard to H 2 S training on operational squadrons. With the present commitments there is very little opportunity for air training, but this does not prevent operators from obtaining as much ground training as possible. Ground trainers are available at all Units and they are yours to use at will. Squadron Navigation Officers and H 2 S Instructors should ensure that all operators get at
(Continued in Col. 2)
[Underlined] RADAR/NAV (Continued from col.3) [/underlined]
least 30 minutes practice every day and should make periodic tests to see that operators are remaining efficient.
H 2 S operators will be interested to hear that 54 Base have been carrying out some experiments in the assessment of a Paramatta attack, and conclusions reached show that assessments can be made to within approximately 1/2 mile of the correct position. If this assessing can be carried out on operations it may prevent many attacks from developing around T.I’s a considerable distance from the aiming point. Preliminary trials are now being attempted with regard to Wanganui attacks and it is hoped that something useful may be produced for next winter’s operations.
Training at Conversion Units is progressing satisfactorily and Wigsley is now producing H 2 S trained crews.
There are still a few people in the Group who are sceptical about the amount of H 2 S. training carried out at No. 51 Base and in fairness to the effort being made by the Conversion Units, it would be advisable to outline the training being carried out by them.
Up to June 1st this year, 111 H 2 S trained crews have been produced by the Conversion Units, of which only 6 were sent to non-H 2 S squadrons (of these crews, 3 were Flight Commanders and 3 Australians).
With the increase in the number of H 2 S squadrons it became increasingly apparent that more crews would have to be trained by the Conversion Units and instructions were issued to that effect.
Despite the fact that [underlined] extra time or aircraft [/underlined] are allowed for this training, the Conversion Units are now taking 50% of the
(Continued on page 14 col.1)
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 13
[Page break]
HONOURS & AWARDS [Cartoon]
The following IMMEDIATE awards have been approved during the month:-
[Underlined] 44 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/L P.A. DOREHILL, D.F.C. D.S.O.
F/O McKENZIE D.F.C.
[Underlined] 50 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/O B.H. BOTHA D.F.C.
[Underlined] 57 SQUADRON [/underlined]
P/O R.E. WALKER D.F.C.
[Underlined] 106 SQUADRON [/underlined]
W/O J.A. CUNNINGHAM D.F.C.
[Underlined] 207 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/O T.T. SMART D.F.C.
F/O W. McINTOSH, D.F.M. D.F.C.
P/O C.B. SUTHERLAND D.F.C.
[Underlined] 617 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/O G.S. STOUT D.F.C.
[Underlined] 627 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/L H. STEERE, D.F.M. D.F.C.
F/L R.F. DAVIES, D.F.C. Bar to D.F.C.
[Underlined] 630 SQUADRON [/underlined]
A/F/L/ G.H. PROBERT D.F.C.
The following NON-IMMEDIATE awards were approved during the month:-
[Underlined] 9 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/L L.C.A. HADLAND D.F.C.
F/O W.W.W. TURNBULL D.F.C.
A/F/L E.M. ARMSTRON D.F.C.
F/O M.J. MAY D.F.C.
F/O F.B. HALL D.F.C.
F/SGT J.W. GREENWOOD D.F.M.
SGT J. WATERHOUSE D.F.M.
P/O A.E. GILES D.F.C.
P/O B.G.L. ROGERS D.F.C.
[Underlined] 9 SQUADRON (Contd.) [/underlined]
P/O W.A. GALL D.F.C.
F/O J.A. PRIOR D.F.C.
P/O W.F. POSSEE D.F.C.
P/O F.G. HAYLER D.F.C.
F/SGT J. LEVER D.F.M.
F/SGT W.I. WILKINSON D.F.M.
F/SGT J.C. DICKINSON D.F.M.
SGT D.E. LAYSHON D.F.M.
F/SGT R.H. McFERRAN D.F.M.
F/SGT F. LOMAX D.F.M.
F/SGT J. RYAN D.F.M.
SGT J.H. TURNER D.F.M.
F/SGT LOMAS D.F.M.
F/O D.H. PEARCE D.F.C.
F/O McMASTER D.F.C.
P/O J.D. DUNCAN D.F.C.
P/O S.W.A. HURRELL D.F.C.
P/O H. BLOW D.F.C.
F/SGT H.F. SMITH D.F.M.
[Underlined] 44 SQUADRON [/underlined]
SGT L.J. HUMMELL D.F.M.
SGT F. GARRETT D.F.M.
P/O F.B. SOAPER D.F.M.
F/SGT K.R. BLUNDELL D.F.M.
SGT R.H. BATEMAN D.F.M.
A/F/L R. McCURDY, D.F.C. Bar to D.F.C.
P/O T.W. BLACK D.F.C.
F/SGT E. BARTON D.F.M.
F/SGT P.A. DEACON D.F.M.
F/SGT M.C. WRIGHT D.F.M.
F/SGT E.D. PRATT D.F.M.
P/O A.C. BAKER D.F.C.
F/O R.H. MAURY D.F.C.
F/O A. RIMMER D.F.C.
SGT D. CHARLES D.F.M.
F/SGT A.J. GURR D.F.M.
F/SGT W.H. BARKER D.F.M.
SGT WILLETT D.F.M.
SGT R.H. TURRELL D.F.M.
P/O J.A.W. McCALLUM D.F.C.
SGT H.G. CAPPS D.F.M.
F/SGT H.S. TILLER D.F.M.
SGT J.C. THOMPSON D.F.M.
F/SGT F.H. BARNES D.F.M.
SGT E. HEDLEY D.F.M.
F/SGT M.M. SCOTT D.F.M.
[Underlined] 49 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/SGT J.H. PRYOR D.F.M.
[Underlined] 49 SQUADRON (Contd.) [/underlined]
P/O J.V. REDDISH D.F.C.
F/SGT S.E. STEVENSON D.F.M.
P/O C.R. ROANTREE D.F.C.
F/SGT D. ANDREW D.F.M.
P/O BLACKHAM D.F.C.
F/SGT M.R. PRICE D.F.M.
F/SGT V.F. PITCHER D.F.M.
P/O D. JONES D.F.C.
F/O W.J.V. HAMILTON D.F.C.
F/SGT J.J. PAGE D.F.M.
P/O G.M.E. WELLER D.F.C.
SGT J.A. KIRWAN D.F.M.
W/CDR A.A. ADAMS D.F.C.
[Underlined] 50 SQUADRON [/underlined]
P/O D.J. LUNDY D.F.C.
P/O L. DURHAM D.F.C.
F/O M.J. BEETHAM D.F.C.
P/O P.E. THOMPSON D.F.C.
F/O H.R. MOSSOP D.F.C.
F/O K.W. ODGERS D.F.C.
F/O P.A. CUNNINGHAM D.F.C.
F/O A.H. BIGNELL D.F.C.
F/SGT J.C.A. RODGERS D.F.M.
F/SGT N. HORSLEY D.F.M.
F/SGT A.D.F. SPRUCE D.F.M.
F/O L. HORNER D.F.C.
F/O H.S. SHORTT D.F.C.
F/O R.G.G. PAGETT D.F.C.
F/SGT D.E. WESTERMAN D.F.M.
F/SGT R.A. COLLINGWOOD D.F.M.
F/SGT C. TURNER D.F.M.
F/SGT R. STANWIX D.F.M.
F/SGT A.L. BARTLETT D.F.M.
F/O A.S. KEITH D.F.C.
P/O A. MORRISON D.F.C.
W/O J.A. WILDING D.F.C.
SGT W.M. RUNDLE D.F.M.
[Underlined] 57 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/L D.H. REID D.F.C.
SGT J.C. EVANS D.F.M.
P/O E.A. DOWLAND D.F.C.
P/O C.J.M. MARTIN D.F.C.
SGT T. DAVIES D.F.M.
F/O J. SIMMS D.F.C.
P/O J.H. COLLINS D.F.C.
(Continued on page 15, Column 1)
[Underlined] RADAR/NAV (Contd. From page 13 Col.2) [/underlined]
crews passing through and giving them full H 2 S ground training with 10 – 15 hours air training. This output will be sufficient to satisfy the requirements of all H 2 S squadrons. These crews should reach the squadrons by the middle of August.
In the meantime H 2 S squadrons will have to put up with a quota of non H 2 S crews and continue to train them.
To further ease the training commitments of both the Conversion Units and squadrons, it is hoped that H2S training will be introduced into the Scampton Aircrew School by the middle of August. This training will consist of approximately 5 hours lectures with further time in manipulation of the H 2 S synthetic trainer. It is to be appreciated that this training will have to be in addition to the present essential navigational training carried out at the School, and navigators and air bombers must be prepared to undertake some of it in their spare time.
PHOTOGRAPHY
[Underlined] SUMMARY OF PHOTOGRAPHIC RESULTS [/underlined]
[Table of Photographic Results by Squadron]
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944. PAGE 14
[Page break]
Aircrew Volunteers
(a) New Volunteers
(b) Accepted by A.C.S.B.
(c) Posted for training
(d) Awaiting interview by A.C.S.B.
[Table of Aircrew Volunteers by Base and Station]
WAR SAVINGS
(a) Pence saved per head of strength
(b) %age of personnel contributing
(c) Total amount saved
[Table of War Savings by Station]
TOTAL £15,498 13 9
LINK TRAINER
The number of hours link practice carried out by pilots during the month shows an increase over last month’s total. There is, however, still room for improvement in the standard of instrument flying. This can only be achieved by close co-operation between Link Instructors and Pilots.
The new Link Syllabus was distributed to Stations in the middle of the month and should now be in use at all Units. It is again emphasised that this Syllabus is progressive and if full value is to be obtained from it, Pilots and Flight Engineers must ensure that they complete all exercises, and keep an accurate record of the exercises carried out.
[Table of Link Trainer by Squadron]
[Page break]
[Blank page]
[Page break]
HONOURS & AWARDS
(CONTINUED)
[Underlined] 57 SQUADRON (Contd.) [/underlined]
SGT J.T.WATTS D.F.M.
SGT F.A. SIMMONDS D.F.M.
F/O G.S. JOHNSON D.F.C.
SGT F. ROBERTS D.F.M.
F/O R. DAVIS D.F.C.
F/SGT R.W. CLEARY D.F.M.
F/O K.D. SMITH D.F.C.
[Underlined] 61 SQUADRON [/underlined]
P/O E.A. WILLIAMS D.F.C.
P/O J.E.R. WILLIAMS D.F.C.
SGT L.G. BOLTON D.F.M.
F/SGT C. BALDWIN D.F.M.
P/O E.H. WALKER D.F.C.
F/SGT L.W. CROMARTY D.F.M.
F/SGT R.A. BUNYAN D.F.M.
P/O W.C. MacDONALD D.F.C.
F/O N.F. TURNER D.F.C.
P/O D.E. TREVETHICK D.F.C.
P/O G.A. TURNBULL D.F.C.
SGT. W.A. LEE D.F.M.
P/O J. BARR D.F.C.
P/O C.A. HAIGH D.F.C.
F/SGT LYNCH D.F.M.
F/O S.J. BEARD, D.F.C. Bar to D.F.C.
F/SGT C.P. STEEDSMAN D.F.M.
SGT G.M. WARD D.F.M.
SGT McQUILLAN D.F.M.
F/SGT C. WILCE D.F.M.
[Underlined] 106 SQUADRON [/underlined]
P/O J.C. BELL D.F.C.
F/O A.F. POORE D.F.C.
F/O G.E.D. TOOGOOD D.F.C.
P/O A.E. BRISTOW D.F.C.
F/SGT J. GRAVES D.F.M.
F/O R.J. ELSEY D.F.C.
F/O R.A. ROBERTS D.F.C.
F/SGT V. LYNCH D.F.M.
P/O P.J. RICHARDS D.F.C.
F/O W.R. LEE D.F.C.
F/O J.H.S. LEE D.F.C.
SGT T.C. WALLER D.F.M.
F/SGT G.R. CARLILE D.F.M.
F/O F.M. MIFFLIN D.F.C.
F/SGT A.D.J. GROOMBRIDGE D.F.M.
F/O C.J. DUNN D.F.C.
P/O R.A. HINCKLEY D.F.C.
F/O D.L. CRAMP D.F.C.
F/O D.V. GIBBS D.F.C.
F/L C.J. GINDER D.F.C.
F/SGT D. PINCKARD D.F.M.
F/SGT F. MYCOE D.F.M.
F/LT W.A. WILLIAMSON D.F.C.
F/SGT F.L. HIGGINS D.F.M.
F/O D.A. PAGLIERO D.F.C.
F/O R.L. WAKE, D.F.C. Bar to D.F.C.
F/SGT R. APPLEYARD D.F.M.
SGT V.H. BLACKWELL D.F.M.
P/O J. O’LEARY D.F.C.
F/O A.V. WITHERS D.F.C.
F/O R.P. RAMSAY D.F.C.
F/SGT S.J. HALVORSEN D.F.M.
SGT J.G. LANCASTER D.F.M.
F/SGT E. CLODE D.F.M.
SGT R.F. LAWRENSON D.F.M.
[Underlined] 207 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/SGT J.G. MYERSCOUGH D.F.M.
SGT D. FRISKEY D.F.M.
F/SGT E.C. THOMPSON D.F.M.
P/O C.W. BARNETT D.F.C.
SGT W.G. LAMONT D.F.M.
F/SGT J. SKELTON D.F.M.
P/O R.G. CAMPBELL D.F.C.
P/O D.R. DEARMAN D.F.C.
P/O K.L. WRIGHT D.F.C.
F/SGT E.H. BUNN D.F.M.
SGT D.C. MARK D.F.M.
SGT F.H. HAZEL D.F.M.
SGT F.C. DOWLING D.F.M.
SGT R.M. GALLOWAY D.F.M.
[Underlined] 207 SQUADRON (Contd.) [/underlined]
F/LT H.L. McCARTHY D.F.C.
F/O D.S.P. SMITH D.F.C.
F/O C.T. HARPER D.F.C.
F/O A. HOLLINGS D.F.C.
[Underlined] 463 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/O R.A. CURTIS D.F.C.
F/O E.R. FREEMAN D.F.C.
F/O A.E. VOWELS D.F.C.
F/O W.H. BROOKER D.F.C.
P/O H.R. MAHON D.F.C.
F/O F.B.M. WILSON D.F.C.
F/O J.E.R. REES D.F.C.
F/SGT J.B. CHILDS D.F.M.
[Underlined] 467 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/LT D.F.S. SMITH D.F.C.
F/O F. MORRIS D.F.C.
P/O A.R.T. BOYS D.F.C.
F/O W.H. GOLDSTRAW, D.F.C. Bar to D.F.C.
W/O H.C. CHANDLER D.F.C.
F/O D.T. CONWAY D.F.C.
F/O J.A. COLPUS D.F.C.
P/O M.F. SMITH D.F.C.
P/O N.D. MARSHALL D.F.C.
F/O F.J. NUGENT D.F.C.
F/O H.S.L. CROUCH D.F.C.
F/O G.G. ABBOTT D.F.C.
P/O A.A. TAYLOR D.F.C.
P/O A.P. SPERLING D.F.C.
F/SGT G. NOBLE D.F.M.
[Underlined] 617 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/O P.N. BUTTLE D.F.C.
P/O P.E. PIGEON D.F.C.
P/O H.A. WEEKS D.F.C.
P/O J.H. CLAY D.F.C.
F/O E. WILLSHER D.F.C.
W/O J. DACEY D.F.C.
F/O J.S. WATSON D.F.C.
F/SGT McCLELLAN D.F.M.
F/SGT L. EATON D.F.M.
F/SGT R.J. HENDERSON D.F.M.
F/SGT APPLEBY D.F.M.
F/SGT W. HOWARTH D.F.M.
F/O R. ADAMS D.F.M.
F/O A. HILL D.F.C.
F/LT WILSON, D.F.C. Bar to D.F.C.
[Underlined] 619 SQUADRON [/underlined]
F/O J.G. THOMPSON D.F.C.
F/O H.L. VICKERSTAFFE D.F.C.
F/O W.E.D. BELL D.F.C.
P/O G.G. TAYLOR D.F.C.
F/SGT J.A. FEATHERSTONE D.F.M.
F/O N.B. MORRISON D.F.C.
W/O B.T.J. HUCKS D.F.C.
W/O C.G. TURNBULL D.F.C.
SGT M.H.G. KING D.F.M.
P/O J.P. HIND D.F.C.
P/O J.I. JOHNSON D.F.C.
P/O E.K. ALLEY D.F.C.
P/O R.T. BOULTBEE D.F.C.
F/O P.H. TAYLOR D.F.C.
W/O R.A. WESTAD D.F.C.
F/O T. WILKIE D.F.C.
F/O JOHNSON-BIGGS D.F.C.
F/LT R. AYTOUN, D.F.C. Bar to D.F.C.
F/SGT J.H. BRYANT D.F.M.
[Underlined] 630 SQUADRON [/underlined]
P/O A.C. BLOIS D.F.C.
P/O T. SMART D.F.C.
W/O L.H. TODD D.F.C.
P/O R.T. HUGHES D.F.C.
F/O G.W. BRAKE D.F.C.
W/O D. ROBERTS D.F.C.
F/O A.J. WRIGHT D.F.C.
F/O K.R. AMES, D.F.C. Bar to D.F.C.
P/O F.R.G.A. HIGGINS D.F.C.
W/O H. GLASBY D.F.C.
F/SGT T.H. SAVAGE D.F.M.
FLYING CONTROL
All stations are to be congratulated on the excellent landing times produced this month, in which the average for the Group is below the 2 minutes per aircraft mark. In particular, Waddington recorded consistently good times for each operation. One [sic] the night of the 24/25th June this Station landed 32 AIRCRAFT IN 31 MINUTES, the average being less than 1 minute per aircraft. This is a record for the Group, and probably for the Command.
One word of warning, however; recently aircraft from another Group were diverted and on arrival at the diversion airfield proceeded to use their own Group landing scheme, with which the diversion control staff were not familiar. It is sufficient to say that confusion followed, with extreme danger to the aircraft and crews concerned. A.S.I. FC/11 contains the standard diversionary control procedure and must be adhered to.
[Underlined] STONES, CONCRETE AND METAL [/underlined]
Every stone, every sharp edge of concrete, every spent cartridge or piece of metal, constitutes a menace to tyres.
During the last 3 month there has been a very high average of tyres changed on accounts of cuts – (25 per station per month). Recently, endeavours have been made on stations to overcome this menace, but the intensified clean-up of perimeters, runways and dispersals must be maintained.
FLYING CONTROL must ensure that not the smallest break in the perimeter track or runway is overlooked, that grading does level up with the perimeter track and runways, and that any looseness in the surface of the French drains is attended to at once. Station Admin and Clerks of Works must help to the utmost.
GROUND CREWS must assist by seeing that their dispersals are thoroughly clean, and AIRCREWS watch carefully that cartridges cease to be a menace to tyres.
TRANSPORT – keep the sweepers fully serviced and see that nothing is loose on vehicles employed on the airfield.
ARMAMENT, too, can assist by ensuring that the access roads to the bomb dump are clear of stones and that wooden chocks from bomb trolleys are recovered before aircraft move. A 4” x 3” block with nails in it is not healthy treatment for a tyre!
ONLY BY FULL CO-OPERATION CAN THE ULTIMATE AIM BE ACHIEVED-AN AIRFIELD 100% SERVICEABLE.
JUNE LANDING TIMES
[Table of Landing Times by Station]
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944 PAGE 15
[Page break]
OPERATIONS
At dawn on the 6th of this month, the first Allied troops landed on the Normandy coast. A contribution towards the success of this amphibious operation was no doubt made in the effective silencing of most of the shore batteries. During the last month and again on three nights prior to D – Day this was one of the Group’s tasks. The heavy railway gun battery at WIMERAUX was attacked on the 2/3rd and although the interpretation report embraces previous attacks, there is no doubt that severe damage was inflicted; a large number of new craters being seen around the target. Both the western turntables have received direct hits.
The coastal defence batteries at MAISY (4/5th), ST PIERRE DU MONT (5/6 th) and LA PERNELLE (5/6th) next received our attention. Little could be gleaned from photographic cover as to the precise damage to the targets, but their apparent failure to contest our landing bears testimony to the success of the raids.
Another pre-invasion target was the Radar Jamming Station at FERME D’URVILLE. This target was attacked on 3/4th and, to quote A.I.C.U. “The station is completely useless”.
Our beachhead having been secured, our bombing role turned to close support of the land forces. The 21st Panzer Division was moving into CAEN to threaten the British Beaches. Two road bridges in this town were accordingly scheduled for attack on the 6/7th; both bridges were hit, and the road approaches heavily cratered, presenting an embarrassing obstacle to the Hun. On the same night an attack was directed against the ARGENTAN Railway centre. This raid also was calculated to hamper the arrival of reinforcements, which object was achieved by the severing of almost all the tracks and the destruction of many essential buildings.
During the day of the 7th, elements of the 17th Panzer Division were concentration [sic] in the FORET DE CERISY, a number of ammunition dumps, fuelling points and tank harbours having been located in this area. This was our assignment for the night 7/8th, and although results were not spectacular, many bombs fell on the aiming point.
The battle of communications continued on 8/9th against targets south of the battle area, when the marshalling yard at RENNES and rail junction at PONTAUBAULT were attacked. Severe damage was sustained at the former target while at the latter, the tracks were cut at several points.
One of the outstanding operations of the month was against the SAUMUR tunnel on the 8/9th. Already the railway junction had been attacked on 1/2nd with excellent effect, but the later attack on the tunnel left no doubt that the line would be denied the enemy for some time to come. A direct hit on the roof of the tunnel at its southern entrance has probably caused a major collapse while the tracks and embankments are severely damaged.
Our attack on the railway junction at ETAMPES on 9/10th was rendered extremely difficult owing largely to adverse weather, although hits were scored on the electrified railway north east of the junction.
The possibility of the enemy using the PARIS/ORLEANS route to effect troop movements led to a request for the destruction of the marshalling yard at ORLEANS on 10/11th. The mission was successfully undertaken, all through lines being severed and further damage sustained to rolling stock railway depots etc.
The attack on POITERS on 12/13th in which very severe damage was inflicted on the railway facilities was designed to delay the 2nd S.S. Division, believed to be moving up from South France.
On the same night support was given to our troops advancing East and West of CAEN, by the further bombing of the town’s road bridges.
The Lehr Panzer Division is reported to have visited AUNAY SUR ODON on the same night as aircraft from this Group, namely, 14/15th. AUNAY is completely obliterated – speculation is rife as to the fate of the Panzers.
Photos taken the day following the attack on the LIMOGES marshalling yard (23/24th) indicate that fires were still burning in the area, and that all tracks in the sorting sidings have been blocked.
AT VITRY LE FRANCOIS on 27/28th damage was almost entirely confined to the west end of the marshalling yard where all the tracks have been cut. Other damage throughout the yard is apparent.
For 48 hours the spotlight of war turned from the battlefield to the sea, to the harbours of LE HAVRE and BOULOGNE where a powerful force of small craft had been assembled by the enemy with a view to menacing our supply lanes. It is now reported that as a direct result of the two raids on 14/15th and 15/16th no fewer than 80 vessels have been sunk or seriously damaged. Damage to port installations is also severe.
Oil targets have been attacked sporadically since the war began, but in the knowledge that the enemy is suffering from fuel shortage we returned on three occasions to attack his resources.
At CHATELLERAULT on 15/16th a fuel dump was raided, considerable damage resulting to storage units.
The attacks on WESSELING and SCHOLVEN Synthetic Oil Plants on 21/22nd were not, however, satisfactory and, influenced by bad weather conditions, were off the mark.
During the month two gardening operations were undertaken, on 6/7th and 8/9th.
In the concluding phases of June our attention was diverted from Normandy to the rather more immediate problem of combating the flying bombs which had commenced to operate over this country on 12/13th. On the whole, weather was exceedingly unco-operative, but, despite this, 10 missions were launched (three of which,
(Continued on page 4 Col. 2)
WAR EFFORT
[Table of Operations with Sorties, Accidents and Stars Awards, by Squadron]
Squadrons are placed in the above table in order of “successful sorties per average aircraft on charge”. In view of their special duties, Nos. 83, 97, 617 and 627 Squadrons are shown separately. In cases where a crew has flown aircraft of another squadron, the sortie is divided between the two squadrons.
5 GROUP NEWS. NO.23. JUNE, 1944.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
V Group News, June 1944
5 Group News, June 1944
Description
An account of the resource
Five Group Newsletter, number 23, June 1944. Includes a foreword by the Air Officer Commanding, and features about gunnery, air bombing, navigation, armament, navigation training, public relations, signals, gardening, equipment, air sea rescue, recent good shows, and shows not so good, engineering, training, flight engineers, enemy agents - careless talkers, signals, second thoughts for pilots, accidents, radar / nav, honours & awards, photography, aircrew volunteers, war savings, link trainer, flying control, operations, and war effort.
In accordance with the conditions stipulated by the donor, this item is available only at the University of Lincoln.
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
1944-06
Contributor
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Anne-Marie Watson
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Format
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18 printed sheets
Language
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eng
Type
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Text
Identifier
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MStephensonS1833673-160205-27
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1944-06
1944-06-05
1944-06-06
1944-06-08
1944-06-09
1944-06-14
1944-06-15
1944-06-16
1944-06-19
1944-06-20
1944-06-22
1944-06-24
1944-06-25
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
France
Germany
Great Britain
Atlantic Ocean--English Channel
England--Lincolnshire
England--Nottinghamshire
France--Boulogne-sur-Mer
France--Caen
France--Étampes (Essonne)
France--La Pernelle
France--Le Havre
France--Limoges
France--Paris
France--Rennes
France--Saint-Pierre-du-Mont (Landes)
France--Saumur
France--Vitry-le-François
Germany--Wesseling
France--Villers-Bocage (Calvados)
Germany--Ruhr (Region)
5 Group
617 Squadron
627 Squadron
83 Squadron
97 Squadron
air gunner
air sea rescue
aircrew
bomb aimer
bomb dump
bombing
bombing of the Boulogne E-boats (15/16 June 1944)
bombing of the Le Havre E-boat pens (14/15 June 1944)
bombing of the Normandy coastal batteries (5/6 June 1944)
Bombing of the Saumur tunnel (8/9 June 1944)
bombing of the Siracourt V-weapon site (25 June 1944)
bombing of the Watten V-2 site (19 June 1944)
bombing of the Wizernes V-2 site (20, 22, 24 June 1944)
Distinguished Flying Cross
Distinguished Flying Medal
ditching
flight engineer
Gee
H2S
Heavy Conversion Unit
Lancaster
mine laying
navigator
Normandy campaign (6 June – 21 August 1944)
pilot
radar
RAF Dunholme Lodge
RAF Scampton
RAF Swinderby
RAF Syerston
rivalry
service vehicle
tactical support for Normandy troops
tractor
training
wireless operator
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/759/17795/MCruickshankG629128-150428-060003.2.jpg
8cbf776a9fadc910e57a3621af30ba5c
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/759/17795/MCruickshankG629128-150428-060004.2.jpg
b109b967038bc191f40b52ca49b426ec
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Cruickshank, Gordon
G Cruickshank
Description
An account of the resource
76 items. Concerns the life and wartime career of Flight Lieutenant Gordon Cruickshank DFM who joined the Royal Air Force in 1938. After training as an air gunner he flew 52 operations on Manchester and Lancaster with 50, 560 and 44 Squadrons. Collection consists of a 1956 memoir with original photographs donated separately, a memoir of his life on squadron from December 1941, his logbooks. a further notebook with memoir, playing cards annotated with his operations, official documents, lucky mascots, medals and badges, dog tags, memorabilia, crew procedures, as well as photographs of aircraft, targets and people.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Linda Hinman and catalogued by Nigel Huckins
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2015-04-28
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
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Cruickshank, G
Access Rights
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Permission granted for commercial projects
Transcribed document
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Transcription
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[Prime Minister crest]
10, Downing Street,
Whitehall,
[underlined] A.O.C.-in-C., BOMBER COMMAND [/underlined]
We must plainly regard the attack of the Lancasters on the U-boats engine factory at Augsburg as an outstanding achievement of the Royal Air Force. Undeterred by heavy losses at the outset 44 and 97 Squadrons pierced in broad daylight into the heart of Germany and struck a vital point with deadly precision.
Pray convey the thanks of His Majesty’s Government to the officers and men who accomplished this memorable feat of arms in which no life was lost in vain.
[signature]
[underlined] April 18. 1942. [/underlined]
[page break]
[photograph]
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Letter from the Prime Minister to A.O.C.-in-C. Bomber Command on Augsburg operation
Description
An account of the resource
Congratulatory letter concerning daylight operation by Bomber Command Lancasters on U-boat factory at Augsburg. 'Undeterred by heavy losses at the outset 44 and 97 Squadrons pierced in broad daylight into the heart of Germany and struck a vital point with deadly precision.' Thanks those who 'accomplished this memorable feat of arms'.
Accompanied by a head and shoulders portrait of Squadron Leader John Nettleton VC who led the operation.
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
1942-04-18
Format
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One page typed letter and one b/w photograph
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Germany
Germany--Augsburg
Great Britain
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1942-04-17
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
MCruickshankG629128-150428-06
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Civilian
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Contributor
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Steve Baldwin
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Winston Churchill
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
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Text. Correspondence
Text
44 Squadron
97 Squadron
bombing
Bombing of Augsburg (17 April 1942)
Churchill, Winston (1874-1965)
Lancaster
Victoria Cross
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/286/17755/LKirbyH1637087v1.1.pdf
f5d1d4f26477231c35ba4d430b6f4fd0
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Kirby, Harold
Harold V A Kirby
H V A Kirby
Harold Kirby
H Kirby
Description
An account of the resource
Nine items. Two oral history interviews with Warrant Officer Harold Kirby (1923 - 2022, 1637087 Royal Air Force), his log book, photographs and documents. He flew operations as a flight engineer with 467, 97 and 156 Squadrons.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2015-07-10
2015-09-21
2016-06-11
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Kirby, H
Requires
A related resource that is required by the described resource to support its function, delivery, or coherence.
Warrant Officer Harold Kirby 1637087 was born in Kilbourne, Loncon in 1923, his job after leaving school was in the accounting department at London Electric Supplies. He initially tried to volunteer for the RAF but failed the medical, at that time. He was subsequently drafted in 1942. Skill training started with training as a Flight Mechanic, but during this was asked to volunteer to rain as a Flight Engineer. His first posting was as an Aircraft Fitter at No.460 Squadron, RAF Binbrook, although only for 6 months.
After Flight Engineer training at St Athan and then training on the Short Stirling and then the Lancaster with 1661 Heavy Conversion Unit at RAF Winthorpe, the first solo flight for the crew, the port landing gear would not lock, during the landing the gear collapsed, although there were no injuries.
First operational unit was No.467 Squadron at RAF Waddington a mainly Australian Squadron, the crew were here for July and August 1944, One operation 3/4th August 1944, to the V1 storage site at Trossy Saint Maximin had another bomber flying above their aircraft and dropping their bombs, one going through the wing, narrowly missing vital structures, this resulted in a gear up landing, due to hydraulic loss, but again there were no injuries resulting.
He was then posted along with the crew to No 97 Squadron, based at RAF Coningsby a pathfinder squadron, tasked to mark the targets for other aircraft,
In total two tours were completed before the end of the European war, after finishing as a Flight Engineer, Harold trained as a RADAR mechanic, before leaving the RAF.
Andy St.Denis
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Title
A name given to the resource
Harold Kirby’s flight engineers log book
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Great Britain. Royal Air Force
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
One colour photocopy of a booklet
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
LKirbyH1637087v1
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1944
1944-07
1944-08
1945
1944-07-12
1944-07-13
1944-07-17
1944-07-20
1944-07-21
1944-07-22
1944-07-23
1944-07-24
1944-07-25
1944-07-26
1944-07-27
1944-07-28
1944-07-29
1944-07-30
1944-08-01
1944-08-02
1944-08-03
1944-08-19
1944-08-24
1944-08-25
1944-08-26
1944-08-27
1944-08-29
1944-08-30
1944-08-31
1944-09-18
1944-09-19
1944-09-23
1944-09-24
1944-10-14
1944-10-15
1944-10-28
1944-10-29
1944-11-06
1944-11-07
1944-11-21
1944-11-22
1944-11-23
1944-11-26
1944-11-27
1944-12-04
1944-12-05
1944-12-06
1944-12-07
1944-12-09
1944-12-17
1944-12-18
1944-12-19
1945-01-07
1945-01-08
1945-01-13
1945-01-14
1945-02-07
1945-02-08
1945-02-09
1945-02-13
1945-02-14
1945-02-20
1945-02-21
1945-02-22
1945-03-03
1945-03-04
1945-03-05
1945-03-06
1945-03-07
1945-03-20
1945-03-21
1945-03-22
1945-04-08
1945-04-09
1945-04-16
1945-04-17
1945-04-18
1945-04-19
1945-04-25
1945-04-26
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Mike Connock
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Text. Log book and record book
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Belgium
Czech Republic
France
Germany
Great Britain
Norway
Poland
Russia (Federation)
Belgium--Kortrijk
Atlantic Ocean--Baltic Sea
Czech Republic--Chomutov
Czech Republic--Plzeň
England--Lincolnshire
England--Nottinghamshire
France--Caen
France--Calmont
France--Creil Region
France--Givors
France--Hesdin
France--La Pallice
France--Lens
France--L'Isle-Adam
France--Villers-Bocage (Calvados)
Germany--Braunschweig
Germany--Darmstadt
Germany--Dortmund-Ems Canal
Germany--Dresden
Germany--Giessen (Hesse)
Germany--Hamburg
Germany--Heilbronn
Germany--Kiel
Germany--Leipzig Region
Germany--Mittelland Canal
Germany--Mönchengladbach
Germany--Munich
Germany--Sassnitz
Germany--Stuttgart
Norway--Bergen
Norway--Tønsberg
Norway--Trondheim
Poland--Gdynia
Poland--Police (Województwo Zachodniopomorskie)
Russia (Federation)--Kaliningrad (Kaliningradskai︠a︡ oblastʹ)
Germany--Münster in Westfalen
Germany--Ruhr (Region)
Description
An account of the resource
Flight engineers log book (Copy) for H Kirby covering the period from 26 April 1944 to 24 May 1945. Detailing his flying training and operations flown. He was stationed at RAF Winthorpe, RAF Syerston, RAF Waddington and RAF Coningsby. Aircraft flown in were Stirling and Lancaster. He flew a total of 44 operations. 6 daylight and 10 night operations with 467 squadron and 28 night operations with 97 squadron pathfinder force. Targets were Culmont Chalindrey, Caen, Courtrai, Kiel, Stuttgart, Givors, Cahagny, Siracourt, Cassan, Trossy St Maxim, La Pallice, Darmstadt, Konigsberg, Rollencourt, Mönchengladbach, Munster, Brunswick, Bergen, Dortmund-Ems Canal, Trondheim, Munich, Heilbronn, Giessen, Gdynia, Politz, Ladbergen, Dresden, Gravenhorst, Bohlen, Sassnitz, Hamburg, Lutzkendorf, Pilsen, Komatau and Tonsberg. His pilot on operations was Flying Officer Ryan.
1661 HCU
467 Squadron
8 Group
97 Squadron
aircrew
bombing
bombing of Dresden (13 - 15 February 1945)
Bombing of Trossy St Maximin (3 August 1944)
crash
flight engineer
forced landing
Heavy Conversion Unit
Lancaster
Lancaster Finishing School
Lancaster Mk 3
Normandy campaign (6 June – 21 August 1944)
Pathfinders
pilot
RAF Coningsby
RAF Syerston
RAF Waddington
RAF Winthorpe
Stirling
tactical support for Normandy troops
training
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/509/17753/PDobleRG1513.2.jpg
70236c2ed5c785d4bb6489dd3e986d73
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/509/17753/PDobleRG1514.2.jpg
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https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/509/17753/PDobleRG1515.2.jpg
bc1630b2b014f5159bea65a11cf3a5a3
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Doble, Ronald George
R G Doble
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Doble, RG
Description
An account of the resource
13 items. An oral history interview with Ronald George Doble (3030256 Royal Air Force) his log book, service documents and photographs. George Doble served as a wireless operator / air gunner with 97 Squadron
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2015-11-17
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Requires
A related resource that is required by the described resource to support its function, delivery, or coherence.
Andrew St.Denis
Sergeant Ronald Doble – 3030256. Was born in London and initially served in the Air Training Corp, No,336 Squadron before joining the RAF aged 18, towards the end of WWII. Starting training for Radio Operator and Air Gunner, but switching to focus on Gunnery, this was on Wellington’s at Morton-in-Marsh. Completing training at No.1660 Heavy Conversion Unit at RAF Swinderby and then No.1653 HCU at RAF Lindholme, both in Lancaster’s the war in Europe had finished. Joining No.97 Squadron at RAF Hemswell, flying in Lincoln’s he flew as a rear gunner and took part in equipment tests such as Rebecca/Eureka, Radio Navigation equipment. After leaving the RAF Ronald entered an apprenticeship as a panel neater, building body’s for Talbots and Sunbeams at Rootes Group.
Factual ‘CV’
20 August 1945 – 9 November 1945: No 2 Air Gunnery School at RAF Dalcross – Aircraft: Wellington.
10 November 1945 - 1 November 1946: 21 Operational Training Unit at Moreton-in-Marsh – Aircraft: Unknown.
1 November 1946 – 9 November 1946: 1660 HCU at RAF Swinderby – Aircraft: Lancaster.
10 November 1946 – 26 March 1947: 1653 HCU at RAF Lindholme – Aircraft: Lancaster.
27 March 1947 – 1 July 1947: 97 Squadron at RAF Hemswell, Lincolnshire – Aircraft: Lincoln.
Biography
Born in Hammersmith, London to a working-class family, Ronald George Doble recounts his service in the RAF before leaving in 1947. Doble left school, aged thirteen, to work behind a guillotine cutting metal. Upon witnessing the bombing of London during the Second World War, Doble joined the fire watchers, tasked with dealing with the fallout of oil bombs before making the choice to join the RAF, beginning at the Air Training corps. Soon after he was sent to Grove court air crew receiving centre. Here he recalls a memory of a group of him and his new friends playing around with a mess tin which flew through the window and fall onto a flight sergeant with fifty men on parade. Doble was then sent to Yatesbury, where he was picked up as a wireless operator air gunner, undergoing a nine-month course.
Finding that there was no longer any use for his position, Doble went to Clapham, London where he took an educational course in preparation for taking the aptitude test at RAF Regiment Locking. Upon passing the test, he was posted to the Initial Training Wing at Bridgenorth. Once completing training at Bridgenorth, Doble was moved to Dalcross Air Gunnery school before proceeding to move to Moreton-in-Marsh, 21 operational training unit, then to the 1965 HCU and then finally ending up in Hemswell in Lincolnshire. However, when he and other gunners began to be de-ranked, they made the decision to leave the RAF and chose to continue an apprenticeship in Filey, making Sunbeams, Talbots, and Humbers Bodies. Within this job, Doble would get lead poisoning before being left without a job and finishing his career as a panel beater on car repairs in Haddenham.
This collection including an oral interview, with reference to stories ranging from attempting to carry a piano out of a building during a bomb attack and getting stuck and running out of oxygen whilst attempting to do a drogue firing. https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/8411 There are also multiple photographs detailing the different services he was part of and the men he served with, as well as some of the aircrafts he flew. One such photograph shows Doble as well as other RAF airmen being introduced to King George VI and his family with an ‘x’ added by a fellow airman to show Doble amongst the men. https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/17743 The collection includes an article about a Bomb Aimer and Navigator who refused to fly, destroying their maps in the process. Despite being allowed to fly after this event, they did so again and was ultimately charged with Lack of Moral Fibre. https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/17746 Finally, Doble’s log and service and release book shows his service across his entire career as well as the aircrafts he flew in each place, something which he explores within his oral interview. Upon his release, Doble was described as an ‘extremely capable and efficient worker… of a very pleasant and cheerful nature’, and once again his interview serves to reflect the type of man he was and still is. https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/17747
Amy Johnson
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Ted Haywood & Tom Carter
Description
An account of the resource
Two photographs, the first is of two airmen, one squatting and one standing behind. It is captioned 'Ted & Tom Bomb aimer & w/op 21 OTU'.
The second is a larger version of the same image and on the reverse is
'F/Sgt Tom Carter W/Op
F/Sgt Ted Haywood B/A
My crew members
21 OTU 97 Sqdn
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
Two b/w photographs
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Photograph
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
PDobleRG1513, PDobleRG1514, PDobleRG1515
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
21 OTU
97 Squadron
aircrew
bomb aimer
Operational Training Unit
training
wireless operator
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/509/17745/LDobleRG3030256v1.1.pdf
eadac433e9204b80e96356e6ca03ae28
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Doble, Ronald George
R G Doble
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Doble, RG
Description
An account of the resource
13 items. An oral history interview with Ronald George Doble (3030256 Royal Air Force) his log book, service documents and photographs. George Doble served as a wireless operator / air gunner with 97 Squadron
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2015-11-17
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Requires
A related resource that is required by the described resource to support its function, delivery, or coherence.
Andrew St.Denis
Sergeant Ronald Doble – 3030256. Was born in London and initially served in the Air Training Corp, No,336 Squadron before joining the RAF aged 18, towards the end of WWII. Starting training for Radio Operator and Air Gunner, but switching to focus on Gunnery, this was on Wellington’s at Morton-in-Marsh. Completing training at No.1660 Heavy Conversion Unit at RAF Swinderby and then No.1653 HCU at RAF Lindholme, both in Lancaster’s the war in Europe had finished. Joining No.97 Squadron at RAF Hemswell, flying in Lincoln’s he flew as a rear gunner and took part in equipment tests such as Rebecca/Eureka, Radio Navigation equipment. After leaving the RAF Ronald entered an apprenticeship as a panel neater, building body’s for Talbots and Sunbeams at Rootes Group.
Factual ‘CV’
20 August 1945 – 9 November 1945: No 2 Air Gunnery School at RAF Dalcross – Aircraft: Wellington.
10 November 1945 - 1 November 1946: 21 Operational Training Unit at Moreton-in-Marsh – Aircraft: Unknown.
1 November 1946 – 9 November 1946: 1660 HCU at RAF Swinderby – Aircraft: Lancaster.
10 November 1946 – 26 March 1947: 1653 HCU at RAF Lindholme – Aircraft: Lancaster.
27 March 1947 – 1 July 1947: 97 Squadron at RAF Hemswell, Lincolnshire – Aircraft: Lincoln.
Biography
Born in Hammersmith, London to a working-class family, Ronald George Doble recounts his service in the RAF before leaving in 1947. Doble left school, aged thirteen, to work behind a guillotine cutting metal. Upon witnessing the bombing of London during the Second World War, Doble joined the fire watchers, tasked with dealing with the fallout of oil bombs before making the choice to join the RAF, beginning at the Air Training corps. Soon after he was sent to Grove court air crew receiving centre. Here he recalls a memory of a group of him and his new friends playing around with a mess tin which flew through the window and fall onto a flight sergeant with fifty men on parade. Doble was then sent to Yatesbury, where he was picked up as a wireless operator air gunner, undergoing a nine-month course.
Finding that there was no longer any use for his position, Doble went to Clapham, London where he took an educational course in preparation for taking the aptitude test at RAF Regiment Locking. Upon passing the test, he was posted to the Initial Training Wing at Bridgenorth. Once completing training at Bridgenorth, Doble was moved to Dalcross Air Gunnery school before proceeding to move to Moreton-in-Marsh, 21 operational training unit, then to the 1965 HCU and then finally ending up in Hemswell in Lincolnshire. However, when he and other gunners began to be de-ranked, they made the decision to leave the RAF and chose to continue an apprenticeship in Filey, making Sunbeams, Talbots, and Humbers Bodies. Within this job, Doble would get lead poisoning before being left without a job and finishing his career as a panel beater on car repairs in Haddenham.
This collection including an oral interview, with reference to stories ranging from attempting to carry a piano out of a building during a bomb attack and getting stuck and running out of oxygen whilst attempting to do a drogue firing. https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/8411 There are also multiple photographs detailing the different services he was part of and the men he served with, as well as some of the aircrafts he flew. One such photograph shows Doble as well as other RAF airmen being introduced to King George VI and his family with an ‘x’ added by a fellow airman to show Doble amongst the men. https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/17743 The collection includes an article about a Bomb Aimer and Navigator who refused to fly, destroying their maps in the process. Despite being allowed to fly after this event, they did so again and was ultimately charged with Lack of Moral Fibre. https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/17746 Finally, Doble’s log and service and release book shows his service across his entire career as well as the aircrafts he flew in each place, something which he explores within his oral interview. Upon his release, Doble was described as an ‘extremely capable and efficient worker… of a very pleasant and cheerful nature’, and once again his interview serves to reflect the type of man he was and still is. https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/17747
Amy Johnson
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Ron Doble's flying log book for navigators air bomber air gunners flight engineers
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Description
An account of the resource
Flying log book for navigators air bomber air gunners flight engineers for R G Doble, air gunner, covering the period from 10 September 1945 to 1 July 1947. Detailing his flying training, instructor duties and post war squadron duties with 97 Squadron. He was stationed at RAF Dalcross, RAF Morton-in-Marsh, RAF Swinderby, RAF Lindholme and RAF Hemswell. It also details his post war civilian flying. Aircraft flown in were, Wellington, Lancaster, Lincoln, C-47, Chipmunk, Jodel, Queen Bee and VC-10. The log book also contains an invitation to the graduation of 108 course at RAF Dalcross and handwritten notes for a talk on his RAF career.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Great Britain. Royal Air Force
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Mike Connock
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
One booklet
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Text. Log book and record book
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
LDobleRG3030256v1
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
England--Gloucestershire
England--Lincolnshire
England--Yorkshire
Scotland--Inverness
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1945
1946
1947
1653 HCU
1660 HCU
21 OTU
97 Squadron
air gunner
Air Gunnery School
aircrew
C-47
forced landing
Heavy Conversion Unit
Lancaster
Lincoln
Operational Training Unit
RAF Dalcross
RAF Hemswell
RAF Lindholme
RAF Moreton in the Marsh
RAF Swinderby
training
Wellington
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/286/17597/BKirbyHKirbyHv10001.2.jpg
bdcbf1186906b889ce4a0ffc400704d5
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/286/17597/BKirbyHKirbyHv10002.2.jpg
978427648e228a886e838723d2f0e46f
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Kirby, Harold
Harold V A Kirby
H V A Kirby
Harold Kirby
H Kirby
Description
An account of the resource
Nine items. Two oral history interviews with Warrant Officer Harold Kirby (1923 - 2022, 1637087 Royal Air Force), his log book, photographs and documents. He flew operations as a flight engineer with 467, 97 and 156 Squadrons.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2015-07-10
2015-09-21
2016-06-11
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Kirby, H
Requires
A related resource that is required by the described resource to support its function, delivery, or coherence.
Warrant Officer Harold Kirby 1637087 was born in Kilbourne, Loncon in 1923, his job after leaving school was in the accounting department at London Electric Supplies. He initially tried to volunteer for the RAF but failed the medical, at that time. He was subsequently drafted in 1942. Skill training started with training as a Flight Mechanic, but during this was asked to volunteer to rain as a Flight Engineer. His first posting was as an Aircraft Fitter at No.460 Squadron, RAF Binbrook, although only for 6 months.
After Flight Engineer training at St Athan and then training on the Short Stirling and then the Lancaster with 1661 Heavy Conversion Unit at RAF Winthorpe, the first solo flight for the crew, the port landing gear would not lock, during the landing the gear collapsed, although there were no injuries.
First operational unit was No.467 Squadron at RAF Waddington a mainly Australian Squadron, the crew were here for July and August 1944, One operation 3/4th August 1944, to the V1 storage site at Trossy Saint Maximin had another bomber flying above their aircraft and dropping their bombs, one going through the wing, narrowly missing vital structures, this resulted in a gear up landing, due to hydraulic loss, but again there were no injuries resulting.
He was then posted along with the crew to No 97 Squadron, based at RAF Coningsby a pathfinder squadron, tasked to mark the targets for other aircraft,
In total two tours were completed before the end of the European war, after finishing as a Flight Engineer, Harold trained as a RADAR mechanic, before leaving the RAF.
Andy St.Denis
Transcribed document
A resource consisting primarily of words for reading.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
[underlined] Harold Kirby – Service in the R.A.F. 1942 – 1946 [/underlined]
Called up August 12th 1942. Initial training at Skegness August – September 1942.
Posted to Halton to train as Flight Mechanic (airframes) the first intake of conscripts to do this training there. Passed out sufficiently highly to go on to take Fitter course.
During the period at Halton volunteered to train as Flight Engineer. Called to take aptitude tests and medical, and was accepted. (Early in 1942 I had tried to get in as Navigator with two school friends, but was turned down on medical grounds. They were both accepted and were later shot down, so perhaps I was lucky). While waiting for the F/E course was posted to 460 Squadron. Arrived at Breighton to find that they had moved to Binbrook about two weeks earlier. Billeted at Breighton overnight, and transported to Binbrook the following day, where I worked for about six months servicing and repairing Lancasters. [inserted] June ? Nov 43 [/inserted]
Eventually instructed to report to A.C.R.C, St Johns Wood, to be kitted out as aircrew and then posted to St. Athan for F/E course. After passing out was posted to 1661 H.C.U. at Winthorpe, where I joined an otherwise all Australian crew captained by (then) P.O. Bill Ryan, with Les Sabine (Navigator), Jim McPhie (Bomb Aimer) Johnny Nichols (W/O) Bert Newing (Rear Gunner) and Norm Johnston (Mid-Upper). At Winthorpe training was on Stirlings, and after initial flights with an instructor we took off on our first solo. However the port undercarriage leg would not lower, and had to be wound down by hand, but would not lock. Instructed to fly to Woodbridge where on landing the port U/C collapsed and we spun round. No-one was hurt and we flew back to base in another aircraft that the pilot-instructor had followed us down in. No further panics and we were posted to 467 Squadron at Waddington via 5LFS Syerston.
On our first operation Bert shouted “corkscrew”, shots were fired, and a twin-engined aircraft (not identified) shot past our nose and vanished into the night. During the shooting a bullet passed through the rear turret making a hole through Bert’s flying suit, but it was not clear whether this came from the unidentified aircraft or another of our own shooting at it. In any case I began to think that there could be better ways of spending one’s time.
However things went a little smoother after that until our 11th Op which was a “daylight” to Troissy. Flying at the briefed height bombs started falling around us and one went through the port wing taking away the undercarriage. It was not possible to see the full extent of the damage and I was asked to feather the port inner engine, just in front of the hole that the bomb had made, in case of fire. We were soon left behind by the rest of the force and were all alone in the sky until the rear gunner announced that two single-engined aircraft were approching [sic] from the starboard quarter,. After what seemed to be an age he said “it’s all right, they’re Spitfires” and one of them escorted us to the coast. A close watch was kept on the port wing which seemed (imagination?) to be flexing more than the other, and it was decided to land at Wittering, which had, at the time, a grass runway, rather than going on to base. As the landing gear and flaps were out of action due to the loss
[page break]
of hydraulic fluid we did a belly landing. Again no-one was hurt but the Skipper had a strip torn off him by Flying Control for spoiling their runway. When we saw the hole that had been made by the bomb it was found that it had missed both the front and rear spars only by inches.
After our 16th operation we were posted to 97 (Pathfinder) Squadron, then based with 83 Squadron at Coningsby, where we completed our first tour of 30 operations with a 10 hour trip to Politz in Poland. We went on to do a second tour, a shorter one of 15, and all but completed this with our 44th on the 25th April 1945.
The crew then split up and as I was no longer required for aircrew duties I chose a Radar Mechanics Course at Yatesbury, Wiltshire. After completing the course I was posted to West Ruislip, where I was able to live at home in Kingsbury and travel to Ruislip each day by tube, prior to being demobbed in November 1946.
Wanting to do something more technical than my earlier civilian job I joined the G.E.C. and trained as a Patent Agent at the Reseach [sic] Laboratories in North Wembley. Qualified in 1955 and retired in 1988, though still working one or two days a week. The rest of the time taken up by gardening, badminton, tennis or taking it easy.
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Title
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Service record from August 1942 until November 1946 November
Description
An account of the resource
Starting with conscription in 1942 as a flight mechanic at RAF Skegness. Working up to a flight engineer but failing as he started working at RAF Halton training as a flight mechanic, then attending a fitter course. Volunteered for the flight engineer course at RAF Binbrook for six months servicing Lancasters, then Aircrew Receiving Centre St John's Wood for flight engineer course. After that at 1661 Heavy Conversion Unit at RAF Winthorpe with the 467 Squadron, to serve with an all Australian aircrew for the rest of the war. After demobilisation he joined the GEC as a Patient Agent at the Research Laboratories in North Wembley until he retired in 1988.
Creator
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Harold Kirby
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Two page typewritten document
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eng
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BKirbyHKirbyHv10001, BKirbyHKirbyHv10002
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Royal Australian Air Force
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1942-08
1946-11
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
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IBCC Digital Archive
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Great Britain
England--Buckinghamshire
England--Lincolnshire
England--Nottinghamshire
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Tricia Marshall
1661 HCU
460 Squadron
467 Squadron
8 Group
97 Squadron
aircrew
bomb struck
bombing
Bombing of Trossy St Maximin (3 August 1944)
crash
fitter airframe
forced landing
ground crew
Heavy Conversion Unit
Lancaster
Lancaster Finishing School
mechanics airframe
Normandy campaign (6 June – 21 August 1944)
Pathfinders
RAF Binbrook
RAF Coningsby
RAF Halton
RAF St Athan
RAF Syerston
RAF Waddington
RAF Winthorpe
recruitment
Stirling
training
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/1288/17230/AHarrisDR190508.1.mp3
6a11b42596b674bae0164350fdeba8e7
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Title
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Harris, Donald Raymond
D R Harris
Description
An account of the resource
Three items. An oral history interview with Flight Sergeant Donald Harris (B. 1925, 1877136 Royal Air Force) and two photographs. He served as an air gunner on 625 Squadron Lancaster at the end of the war when he flew on Operation Manna.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Donald Harris and catalogued by Nigel Huckins.
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
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2019-05-08
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
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Harris, DR
Transcribed audio recording
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Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
HB: Right. This is an interview for the International Bomber Command Centre Digital Archive on the 8th of May 2019 between Harry Bartlett, volunteer with the Digital Archive and Mr Donald Raymond Harris who served in Bomber Command during the Second World War. Well, thank you for agreeing to the interview Don. The interview is taking place at Earls Barton in Northamptonshire, where Mr Harris lives. Right. Don, well like all good stories we start at the beginning so where were you born?
DH: Acton, London.
HB: Right. Oh right, and did you, you went to school there did you? Yeah.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah.
DH: A Common School. A Common School.
HB: A Common School. Oh right. So, you were at that school until what sort of age?
DH: Fourteen.
HB: Fourteen. Right. And so that would be, yeah we would be talking about the year war was breaking out.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah. So, as you came to fourteen did you, did you leave school and go to work straightaway?
DH: Yeah. Yeah.
HB: At fourteen.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah. And what sort of things did you do, Don?
DH: What? Work?
HB: Yeah.
DH: Teaboy.
HB: Right.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Well. That’s, that’s what the official title was. I was the teaboy.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And I had to travel from Acton in London to Slough to go to work. I had to catch a lorry that took me down there with all the men.
HB: Right.
DH: Digging the road up, laying gas mains.
HB: Right.
DH: That’s what my Reserved Occupation was because gas mains were being bombed. Broken. All kinds of things. So we had to go out and repair them. And there had to be a teaboy because you could not allow the men to walk off to get cigarettes or tobacco or whatever else.
HB: Oh.
DH: I had to do it. I had to go and get the men’s, whatever they wanted. They weren’t allowed to leave the job.
HB: Right.
DH: So that was the original.
HB: Yeah.
DH: It was rather amusing in as much that being totally ignorant and fourteen years old I also had to tidy up round the office. There was an office for the ganger and I had to tidy up coke because it spread you know. That kind of thing. And I found a little package about that big. Didn’t know what it was so I took it in to the boss’s office and I opened it and it was all the men’s wages. The stupid agent had hidden it amongst the coke.
HB: Oh dear.
DH: So, I locked the office, went up to see the ganger. What was his name? Dave. No. No. Anyway, the ganger. I went up to him. I just took him to one side. I said, ‘I found a package.’ He said, ‘What?’ I said, ‘I found a package,’ I said, ‘And it’s got all the men’s wages.’ ‘Come with me.’
HB: Right. Yeah.
DH: So, he went there and he counted how many wages there were which was right. He said, ‘Ok.’ He wanted to make sure —
HB: Yeah.
DH: I hadn’t put one aside. But that was some of the interesting things as a very young boy.
HB: Yeah.
DH: At fourteen years old.
HB: Yeah. Who, who were you actually working for?
DH: At that time it was a company called O C Summers.
HB: Right. Right.
DH: That was the name of the company.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Eventually, I mean I got rather well known and when that job finished I came back to London, worked with another ganger in [pause] it was in Shepherd’s Bush. Which is near, well not near but reasonably near home. I could go there by bus. So that was the second one. Then [pause] when that work finished, you know we’d go to another job. And it was then that my brother was reported missing in Burma.
HB: Oh right.
DH: I did get a lot of information because a friend of mine daughter went up to London and got a lot more information about them. He was the 3rd Carabiniers, which was tanks and they did a silly thing. They drove their tank up and they saw a tank, a Japanese tank on its own. And as far as they can learn all the people, there were five, four members of that tank that were captured by the Japs. They don’t know what happened to them. Never found any remains or anything like that.
HB: So, what year would that be Don?
DH: Oh, fairly early in the war.
HB: Yeah.
DH: When they first got to Burma.
HB: Right. Right. Yeah.
DH: That’s when it was. But she got a lot of information. Although they couldn’t find the graves or anything like that they itemised the four people that were missing because that’s, they had to report them missing.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: They put up a memorial then. I think it was Calcutta. With their names on it.
HB: Right. Yeah.
DH: But that’s all.
HB: Right.
DH: I got to sixteen so it must have ‘39 or ‘40/41 time.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Then I decided then that I would want to go in to the Service and the eldest brother was in the Royal Corps of Signals.
HB: Right. Yeah.
DH: He was the eldest.
HB: So, let me just stop you there, Don. So, there’s you, two brothers.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Mum. Dad. Any other family in there? There? Sisters?
DH: No. My sister died before the war.
HB: Oh right. Right.
DH: She was twenty five.
HB: Oh dear.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah. So, yeah. Sorry. So, yeah. You decided that you were going to join.
DH: Yeah.
HB: The Services.
DH: I wanted to join it. Now, there was a unit in Acton, in the school there which, what the devil was the name of the people training for the Air Force?
HB: Air Training Corps.
DH: Yeah. It was. And that was in a big school. High school. Up in there. And I went there once a week. Only to once a week and it was quite interesting because we went through lots of things. Not guns. Not guns.
HB: No.
DH: But radio. Morse Code. All that lot. You know.
HB: Yeah.
DH: So that was interesting. Then I got a letter to report to a place up where the balloons flew from. I can’t get it yet because I do forget.
HB: Yeah.
DH: But anyway —
HB: Oh, well, that’s understandable. Yeah.
DH: Where the in the balloons. We went there and we went through several tests and it came out that I’d remembered some of the Morse Code [laughs]
HB: Oh right. Right.
DH: Anyway, it was a little while later on when I got a letter to report to St John’s Wood.
HB: Right. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Yeah. Report there. And they entered me as a wireless operator air gunner.
HB: Oh, w/op. Yeah.
DH: And once I got used to being in London the next place I moved to was Bridlington.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Just to make sure I wasn’t near home like.
HB: Yeah.
DH: But I had a sergeant. Brilliant. Blakey. Sergeant Blakey. He was absolutely brilliant. And our particular unit we got the highest recommendations. He was brilliant. Absolutely. Only a small fella but a sergeant and he really was good.
HB: So, was it, was this your, like doing your basic training —
DH: Yeah.
HB: Don.
DH: Oh yeah.
HB: Right. So, so we’d be talking what now? We’d be talking, coming up 1943/44.
DH: Yeah.
HB: That sort of the time.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And we had twelve bore guns shooting out to sea.
HB: Oh right. Yeah.
DH: It was great. And this was the first time in my life I’d ever run six miles. Run. And I had to run from the coast back to my camp. And I thought oh. I laid down on a bed when I got back and I was puffing and at my age I should have been fit. Anyway, that was that. Then I got sent to [pause] oh Christ. A wireless school was at [pause] isn’t it funny? I can’t remember. Big city. Big city and, you know Hartleys Jam and things.
HB: Yeah.
DH: They owned the land that we were on.
HB: Right.
DH: And they said if ever you want to work come and work in the fields with all the fruit —
HB: Lovely.
DH: Got paid.
HB: So that, so that would be [pause] was that north? Did you go north?
DH: No. Never.
HB: Or, I’m just trying to place because there were one or two wireless schools.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Knocking about.
DH: Yeah. No, that was [pause] Hereford.
HB: Hereford. Right. Yes. Yeah.
DH: Hereford.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And while I was there I got ill and of course the sick quarters was well, kind of a hospital. Kind of. But the girls who were nurses only went for the officers. And then they sent me to a hospital. Credenhill Hospital. I’ve remembered that right down to the last word. The nurses there were like lady so and so.
HB: Oh.
DH: Oh yeah. And they were really good. They were good. And I met another bloke named Don and we both could play darts.
HB: Oh, right. Yeah.
DH: And we used to go in to town, go in to a pub. That was our first shall we say attempt of them getting their beer for nothing but instead of that we both could play darts.
HB: Right.
DH: And so we didn’t buy a pint. They did. Yeah. No, this is all reacting because I was ill. I really was. How I got to the hospital I don’t know. I was out.
HB: What did you have? Did you have some sort of pleurisy? Or —
DH: Cold and chill and something else.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: It was all luck. And that, then I went back to the school. You know the —
HB: Yeah. The wireless school.
DH: Went to see the officer in charge and I said, ‘We’re not getting anywhere.’ I said, ‘Nobody is wanting wireless operators. There’s plenty of them.’ There was. I said, ‘I want to remuster. Air gunner.’ He said, ‘Yeah. If you wish to do that we could do it.’ So I remustered as an air gunner. And do you know what they stamped on my docs? Lack of moral fibre. Yeah. If you found my documents you’d find it’s got, “Lack of Moral Fibre,” on them because I remustered. I remustered to a more dangerous bloody job.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Anyway, I wanted that and they sent me to the island at the beginning of the Thames.
HB: Sheppey.
DH: Sheppey. Which was a Fighter Command. They sent me there. They were Typhoons, Tempests. That’s what they were and they used to start them with a long cartridge. They’d be turning it over with the battery and then he’d fire it which would kick the engine over and start.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Well, the engine was a Napier. Made by Napier’s anyway and oh they were powerful things. God, they were powerful. It only took a very short distance to take off.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: And it was really, talk about noisy. Christ. Totally different to the Spitfire.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Totally different, but it was good. So, from there I was sent to Bridgnorth.
HB: Were you? Yeah.
DH: Bridgnorth was a Gunnery School and there we did all the necessary flashlights and bit of this and bits of that and stripped the gun down and put it back. But it was just right. I liked it. I really did. And anybody that didn’t read the Morse Code with the lamp didn’t get in.
HB: Right.
DH: I did. I could read it easy. It didn’t make any difference. So, I finished there and sent me home. Home.
HB: Right.
DH: Until I got a summons to go to Aylesbury.
HB: Yeah.
DH: There was a main aerodrome and a sub. A little one.
HB: Yeah. Little satellite. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Yeah. And we were in Wellingtons. Lovely aircraft but a bugger to fly and even at one time the skipper, who was, who was New Zealand, he called me up from the turret, ‘Come up and help me.’ So of course, I went up there and said, ‘What’s the matter, skip?’ He says, ‘Help me push this bloody thing down.’ [laughs] Because Aylesbury is all hilly.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: And the draught coming up was coming up and lifting us instead of going down.
HB: Oh dear.
DH: So I got in to the co-pilot’s seat and shoved it and we got down.
HB: Was this, so this was an Operational Training Unit.
DH: Oh yeah.
HB: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Yeah. Well, we used to have to turn the engines over by hand.
HB: Yeah. Yeah. How did, how did you get in to a crew there? Did it —
DH: When we went to the main aerodrome.
HB: Yeah.
DH: There. We got all the crew sorted out. We didn’t do it.
HB: Oh right.
DH: They did it.
HB: Right.
DH: So, the pilot was New Zealander. The bomb aimer was New Zealander. The wireless operator was Irish. Irish. Not Northern Ireland. Irish. Our mid-upper gunner was Scotch. Bob. I even remember where he lived. Edinburgh. The main road. That’s where he lived. And me. So that’s six of us. We hadn’t got the engineer.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And we went oh several times. We went over, we had to fly over London to let the air people shoot at us. But they were told to shoot low [laughs] and also the searchlight.
HB: Oh right. Yeah.
DH: Because the searchlights taught them and us.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: And then we flew back to Aylesbury. That’s where we were going. So we landed at the auxiliary aircraft because the other place was busy. We landed and we, you know that type of aircraft the Wellington was kind of a big aircraft. But it’s also marvellous for keeping flying even if it had got a hole in the side, you know.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And all of a sudden we got a warning and all the lights went on. Americans landed because they couldn’t land at their aerodrome so they could land at ours and of course they’d got all these big fur coats and Christ knows what else on. Oh, and they were, got their big aircraft with four engines, you know. All this. A couple of the English blokes there said, ‘Yeah. You go underneath our wings, don’t you?’ Almost caused a fight but never mind. From there we went to just north of Stamford. There was an aerodrome on the farm land that done it and they had Stirlings. Bloody great things. Seventeen foot to the bottom of the aircraft. We weren’t interested in that. We transferred from there to Lancasters and we were trained on the Lancasters. Now —
HB: Can you can you remember what that airfield was? Was it Woolfox? No.
DH: It was about three miles outside Stamford.
HB: Right. Yeah.
DH: On the main road by the way. A1.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And the airfield was on the right, and we had interlopers follow our aircraft in and they bombed the bloody girl’s place. WAAFs. Killed a lot of them.
HB: Oh dear.
DH: But anyway, that’s good. We did further training and for the skipper’s point of view nobody else. Him and me. And we practiced corkscrewing.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Do you know what that is?
HB: Yeah. Well, you. You tell me what it is.
DH: Well —
HB: I presume you were a rear gunner.
DH: Oh yeah.
HB: Yeah.
DH: We took off. Got up to a height and then we were looking for fighter. And it was there was the fighter. The skipper said, ‘Can you see what it is?’ I said, ‘Yeah. A Spitfire.’ [laughs] So, he said, ‘Right,’ he said, ‘So, is he within range?’ I said, ‘No. Miles away.’ It was amazing I could recognise it. Anyway, all of a sudden I saw this Spitfire getting closer and closer and when it got to about six hundred feet I said, ‘Corkscrew port go.’ And of course, where does the tail go? Voom.
HB: Straight up in the air.
DH: Straight up [laughs]. And I had a camera.
HB: Yeah.
DH: On the guns and I followed it to the word. Down, port, up starboard oh. Got a complete film. Complete film. So the Spitfire broke away. Waggled to say good. And that was it as far as I was concerned. And then we got back, landed and that afternoon of course the cameras went in to the photography department and they, we got a call over a tannoy, ‘Warrant Officer Mitchell and crew attend the Photography Unit.’ I thought oh, I must have made a mistake. Instead of that the bloke that did it, it was an officer and he said, ‘Watch it.’ He said. It only goes for a short while because you’re down. Up. Up. Up. You know. So we did. The film was absolutely perfect.
HB: Oh right.
DH: And this officer turned around and he said, ‘You’ve got one of the best gunners that I’ve tested.’ He said, ‘That pilot was dead from the first shot.’
HB: Really?
DH: Yeah. I thought well that’s —
HB: Yeah.
DH: And then we had the other test to show that we were fit for action. It was, you know, the usual things. Aircraft recognition.
HB: Yeah.
DH: How to load your guns and all that kind of thing. And then we all had to attend a meeting with the people who were in charge of all of that and he said, ‘We’ve got some good results.’ What was he? A squadron leader, I think. And he said, ‘We’ve got some exceptionally good people.’ So, he said, ‘136.’ I said, ‘Yes.’ ‘You’ve got nineteen and a half points.’ I said, ‘Out of how many?’ ‘Twenty.’ Nineteen and a half out of twenty. And the one thing I forgot. Where [pause] you know how the bullets go down a tray.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Into the turret. Up into the guns. Right. Now, when you stop these continue to run.
HB: Yeah.
DH: So something has got to stop them. At the bottom of the tray here there’s a hole like that which just fits the bullet. So it goes into that hole and it stops running.
HB: Right.
DH: And that’s what I missed.
HB: Oh.
DH: And my mid-upper gunner got nineteen. Just shows you doesn’t it?
HB: That’s, it’s still pretty good.
DH: To me it was of interest because I wanted to be perfect as a —
HB: Yeah.
DH: It’s a, I’m a defender.
HB: Yeah.
DH: You know. So, we did. It was good.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And then from there I went to oh I can’t remember the name. I did tell you.
HB: Was this being posted to a squadron?
DH: Yeah. 625.
HB: 625, yeah.
DH: Which was, come on. It’s six miles outside. North of Lincoln. It’s a permanent station.
HB: At Scampton.
DH: Scampton.
HB: I wasn’t supposed to help you there but —
DH: No.
HB: I thought I would.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Being as you got nineteen and a half for your gunnery I thought I’ll let you have that.
DH: Yeah. Yeah. We were Scampton. We did. We did. I’ll tell you what I liked about what we did. I’m not talking about killing people I’m talking about what I liked. We flew to Holland. Instead of bombs we had sacks of food.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Marvellous. I was so pleased to see that.
HB: Do you remember what that operation was called?
DH: Yeah. Because we had to follow the sign on the, painted on the roof of the hospital. And it was two fields beyond and we had to drop the food there. One silly pilot flew underneath another one and when [laughs] it went straight through the cockpit.
HB: Blimey. Yeah.
DH: Flew. Flour everywhere. Daft.
HB: Did you know that was called Operation Manna?
DH: No.
HB: Manna from heaven.
DH: No.
HB: Yeah.
DH: I know I liked it. We were only a hundred feet high.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And as we flew along, I mean the roads and everything else I got a clear view because as you know there was no back in the turret.
HB: Yeah.
DH: I was amazed to see this German and a machine gun but he wasn’t anywhere near it. He stood well back.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And when I looked at him I thought Christ he could only be fifteen. Fourteen. Fifteen. And we were told not to get near the guns. Good job because I mean we were all loaded.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: And we flew back over the sea at a hundred feet. I didn’t like that.
HB: No. I can imagine.
DH: No. Not really.
HB: Yeah.
DH: It was alright but I mean we trusted the skipper obviously but I just didn’t like it. It was too near the sea.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Which is going to, but no. They said we mustn’t fly.
HB: Had you actually flown any night operations before that, Don?
DH: We were on the battle order two or three times.
HB: Yeah.
DH: But we didn’t go. We went out to the aircraft. Went to the nice little café in the middle of the airfield. You know where I mean?
HB: Yeah.
DH: And it was nice because we got eggs and bacon and a few —
HB: Who was running that café? Was that —
DH: Yeah. Lovely.
HB: Was that the WAAFs running that or —
DH: No.
HB: No.
DH: No. The Air Force.
HB: Yeah.
DH: They ran that.
HB: Yeah.
DH: It was really nice. It really was. We thought we would get a call in a minute which you were liable to do. If you get one of the others calling with the breakdown of engine or whatever else then we would have gone.
HB: Yeah.
DH: But I think we, four, four times. Yeah. And that was at Scampton.
HB: Right. Right. So you were, you were like the reserve group.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Ready to fill in.
DH: We were the first reserve. Yeah.
HB: Yeah.
DH: But that’s what they said when you said you were on the Battle Order. You are. You’ve got to obey whatever. Another thing we did there was when the, when the troops were advancing over in Germany and France and Belgium directly they got to this Air Force place. Well, it became an Air Force place. It was Belgian place. We were told to go there, land, switch off your engines. Switch off.
HB: Right.
DH: Yeah. Because there were still some bomb holes in the [laughs]and they were filling them in quick.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And we were bringing in prisoners of war home. And we brought them to England.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Buckinghamshire, I think somewhere. And then we flew home.
HB: Right.
DH: And we did that twice.
HB: So you, so you flew from Scampton.
DH: Yeah.
HB: You flew over to Belgium.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Parked up if you want to call it that.
DH: Yeah.
HB: And then how would the prisoners of war arrive?
DH: Oh, they were there in, this was the stupid part. They were there and they had fed them. Fed.
HB: Oh.
DH: Yeah. You can imagine. They fed them beautiful meals and when we got them on board. Oh —
HB: Yeah.
DH: It was a bit rough. But anyway, we got them home. Directly we landed in Buckinghamshire somewhere and unloaded them. Then we flew back. And then they had the job of cleaning the aircraft.
HB: Who? Who cleaned the aircraft?
DH: Ground crew. Yeah. They had power hoses and everything.
HB: Yeah.
DH: But there again at least we got some of them back home.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: We then got orders to move to [pause] I can never remember the name. I wasn’t there long. Where the bombers are? Where you went.
Other: Coningsby.
HB: Coningsby.
DH: Coningsby. We got there. We were just getting settled in and what’s the squadron? 97? [pause] And about three days later we were called into operations room. We had to fly to Italy.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And we went. There’s two areas which we could have gone to. But the one we chose was at the foot of Vesuvius. Right at the foot. We landed at Naples Airport but we couldn’t take off because the runways weren’t long enough with a load of people on board.
HB: Oh.
DH: We were —
HB: So this was all still part of Operation Exodus.
DH: Oh yeah.
HB: Bringing the prisoner of war home.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Right.
DH: But those there were mainly officers.
HB: Yeah.
DH: What was it called? Lamy? Lamy camp?
HB: Could be. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Yeah. I think it was.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And they were nearly all officers. So —
HB: This is, this is still in Lancasters.
DH: Oh yeah.
HB: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Oh yeah.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: The dodgy bit was with a load of people on board. As the gunner it would have been my job to dash about with an oxygen mask for each one to have a puff. But I never made it. I was ill.
HB: Right.
DH: Yeah. I went into this hospital in [pause] just south of Naples. It’s a little place. And I was in there for two or three weeks. When I came out I went and saw the sergeant that was in charge of getting people home and I said, ‘Right. When can you get me home?’ I said, ‘My skipper’s gone.’ I said, ‘He’s already taken off.’ Because the Yanks came and right at the end of the runway was trees.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And I’m afraid their big load of stuff took off and they had all the trees [bulbed] out and the runway lengthened.
HB: Oh right.
DH: So that they could get off.
HB: Yeah.
DH: It’s purely luck. Not anything else. It was warm.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Naples.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Warm. Christmas time. And we had our Christmas dinner in the palace at Naples.
HB: Oh right. Yeah.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah. What rank were you at this stage?
DH: Flight sergeant.
HB: You were a flight sergeant. Right. Yeah.
DH: Nice. Everything. Then they said, ‘You’ve got to fly.’ ‘Oh,’ I said, ‘Good.’ So, I said, ‘What do you want me to do?’
HB: ‘Act as a rear gunner.’
DH: I said, ‘Well, I won’t act at it,’ I said, ‘I am one.’ So, he said, ‘Oh. Alright.’ So, he said, ‘Well, you’ve got to look after the men on board.’ Twenty. Twenty men. Apart from the crew, you know.
HB: Yeah.
DH: We couldn’t take more than that because we had to go over the Alps.
HB: Oh yeah. Yeah.
DH: The air is different.
HB: Yeah.
DH: So, we did go over the Alps. And it was a bit of job to go amongst all the people so I got the mid-upper gunner to do the same for the other ten. So I did ten and he did ten.
HB: Right. This was with the oxygen.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Well, up there over the Alps there is no oxygen, virtually.
HB: Yeah.
DH: So —
HB: So, did they give you extra oxygen bottles for them? Or —
DH: Oh yeah. Portable ones.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Or you could plug it in where ever you had it.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Where the hospital bed was, you know.
HB: Yeah.
DH: There was one there.
HB: That’s up, so that’s up by the main spar.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Going through. Yeah.
DH: So, you’d got all kinds of things that you could use. But we did. We got over the other side of the Alps and we came down to a nice level. Twenty thousand was nice. And we suddenly got a broadcast. The skipper, we still had plug in and this skipper whoever he was, and I’ve still no idea who he was said, ‘We’re not going home.’ I said, ‘What?’ ‘No.’ He said, ‘Fog in England. Covered in fog.’ So we couldn’t land. I knew we could if we’d have gone on FIDO.
HB: What, what was FIDO?
DH: Fog dispersal. They had the runway covered in a pipe with loads of holes and big huge tanks of petrol and they pumped it through and lit it and that just lifted the fog. Very dangerous if the skipper wasn’t alert because the heat from the [pause] would lift it.
HB: Lift the aircraft. Yeah.
DH: Anyway, that, we didn’t go. So we had to land in southern France. Now that was not popular. We landed. We were told to switch off the engines and sit in the aircraft. Not leave it. That was the Frenchmen. Well, didn’t like that.
HB: Yeah.
DH: We were fighting for them as well. Anyway, we sat there and it must have been about midnight I think because we took off at 9 o’clock in Italy.
HB: Yeah.
DH: When we got down in France as I said we sat there and then we got clearance from England.
HB: Yeah.
DH: So, the engineer went out, primed the engines, started them and we took off and we landed somewhere near the Wash. Well, that’s where FIDO is.
HB: Oh right.
DH: Yeah. I mean it was quite interesting actually to know that we couldn’t use FIDO. Mind you it would have used a hell of a lot of fuel.
HB: Yeah.
DH: It gets pumped through at a hell of rate.
HB: Yeah.
DH: But we knew all about it because we were told about it. We couldn’t train on it but we were told about it and it was quite interesting but then I wasn’t at my aerodrome.
HB: No. Of course not. No.
DH: The people there were looking at it. How can I get home? And suddenly this officer came and he said, ‘I’ve just been brought down here by a vehicle. He’s going to go back. Not quite to your aerodrome but he will take you there.’ I thought oh thank God for that. You know.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And we went up through Boston. Lovely.
HB: Yeah.
DH: What was that? Bloody hell. What was that station? Dogdyke.
HB: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: What a name for a station. Dogdyke.
HB: Yeah.
DH: That’s the station’s name. So, we went back there. I said, well I’ll need a bed.
HB: Just bear with me a second, Don. I’ll just pause this a second just while the tea —
[recording paused]
HB: Right. We just turned the tape back on after we’ve been provided with tea and biscuits. So, we’ve got these officers from Italy. We’ve come back and we’ve landed.
DH: The van.
HB: At Dogdyke.
DH: It was a van.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Took me right back.
HB: Took you all the way up to Dogdyke.
DH: Yeah. They took me to the entrance.
HB: Right.
DH: Yeah. Yeah. I walked in. Well, I didn’t walk in. They, I got stopped at the gate but when I said who I was and what I was. ‘Oh,’ he said. ‘Yeah. The adjutant wants to see you.’ So, I thought how did he know I was. I thought to myself they must have told him in Italy. Anyway, I said, ‘Well, it’s a bit late now. I doubt very much if he’s there.’ So, I said, ‘Is he still there?’ ‘No.’ I said, ‘Well, I’ll need a bed for tonight.’ The bloke said. ‘We’ve allocated you one already.’ So I went there and evidently it was a new crew that had just, there was a spare bed.
HB: So, I bet you were popular.
DH: Well no. There was a spare bed. I don’t know why. But anyway. I went to bed and I did sleep. I really did sleep. I didn’t know what was going on. The next bed to me the bloke said, ‘You were dreaming.’ I said, ‘Was I?’ He said, ‘Yeah.’ He said, ‘And it sounded pretty bloody awful.’ ‘Oh.’ I felt alright you know.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Anyway, I got up. Got dressed. Went to see the adjutant. What’s going on. I didn’t know then so I said, ‘You wanted to see me sir.’ ‘Yeah.’ ‘Alright. What’s going to happen because my crew’s not here.’ He said, ‘No. They’re on your way to New Zealand.’ I said, ‘What?’ ‘Yeah. Two have gone to New Zealand, one’s gone to Edinburgh, one’s gone to Ireland, the other one to London.’ I thought, ‘Oh.’ ‘Yes,’ he said, ‘And you are on your way to Uxbridge. Do you know where it is?’ I said, ‘Oh, yeah [laughs] Do I know where it is?’ So, I said, ‘Why am I going now for?’ ‘Demob.’ ‘Oh.’ ‘You sound surprised.’ I said, ‘Well, I am. I like the Air Force.’ ‘No,’ he said, ‘You can’t.’ Just like that. He said, ‘You’re going. In front of me are all your train passes. All your leave passes. And you will be going to Dogdyke Station.’ That’s why I remembered it.
HB: Right.
DH: So that I had to go from there to Boston. Train to London. Get another train from there to Uxbridge. You get out at Uxbridge and there would be a vehicle waiting for you. It was well organised. It really was well organised. I mean that. Everything was like he said. Got to Uxbridge. Looked. There was a vehicle. I said, ‘Where are we going now?’ ‘Oh, Wembley.’ ‘What for?’ He said, ‘Demob.’ I thought, Christ. They’ve done that all in the time that the phone message going from Italy. Now, that is some organisation.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Bloody well is. Really is.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And of course, when I got to Wembley they were ready for me. Gave them my paper. I got my shoes [laughs] blue suit, shirt, tie. All complete. Everything was there.
HB: What did you have? Did you have a cap or a trilby hat?
DH: Trilby.
HB: I thought. Yeah. Trilby.
DH: And that was it.
HB: Yeah. After those years that you’d spent just finished.
DH: Yeah. No, they, once he said, ‘You’re going back,’ I knew what he meant because obviously the amount of damage created by the bombs was tremendous in London and that’s where we worked.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Oh Christ. We even laid a main on top of the pavement. On top of it. To pump water because water mains down below were broke.
HB: So how quick did you go back to doing your job from being demobbed?
DH: Straightaway.
HB: You didn’t have any leave or anything or —
DH: Oh no.
HB: No.
DH: No.
HB: Right.
DH: Straightaway.
HB: And did you go back to, was it OC Summers, was it?
DH: Yeah.
HB: You went straight back to them.
DH: Yeah.
HB: And they, had they kept your job for you?
DH: Oh yeah.
HB: Yeah.
DH: They had to.
HB: Yeah.
DH: So then —
HB: So, what job did you go back to, Don?
DH: As a joint maker.
HB: Right.
DH: A joint maker. It’s one that the sockets and spigots enter one another and then you put yarn in and then you run hot lead in. And then you set it up.
HB: Yeah. Ok.
DH: Good. It was very very complicated. I used to go with a ganger and then they’d come and get me to take me to another ganger to run his joints for him.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And then go back to it.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Like that.
HB: So, what, what year would this be then, Don?
DH: The end of the war.
HB: ‘45/46.
DH: Yeah ’46.
HB: ’46. Yeah.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah. Can I just take you back a little bit, Don?
DH: Yes. Yes. Yes.
HB: You know, before you joined you were in Acton. You would have gone through the Blitz.
DH: Oh yes.
HB: And your family. You had bombing around Acton.
DH: Yeah. We had a bomb in the bottom of the garden [laughs].
HB: In the bottom of the garden.
DH: Well, I had a big garden.
HB: Oh right. Well, yeah.
DH: We had a long garden.
HB: Yeah.
DH: It must have been about a hundred feet long. Something like that.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And the bomb was at the bottom. It did kill a boy. Sixteen year old in the house opposite [unclear]
HB: Yeah.
DH: He got caught, you know.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Terrible. Yeah. I was there when the fires were roaring like hell. A big red glow in the docks.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Yeah.
HB: And so, so obviously you’ve come through that. Did you actually ever fly a live, I’ll call it a live operation to actually drop bombs?
DH: No.
HB: Right. Right. So, you come towards the end of the war. You’re what by now? You’re nineteenish. Twentyish. What about girlfriends?
DH: No.
HB: Social life.
DH: Not interested.
HB: Did you not have a social life in the RAF?
DH: No. The only social life was in a pub in Lincoln.
HB: Right. Right. Right. Yeah.
DH: And it was in the cattle market. There used to be a cattle market.
HB: Yeah.
DH: There was a cattle market in Lincoln and there was a pub in the cattle market.
HB: So, yeah, so you come to the end of the war. You’ve gone back to OC Summers and you’re now doing a jointer, a jointer’s job and did you, did you just carry on with them then?
DH: Them. Yeah. For forty years.
HB: Forty years.
DH: Yeah. Because they count service as working for them.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: That was, oh before, before the forty years I was made a ganger and I went in to a gas works which I never expected.
HB: Oh right.
DH: Because that was a vastly different type of job. You do all kinds of heavy lifting. Crane work and everything else.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Now, I was the ganger there. The original ganger was ill and died and I took over.
HB: Right.
DH: Directly I took over they started to do big work. I ended up with, you know twenty five men doing different jobs.
HB: Yeah.
DH: I couldn’t cope because I couldn’t be everywhere at once.
HB: No. No.
DH: So, I asked the governor who I knew personally, I asked him if he could get me some men with knowledge. And one of the men he sent in was a ganger that I worked for.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And he came, he came in and he says, ‘Hello Don.’ I said, ‘Hello,’ I said, ‘Christ, I haven’t seen you — ’ because he was very experienced. And he said, ‘Yeah,’ he said, ‘Don’t let it worry you.’ He said, ‘You’ve got the responsibility. Not me.’
HB: Yes.
DH: See. And he was a very nice bloke.
HB: Yeah.
DH: He really was.
HB: Yeah.
DH: I mean, we used to go fishing together. We went, particularly when we worked night work I drove him home in the morning and then we’d drive out. —
HB: Oh right.
DH: And go fishing.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Anyway, Sammy Jefferies his name was. A really, a nice bloke. And he was [pause] amazed at the work I was doing. We had a forty eight inch main, gas main which gathered all the gas out the tanks into pumps, in to a main and so forth. And I had to cut a bit out of the gas main. We used to cut. Put a collar on and then put another bit of pipe in and draw the cord up. And that’s the first forty eight inch joint I’d run.
HB: Right.
DH: And what we had to do was we had a twelve inch ladle. Twelve inch. Quite deep. We filled that up first and then one bloke stood there, one bloke stood there with another nine inch ladle to top me up if I said so. Because if I couldn’t see that we were going to run it we could run out of lead so we pulled it in to my ladle and then I ran it.
HB: Yeah.
DH: So we did it. And the senior engineer in the gas works he had done a bit of district work, what we called district work and he stood there the whole time that I got it apart. Because we put gas bags up the main.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: To stop gas coming through. Well, we shut the valves but I mean —
HB: Yeah.
DH: If they leaked.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And that was me. I came. They took me out of the works, Summers and put me in charge of a gang that’s going on holiday. A gang of men. So, I did that. Then they sent me to another one by St Pancras Station where there was a T-junction. And the lid was around but it was leaking bad. So the main there was eighteen. Eighteen. Eighteen inch. What I had to do was shut it off. So I ordered twenty four inch bags to put in there so that a twenty four inch bag would fill it.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Up.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Take the lid off. Re-drill it. Put new bolts in. Whip it out. And put it in. You’d be surprised. It’s really quite a technical job.
HB: I wouldn’t be surprised. I’d be terrified.
DH: Bloody hell. But after I’d been there for forty years John Laing —
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: Bought Summers because we were making money. So, they bought OC Summers. I lost [pause] well, twenty one years pension because Summer’s pension wasn’t as active to buy me equipment.
HB: Yeah. Yeah. I see what you mean. Yeah.
DH: So this posh speaking man from Laing came down to one of Summer’s depots which I was then responsible for all depots and he came down and he said, ‘Well, I’m afraid this is what is going to be.’ I said, ‘No. It isn’t.’ I said, ‘You’ve knocked twenty one years off my pension,’ I said. ‘And that’s not on,’ I said, ‘And I’ve got with me several agents who have got over twenty years on sites and I want twenty years pension.’ He said, ‘Are they the agents that’s running the area?’ I said, ‘Yeah.’ And he said, ‘Oh, I’ll have to see what I can do.’ And if they all packed up the jobs would stop.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: And eventually he came back and he said, ‘We’ve made arrangements that when you do get to retirement we will give you a gift of money to go in to your pension. Not to you. To the pension.’
HB: Right.
DH: No.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Actually, they did. I did do well in a way. The firm because the old managing director came with the job, got six thousand pound.
HB: Right. Right.
DH: When you put it in the figures to get six thousand pound like that meant a little bit each month. Only a little bit.
HB: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: But there you go.
HB: Yeah. So, so you’ve, we’ve gone up to retirement. But you must have got married at some stage.
DH: Oh yes. I did. Oh yes. She was a typist in the gas works.
HB: So that would be, what? Nineteen —
DH: Oh God.
HB: Fifty something.
DH: A bit later than that I think. Well, you can work it out if you like. I didn’t get married until I was thirty eight.
HB: Oh right. Right. So you were thirty eight. Right. Well, yeah. Yeah. That’s, yeah, yeah so you —
DH: My wife.
HB: You were well on. Yeah.
DH: Yeah. And because I’d lived in a house all my life I could not live a flat.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And she had three boys.
HB: Oh right. Right.
DH: Eighteen, sixteen and fifteen. And I said to her, I said, ‘I can’t live in a flat.’ She said, ‘What are we going to do?’ I said, ‘We’re going to buy a house.’ She said, ‘We haven’t got any money.’ I said, ‘I know we haven’t.’ I said, ‘But I know what I’m doing. We’ll go and find a house first. Then we’ll go to Lambeth Borough Council and because this is a flat owned by Lambeth Borough Council they’ll willingly give us the money so that we get out.’
HB: Right. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: It’s true. That is what they did.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And then the first house we bought was in Mitcham, Surrey and it was six thousand pound [laugh] And don’t laugh but that six thousand pound.
HB: Yeah.
DH: But that was a hell of a drain on the money.
HB: Oh, it would have been yeah in those days. Yeah. Yeah.
DH: So, yeah and then the firm decided to make me the depot manager of Watford.
HB: At Watford. Right.
DH: Yeah. But on condition I moved.
HB: Right.
DH: Because I had to be near it because we were on duty day and night. Still mending gas mains.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: So, the pleasant surprise was that it was the firm’s solicitor that dealt with the sale. That means that they paid.
HB: That saved you a few pounds that way. Yeah.
DH: Oh yes. Yes.
HB: Right.
DH: So, we lived in Bushey Mill Lane, Bushey. We lived in there for quite a long time.
HB: Right.
DH: I don’t know how long. Graham would probably tell you.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And we bought a house in Slip End which is near Luton.
HB: Right.
DH: Lovely house. Beautiful house. It was ideal. The first job we did was have double glazing.
HB: Because of the airfield. The airport. Yeah.
DH: Yeah. That was the first job. And unfortunately, she didn’t like it.
HB: Oh dear.
DH: It was a lovely house. You remember it. You liked it didn’t you?
Other: What I remember of it. Yeah.
DH: It was a really nice house. Four bedrooms. About two garages. Lovely. Anyway, she didn’t like it. Move. So we had to find somewhere to move to. So we moved to Sawbridgeworth.
HB: Yeah.
DH: So that is three miles north of [pause] Oh God. Shopped there long enough. Harlow.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Yeah. So, it wasn’t far from Harlow. Three miles. But it was a lovely little village.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Beautiful little village. And it had a direct train line to London.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Which of course is a benefit.
HB: Absolutely. Yeah.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Yeah. So you, so we’ve got we’re sort of coming to the end of that part. Just take you right back. Right back. Just something that’s sitting in my mind. When you went, when you did your training and you ended up at the Radio School at Hereford.
DH: Yeah.
HB: You, you were actually doing wireless operator training.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Operator training.
DH: Yeah.
HB: Did you do any air gun training at all there?
DH: No.
HB: No. So you were doing your wireless operator with a view eventually like a lot of them did you would go wireless operator and then you’d do an air gunner course and then you’d be wireless operator air gunner. Right. So I’m about right thinking like that. When they, when you said it’s not, you know it’s not working for me. I’m, you know I’m not happy with it. Did they ever give you a reason why they put it down as lack of moral fibre?
DH: No.
HB: They never gave you a reason.
DH: Never. I didn’t know they did it.
HB: Right.
DH: Until somebody found out for me.
HB: Right. Because were you keeping a logbook or a diary at the time?
DH: No.
HB: No? How strange.
DH: Yeah.
HB: How strange.
DH: No. It’s, it’s stamped across my documents. Where every they are or whatever they are.
HB: Right. That’s [pause] yeah I’ve, it’s just it suddenly, suddenly came to me. I’ve just never heard of that before. Ever. But then to become a rear gunner on a Lancaster. It’s a little bit contradictive to some extent.
HB: Yeah.
DH: Well, look I think we’ve come to a sort of a, bit of a natural conclusion, Don and thanks ever so much for tell me that to consider, considering that before we turned the tape recorder you said you thought that you wouldn’t be able to remember anything I think you’ve done really well. I really do. I think you’ve done well. And it’s, and it’s interesting that you’ve done Operation Manna feeding the Dutch, you’ve done Operation Exodus bringing the prisoners of war back because people only ever think of the Lancasters steaming off in to the night dropping bombs and like you say they were the humanitarian side of it.
DH: Yeah.
HB: As well. Yeah.
DH: I think that’s important.
HB: It is. It’s very important.
DH: And when you look at it the ones we picked up in Belgium some of them were ex-RAF.
HB: Yeah. Yeah.
DH: It’s inevitable isn’t it really when you think about it because the planes came down.
HB: Yeah.
DH: And they were put in the prison camps.
HB: Yeah. You were bringing your own home. Well, Don thank you ever so much and we are going to stop the recording because it is nine minutes past four and I think you’ve done an exceptional job, Don and thank you very much. Very useful.
Dublin Core
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Title
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Interview with Donald Raymond Harris
Creator
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Harry Bartlett
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
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2019-05-08
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
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Sound
Identifier
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AHarrisDR190508
Language
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eng
Coverage
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
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01:20:56 audio recording
Description
An account of the resource
Donald was born in Acton, London. He stayed at school until he was fourteen and then worked as a tea boy/general help for O. C. Summers, a firm that laid gas mains in Slough. When that job ended, he worked for another ganger in Shepherds Bush. Soon after he heard that one of his brothers was missing in Burma.
When Donald was sixteen, he joined the local Air Training Corps and later went to St. John’s Wood, where he was entered as a wireless operator / air gunner. He did his basic training at RAF Bridlington and was then posted to a wireless school in Hereford. While there he was taken ill and sent to hospital. On his recovery he asked to be re-mustered as an air gunner and was sent to the Isle of Sheppey to be trained on a Napier. He was then posted to RAF Bridgnorth gunnery school. After finishing the course, he was sent home until he was summoned to form a crew. The crew was posted to RAF Halton where they flew on Wellingtons. Their next posting was to RAF Wittering where they transferred to Lancasters. Donald was then posted to 625 Squadron at RAF Scampton. The squadron flew to Belgium and later to Italy to bring prisoners of war home. They also took part in Operation Manna over Holland. On returning to England the crew were split and Donald was posted to RAF Uxbridge and then demobbed. He went back to work at O. C. Summers until his retirement. At the age of 38 Donald married a typist who also worked for O. C. Summers.
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
Belgium
Italy
England--Buckinghamshire
England--Lincolnshire
England--Shropshire
England--Yorkshire
England--London
Netherlands
England--Cambridgeshire
England--Northamptonshire
England--London
England--Kent
England--Kent
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Sue Smith
Julie Williams
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1943
1944
1945
Conforms To
An established standard to which the described resource conforms.
Pending review
Pending revision of OH transcription
625 Squadron
97 Squadron
air gunner
aircrew
crewing up
Lancaster
Lancaster Finishing School
Operation Dodge (1945)
Operation Exodus (1945)
Operation Manna (29 Apr – 8 May 1945)
RAF Bridgnorth
RAF Bridlington
RAF Eastchurch
RAF Halton
RAF Scampton
training
Wellington
wireless operator / air gunner
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/1246/16339/LCannonHO1802390v1.2.pdf
02d1cc01bf3ac2be0e21622c8fc94ce7
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Neale, Ted
E T H Neale
Description
An account of the resource
123 items. The collection concerns Edward Thomas Henry Neale (b. 1922, 1395951 Royal Air Force) who served as a navigator with 37 Squadron in North Africa, the Middle East and Italy. The collection contains his training notebooks from South Africa as well as propaganda leaflets dropped by the allies in the Mediterranean theatre.
The collection also contains a photograph album, navigation logs and target photographs.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Alison Neale and catalogued by Barry Hunter.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2015-07-31
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. Some items have not been published in order to protect the privacy of third parties, to comply with intellectual property regulations, or have been assessed as medium or low priority according to the IBCC Digital Archive collection policy and will therefore be published at a later stage. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal, https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collection-policy.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Neale, ETH
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
H O Cannon’s observer’s and air gunner’s flying log book
Description
An account of the resource
Observer’s and air gunner’s flying log book for H O Cannon (1802390) air gunner, covering the period from 29 December 1943 to 3 November 1944 and from 16 October 1952 to 8 October 1953. He was stationed at RAF Moffatt, RAF Qastina, RAF Tortorella, RAF Upwood and RAF Hemswell. Aircraft flown in were, Anson, Wellington, Defiant and Lincoln. He flew a total of 28 operations with 37 Squadron 3 daylight and 25 night and 2 supply drops. Targets were, Brod Basanki, Smederavo, Romsa, Pardubice, Bucharest, Ploesti, Pesaro, Portes les Valences, Szombathely, Kraljevo, Genoa, Marseilles, St. Valentin, Miskolc, Bologna, Ravenna, Rimini, Hegyeashalom, San Benedetto, Borovnica, Tuzla, Ficarolo, Uzice, Klopot. His pilots on operations were Sergeant Reynolds, Major Bayford, Sergeant Merrick and Flight Sergeant Taylor.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Great Britain. Royal Air Force
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Mike Connock
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
One booklet
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Text. Log book and record book
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
LCannonHO1802390v1
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Austria
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Croatia
Czech Republic
France
Great Britain
Hungary
Italy
Middle East
Romania
Serbia
Slovenia
Zimbabwe
Austria--Sankt Valentin
Bosnia and Herzegovina--Tuzla
Croatia--Rijeka
Croatia--Slavonski Brod
Czech Republic--Pardubice
England--Cambridgeshire
England--Lincolnshire
France--Marseille
France--Valence (Drôme)
Hungary--Hegyeshalom
Hungary--Miskolc
Hungary--Szombathely
Italy--Bologna
Italy--Foggia
Italy--Ficarolo
Italy--Genoa
Italy--Pesaro
Italy--Ravenna
Italy--Rimini
Italy--San Benedetto del Tronto
Middle East--Palestine
Romania--Bucharest
Serbia--Kraljevo (Kraljevo)
Serbia--Smederevo
Serbia--Užice
Slovenia--Borovnica
Romania--Ploiești
Zimbabwe--Gweru
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1943
1944
1952
1953
1944-07-14
1944-07-15
1944-07-16
1944-07-17
1944-07-19
1944-07-20
1944-07-21
1944-07-22
1944-07-23
1944-07-24
1944-07-26
1944-07-27
1944-07-28
1944-07-30
1944-07-31
1944-08-03
1944-08-04
1944-08-07
1944-08-08
1944-08-09
1944-08-10
1944-08-13
1944-08-14
1944-08-15
1944-08-20
1944-08-21
1944-08-22
1944-08-23
1944-08-24
1944-08-25
1944-08-27
1944-09-12
1944-09-18
1944-09-20
1944-09-21
1944-09-22
1944-09-26
1944-09-30
1944-10-31
1944-11-04
1944-11-05
1944-11-06
1944-11-16
1944-11-23
1944-12-03
148 Squadron
37 Squadron
97 Squadron
air gunner
aircrew
Anson
bombing
Bombing and Gunnery School
Defiant
Lincoln
RAF Hemswell
RAF Upwood
training
Wellington
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/1193/11766/AWhiteEJ161027.2.mp3
3926b8da0bcdd604b2a2db30b9c6032f
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
White, Ernest James
E J White
Description
An account of the resource
An oral history interview with Squadron Leader Ernest James White (Royal Air Force). He flew operations as an air gunner with 9, 61 and 97 Squadrons.
The collection was catalogued by IBCC Digital Archive staff.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2016-10-27
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
White, EJ
Transcribed audio recording
A resource consisting primarily of recorded human voice.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
DK: Right. So it’s turned up. So, it’s David Kavanagh on the 27th of October 2016 interviewing Mr James White at his home. I’ll just put that there. If I keep looking over I’m just checking to make sure it’s going.
JW: It’s very neat.
DK: It is isn’t it. Ok.
JW: It’s picking us both up is it?
DK: It should be picking us both up. Yeah.
JW: That’s alright then.
DK: Just to make sure.
JW: Well I want to tell you about, I’m going bang in to the middle. We can go back to the beginning later on.
DK: Yeah. Ok.
JW: This one sets the scene for the whole lot really.
DK: Ok.
JW: Now, how far shall I go back? I’d better give you a run. First of all I was posted to 44 Squadron at Waddington first of all. I was only there four days and they, they posted me to Syerston. 61 Squadron. I was, I did about six ops with them and then they posted me to Woodhall Spa, 97 Squadron. I did a few there. Then I got crewed-up with Bob Fletcher. And then one day sitting in the crew room the squadron commander comes in, got attention, he says, ‘Right. I’ve got an announcement to make. Every one of you have been, have volunteered for Pathfinder duties. We’re going to move down to Bourn in Cambridge.’
DK: Right.
JW: That was great that was. So the thing was as a, as we were now in 8 Group different rules applied apparently. Don Bennett.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Was quite a force to be reckoned with, you know.
DK: Yeah.
JW: He did. He had a hell of a time with Sir Arthur from what I’ve read. Any rate, what happened was I’d done about sixteen operations altogether with odd crews before I was crewed-up. Then we moved down to Cambridge. Now, in Pathfinder force there is the normal tour is thirty operations. Which you know of course don’t you?
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: Well, when I got to my twenty ninth the crew, the target was Hamburg actually, coming back I said to the pilot, I said, ‘Look,’ I said, ‘This is my last trip and it’s your last trip next time.’ He said, ‘Yeah. We’re all going next time.’ I said, ‘Right, I’m going to volunteer to do another one so we all go together.’ This you’ll understand is the spirit of crew.
DK: Yeah.
JW: At that time you see. It’s madness really, you know. It really is madness.
DK: Yeah.
JW: To volunteer for an extra one. It was accepted. So I stayed on. And then they brought out this business of, in 8 Group if you’re in the Pathfinder force every operation you did counted as two. So instead of doing thirty you did, you did fifteen. Ok.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: Right. I’m on my fifteenth now. I’m taking on now. Now this, sorry that was the crews at hand over. Right. Coming back I said to Bob, I said, ‘I’m really due to finish but I’ll stay on. I’ll volunteer.’ He said, ‘You can’t.’ I said, ‘Why not?’ He said, ‘Because the gunnery leader has taken you off the crew list already.’ Before we’d even, before we took off you’re off. ‘He knew this was your last one and he’s put himself in your place. So he’s going to fly in your place.’ I was only a flight sergeant at that time and you don’t argue with a squadron leader do you?
DK: No.
JW: So off I went. Well, I did go off actually. I went home actually. I came back. The next morning I got to Cambridge station, came out the station and I saw an RAF truck there. I said, ‘That’s funny. What’s he doing there? I’ll get a lift back into camp.’ So I went there. It was our favourite driver there. I said, ‘What are you doing here?’ He said, ‘I’ve come to meet you.’ Well that’s very odd. I don’t get that privilege. That sort of privilege.
DK: No.
JW: I said, ‘Why? He said, ‘Well, I’ve got some bad news for you. The crew didn’t come back last night.’
DK: Oh God.
JW: Because the gunnery leader insisted in flying in my place.
DK: Yeah.
JW: He’s the one who got killed. Not me. Now, that’s very strange.
DK: It is.
JW: Now, I’ve gone over this over and over again. I dream about it sometimes. I fantasise on it. The thing was, you see my position was right on top of the aircraft. Mid-upper gunner there. It so happened that I was the only member of the crew that had an anti-glare panel because I got kitted out somewhere else apart from them. Now, what happened, I saw, I saw the captain afterwards, after the war when he came out of the prisoner of war camp. He survived and he told me exactly what happened. He said they got caught in the master searchlight. You’ve heard of this I expect, have you?
DK: Yeah.
JW: Light blue and, you know and they got coned. Now, he’s, he’s an extraordinary pilot that man was. Extraordinary. And he got out of it. He flew out of it. Right. Quite incredible. Now, the thing is he told me that fighter that got them came down from above because he was going down you see. He’d come down like, which is extraordinary unusual because they usually come from underneath.
DK: Yeah.
JW: We are told that. We are told at the briefing they attack from underneath. They introduced that technique. The Luftwaffe at the time. So I’m sitting there in this. Now, I’ve got the anti-glare so when the searchlight caught us, kept down. I can still see. They can’t.
DK: Yeah.
JW: They were all blinded. They couldn’t see. Couldn’t see a thing. Couldn’t see the dials on the dash board. But the pilot, as I say he was brilliant. A brilliant pilot he was and he got them out of it but when he got to the, he got out of it, the searchlights, right, but when he got to the bottom he’d lost so much height he’s got to get back up again.
DK: Yeah.
JW: So he starts climbing like this and that’s when the fighter pounced on them. Now, I’m sitting on top. Anti-glare. I can see.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Now had I been there instead of this other chap. Would I have seen that fighter?
DK: Yeah.
JW: Because we had quite a good crew. Well, an excellent crew actually and if I’d said to the pilot, ‘Dive to starboard,’ he would have gone down pfft. Down. He wouldn’t have been shot down probably. We don’t know that.
DK: No.
JW: We can’t tell that.
DK: Is it, is it something, were all the crew killed or [pause] yeah.
JW: But it does haunt you. It does. It is. I know just how close I was.
DK: Yeah.
JW: See. Having volunteered to do the bloody job he took me off. He wouldn’t, he wouldn’t accept my offer. He went on it himself.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And he got, he got immediate. He was killed instantly by the fighter. And the navigator and the other gunner, the rear gunner they were all killed.
DK: Right.
JW: The other four escaped with parachute.
DK: Oh right.
JW: And became prisoners of war.
DK: Right. So, so four survived and three were killed.
JW: And I’ve seen them. Well, I haven’t see Jack Beesley. I’ve got a picture of him there. I’ll show you in a minute. And the engineer. But I’ve been in touch with the wireless operator for a long time but when they were in the prisoner of war camp I knew his wife because I used to visit. They live at Grantham.
DK: Right.
JW: Now, I was in Scotland at the time so I was, I did as many journeys as I could down to London. Getting off at Grantham.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Go and see them. Getting on the train and carrying on you see. That was very handy.
DK: Yeah.
JW: So I kept that up for a long time. in fact, when, after the war when I was stationed in Germany at Munchen Gladbach I invited them out and they came out and spent a fortnight in Germany with me.
DK: Oh right. That’s nice.
JW: With his, with his two children.
DK: Yeah.
JW: So we had a close contact. That was our crew you see. You’ve probably heard stories like this before.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: But this was absolutely true. Hang on a minute. Just a minute.
DK: What I’ll do, I’ll just stop there. I’m —
JW: Ok.
[recording paused]
DK: Put that back up there. Ok.
JW: You’ll be interested in this.
DK: Ok. Ah.
JW: Now, after the war, as soon as the war was over the RAF sent, sent Lancasters over to Germany to bring back the released prisoners of war.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Now, that’s one of our Lancasters at 97 Squadron.
DK: Right.
JW: That, that was our bomb aimer Jack Beesley.
DK: Oh right.
JW: I don’t know who the other chaps are. I don’t remember the other chaps.
DK: Yeah.
JW: But from that picture I personally get a really strong feeling they were the men I knew.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Not the RAF today. These are the ones we knew. That, that encapsulates the spirit.
DK: Right.
JW: You’ve got there.
DK: Just for the benefit of the recording — so this is Lancaster PB422 of 97 Squadron.
JW: That’s right.
DK: And the person there is your —
JW: Jack Beesley.
DK: Jack Beesley. And he was your bomb aimer and that’s when he was returning.
JW: That’s right.
DK: As a POW.
JW: Yes. Yes.
DK: So I see there, the POWs have put various bits of graffiti on the aircraft.
JW: That’s [laughs] very typical I’m afraid. We, we were an irresponsible lot you know. Really.
DK: Did you go on any of the trips to pick up the prisoners?
JW: Sorry?
DK: Did you go on any of the trips to pick up the prisoners of war?
JW: Not me. No. I was out of Bomber Command.
DK: Oh right.
JW: I was in Training Command at the time.
DK: Ok. That’s a great photo isn’t it?
JW: Yeah. It’s a good one that.
DK: I always find photos like this where you see prisoners of war their faces always look very drawn. Very —
JW: Yeah.
DK: You can see he looks very, even there looks a bit tense.
JW: Actually I was told before they came home that he’d got religion while there.
DK: Right.
JW: It was the strain, you know. Things like that.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: But I think, I think he probably got out of it at that time.
DK: That’s alright.
JW: The relief of being released.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Released from prisoner of war camp must have been enormous mustn’t it?
DK: It must have been. Yeah.
JW: Something I never experienced of course.
DK: Yeah.
JW: But they’re the chaps, these here, they’re the typical of what the, what the crews were in in Bomber Command days. In the war you know.
DK: They look so young.
JW: Yeah. Aren’t they? Yeah.
DK: I’m assuming he’s the pilot then who’s flown him back.
JW: Yeah.
DK: He’s shaking hands. That one.
JW: Yeah. It’s amazing isn’t it?
DK: Yeah.
JW: I think that’s a very good picture.
DK: Lovely picture that.
JW: Tells us an awful lot doesn’t it?
DK: Yeah. What, what another thing I wanted to ask just stepping back a bit and that was just for interest what were you actually doing before the war?
JW: What was I doing before the war?
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: Not much. I was a wages clerk with the Co-op.
DK: Oh right. Ok.
JW: CWS Headquarters in London.
DK: Yeah. So what, what made you want you join the Air Force then?
JW: Well, it’s a long long story really. It started way back when I was, when I was a young lad. I had an uncle that lived at Mill Hill which is high ground overlooking Hendon Airfield.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And his house was on a bit there and I used to love going there because I used to see what was going on in the airfield down there. I think that’s where it started. But later on I got around to making models. I made a, I made a flying model of a Hurricane.
DK: Oh right.
JW: Out of balsa wood and things like that, you know.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And it was always with me I think. Going back. Not overwhelming or anything like that at all but an interest. And, as a matter of fact, just after I left school at fifteen [pause] a bit older than that I was working at CWS, that’s right. I was in London. I went, I went to the Air Ministry which those days was down [pause] You don’t — no, you wouldn’t know the Stoll Theatre, would you? It’s gone.
DK: No. No. No.
JW: Demolished. It’s not where it is now. It wasn’t in Whitehall. It was down this road, down there, down the end there. I forget the name of it. I think it was called High Holborn come to think of it.
DK: High Holborn. Right. Yeah. Yeah.
JW: Anyway, I went there and asked about entry into the boy scheme at Halton. Commonly known as the Halton Brats.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: And they gave me some books and papers and things to study for the entrance to them. Took them away. Got home then. Within a week or two war was declared and of course the scheme was stopped.
DK: Oh right.
JW: So I never got to it. The thing is had that not happened, if I’d gone to there and become a wireless operator what would I have been today? [laughs]
DK: Yeah.
JW: The fate plays some funny tricks doesn’t it?
DK: Yes. Yeah. So the war started then and presumably you were then called up. And then —
JW: Well, I didn’t get called up actually.
DK: Oh right. Ok.
JW: What happened was that [pause] I’m trying to think of a reason but there was no reason. I just, I was up in London. I was working in London. So I took the afternoon off and went to the Joint Recruiting Centre at Edgeware.
DK: Right. Yeah.
JW: I went down there to Edgeware. But my people at the Co-op, they were very understanding. In fact I was one of the last of the males in the office left. All been called up, you see. I went up there to join the Navy.
DK: Oh right.
JW: Because my father was in the Royal Marines you see.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: So it was the natural thing to do. Now, this house was a requisitioned house and I remember it very clearly in my mind now. It was a long, you open the front door and there was a long passage down there. I walked down the passage. On the left hand side was the Navy office. On the right hand side was the RAF. I was just stepping over the threshold of the Navy one to join the Navy and there was this petty officer in front of a group of chaps there. He was bawling his heads off at them. That’s not my scene. So I turned around quickly and went in the other one. So that’s how I came to join the Air Force.
DK: It’s sort of fate again isn’t it? If it hadn’t have been —
JW: And they took my details down, sent me home and said, ‘Well, we’ll get in touch with you,’ and they did. They sent me a railway warrant to go to Oxford and I went, the Oxford Selection Board. I was down as training for a pilot. We all trained, all go for a pilot because nobody ever gets there. But we all go for a pilot. I went there, had a selection and they basically whittled it down, got me down as a wireless operator which was roughly what I was going to do in the original. So they said right, now I’ll give you another paper and said — oh I was sworn in. So I’m now a member. This is June 1941. Sent me home. Said, ‘We’ll call you forward.’ They did. They called me forward to report at Padgate up in Lancashire on December the 24th. Christmas. Christmas Eve [laughs]
DK: Oh dear.
JW: Any rate, I’d got the railway warrant so I got on the train. It was the first time I’d been on one of these trains and, I’d never done this before. In the compartment there was a couple there with their daughter. I remember that girl. Yeah. I never, I can’t remember her name. And of course those days there was no, not much catering on the trains. You took your own with you. They had their parcels and I had my parcel and we the three of us got together there and we, you know had a nice journey up there during which the lady said, said, ‘Are you going to Padgate?’ I said, ‘Yes’ She said, ‘Well, that’s not all that far from where we live.’ What’s the name of the place? It was a double barrelled name. I’ve forgotten it now. It’s quite a big place. She says, she wrote the address down and gave it to me. I put it in my pocket. She said, ‘If you can get off at Christmas come to us and you can come and stay with us over Christmas.’ I said, ‘Oh right,’ I thought. I got to Padgate and went through all the things there. Kit. I drew my uniform the morning, the next morning and then had to go to the tailors for alterations like they do. And then the corporal came out and bawled his head off and said, ‘Any of you chaps here live within fifty miles of here, can get home without using public transport you can have a weekend pass. Put your hands up.’ Up went my hand [laughs] I’m a bugger, you know really [laughs] He said, ‘Where?’ I said, ‘Newton le Willows.’ That was it. Newton le Willows. Newton le Willows. ‘Oh yeah, that’s alright.’ He said, ‘Right, he said, ‘Well, go to the guardroom at about 4 o’clock and pick up your pass. You go to, go to the tailors. I’ve given the tailor, I shall be giving the tailor priority for your uniform to be done. So you can go and get that first. When you get the uniform put it on.’ Went to the guardroom. It was dark by this time. Got to the guardroom. Got my pass. I walked out through the gate and there was a bus stop there. I said, ah good. A bus pulled up. He said, ‘Where are you going?’ I said ‘Warrington.’ Warrington. ‘Well you’re going the wrong way. It’s that way. We’re going that way.’ Oh. They put me on the right bus. I got to Warrington. I asked the way. They got me on a bus to Newton le Willows and they said, ‘Where do you want?’ I said, ‘Well I’ve got Newton le Willows.’ There was a woman sitting in front of me. Yeah. She turned around, she said. ‘Let me have a look at that. See if I can find it. Oh I know them.’ she said. ‘I’ll put you off at the right place.’ ‘Oh thank you.’ Got off there. Went to the front door. Knocked on the door. There was a pause. There was lot of furniture being moved around and everything. I wasn’t used to this at all. They said, ‘Come around the other side,’ but they, they entered their house through the side instead of in the front door.
DK: Yeah.
JW: That’s reserved for weddings and funerals. I spent the Christmas, I spent Christmas with them.
DK: Oh right.
JW: They gave me a couple of presents. A jar of Brylcreem.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And a packet of razor blades [laughs]
DK: Wonderful.
JW: [laughs] The great shame is because so many things were happening fast.
DK: Yeah.
JW: It skipped my mind. I should have written and thanked them for the way. I should have done that.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And it’s my sorrow that I didn’t.
DK: Yeah.
JW: I should have done. It’s very sad that was but then people were used to that sort of thing in wartime. And after, I was off to Blackpool in no time at all. Doing drill on the streets. God. [laughs] That’s another, that’s nothing to do with 97 Squadron. Nothing to do with Bomber Command at all. Oh dear.
DK: So at Blackpool then was that all the square bashing going on down there?
JW: That’s right, yeah. Yeah.
DK: Is that something you enjoyed or —
JW: I didn’t mind it at all really.
DK: No.
JW: You know the Air Force fitted around my shoulders like it was made for me. I never had any doubt whatsoever at any time.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And I’ve been very lucky. Well, what is luck and what is otherwise? It’s hard to say sometimes isn’t it?
DK: It certainly is. So from Blackpool then can you remember where you went on to after that?
JW: Well, they sent me down to Bournemouth [laughs]
DK: Oh.
JW: With seven other chaps. A holding unit. Now, at Bournemouth was Number 3 PRC personnel something. Reception. Personnel Reception Committee, Centre. This was, this was formed for the Empire Training Scheme. The chaps that had gone to Canada for training. They came back, a lot of them were already commissioned when they came back. They were commissioned before they came back.
DK: Yeah.
JW: So they sent them to Bournemouth to hold there until they could allocate them to whatever squadron. Where they were going to, you see. But I was there with these other chaps and we were just airman. Erks. I had a great time there actually. Oh yeah. I started life in the Air Force as an officer’s batman would you believe? [laughs]
DK: Really.
JW: It’s a good thing. I saw it from the beginning. I got a lot, a lot of experience I got there. Oh yes I did. Any rate from there they called me up one day on parade and they said report to so and so I went to the clothing section and they kitted me out with all the flying gear but it was all recycled from chaps that had been shot down and their families had sent their uniforms up. There was all stuff there and I got all the old stuff. I had Gosport tubing, you know. Before they had microphones. And, oh dear, and they gave me an extra kit bag. So I’ve got two kit bags now. From there they sent me to London. To a centre. Viceroy Court it was called. It was across the road from the entrance to the London Zoo.
DK: Right.
JW: And the London Zoo Restaurant was requisitioned for the RAF meals there. We were there, I was there for about two, only two, two or three days there. Then I, then they sorted me out and I was off to training at Morpeth.
DK: Right.
JW: Number 4 Gunnery School at Morpeth.
DK: So, at this point it was already, it had already been decided you were training as a gunner then.
JW: Well, when I went, when I was at Padgate we had tests there.
DK: Right.
JW: I got through the written test easy. But when it came to simulation and they give you earphones and they said, ‘We’re going to send a series of Morse signals,’ beep beep and another one beep beep. ‘Now, all you’ve got to do is mark on that sheet there whether they were the same or different.’
DK: Right.
JW: I buggered that one up [laughs] ‘We can’t put you for training for wireless operator because your Morse is not good enough.’ Fair enough. ‘So you’ve got two options. You can either re-muster to an air gunner or you can go home because you’re a volunteer.’
DK: Right.
JW: I hadn’t gone all that way to go home. That was ridiculous.
DK: Yeah.
JW: So I said, ‘Right. I can be an air gunner.’ They said, ‘Righto.’ So off I go to Blackpool with all the other ground staff members to do the initial training which was quite an experience but not something you’d be interested in.
DK: No. Yeah.
JW: It’s not your, I’ll not take your time up. Eventually I went down to Bournemouth as I said and then went up to London. And then I went to Morpeth. Air Gunnery School. It so happened my uncle lived in Morpeth. That was handy [laughs] Anyway, we finished that training.
DK: So, if we just step back a bit. What was your training as a gunner? How did they train gunners?
JW: Well, we had, it was, it was a grass airfield.
DK: Right.
JW: It was a temporary thing there and the aircraft we had there nobody’s ever heard of them. They were called a Blackburn Botha.
DK: Yeah.
JW: It was a swine and in the middle of winter and they, they were started with the, what they called a Coffman cartridge. A cartridge they put in the engine to fire it.
DK: Yeah
JW: And the damn thing wouldn’t start, you know. We had a hell of a bloody time but we got through that all right. And —
DK: So were you actually on, on the aircraft.
JW: Oh yes.
DK: Firing at targets.
JW: Oh yeah. We had target practice.
DK: Right.
JW: We had a Lysander. We were towing a drogue.
DK: Right.
JW: Way back there. And they told you mustn’t touch the guns until that Lysander’s passed. You see, you aim the drogue [laughs] They counted the holes after to see what score you got. So anyway, I got through there quite well apparently. Oh yes. From there along with another, a little cockney chap called George Dillon who we chummed up quite well. He was quite a lad he was. And we, both of us, this is where the strangeness comes in. We were both posted together to 44 Squadron at Waddington but we were given a weekend off. Now, a third chap, he came into this in that he was getting married that weekend. On this weekend leave. He invited us to his wedding. He lived in South London near where George lived. So I said, ‘Oh ok. I’ll come with you.’ I went. We went there. I don’t remember too much about the party. I don’t know. I must have slept, slept in the house there with them. I don’t remember. It was a bit vague. I think, I think I was a bit punch drunk at the time. I was in uniform at the time.
DK: It must have been a good party.
JW: White flash in the. Under training. Anyway, we were both posted to Waddington. We arrived, we got the train up on Monday to Lincoln and, ‘What do we do now? Just a minute.’ So I went to see the station master. ‘Can I use your phone?’ [laughs] Cheeky bugger wasn’t I? I rang the station. ‘I said MT section?’ Oh yes. I said, ‘You’ve got two people here at the station want transport to Waddington.’ ‘Right. We’ll send a truck down for you.’ They sent this little canvas covered 500 weight truck down and we went in there. Now, we got our tapes on now. I was a sergeant now you know. And went to the officer’s err sergeant’s mess. In our innocence and ignorance we both walked in to the sergeant’s mess. It so happened that the station warrant officer whose king on the station. He’s the station commander’s right hand man. He’s a very important man. He was sitting on a chair in the entrance there as we walked in and he bawled us out straight away. ‘Out.’ ‘What’s the matter?’ ‘You don’t go in your sergeant’s mess with your hat on.’ First black [laughs] At any rate, the next morning we were going to see the squadron commander. That’s that chap who was in the daylight raid on [pause] the only daylight raid the Lancasters ever did.
DK: Yeah. Nettleton.
JW: Diesel works. What’s the name of the place?
DK: Yeah. The MAN diesel works.
JW: He got quite famous actually.
DK: Is it Nettleton, wasn’t it?
JW: Nettleton. You’re right. Absolutely. I could never remember his name. Walked into his office and he had his cronies around him there. He had just got the VC. He was as happy in the clouds of course. Walked in. He said, ‘Right,’ he said, ‘New arrivals.’ I said, ‘Yes sir. Could we have some leave please.’ [laughs] That was a thing I should have, ‘We haven’t had any leave since we finished training.’ He said, ‘Don’t you know there’s a war on?’ I said, ‘Oh. Oh is that why we’re here.’ He didn’t like me one little bit. Two days later I was posted [laughs] along with George. George, he was with me. We went to Syerston. 61 Squadron. That was a different kettle of fish altogether. Group Captain Walker, Gus Walker, he was the station commander.
DK: Yeah.
JW: He was a splendid chap. He’s what is known as an airman’s officer.
DK: Right.
JW: He’s with the lads. And I was there for a few months. Went there in September and I left there [pause] around about, around about Christmas time to go to Woodhall Spa. But we were wheeled in front of the station commander, Gus Walker. He was a very nice chap. He got off, up from his desk. Walked over to meet us.
DK: That’s nice.
JW: You don’t get that very often.
DK: No.
JW: That’s Gus. That set the scene.
DK: Because he lost an arm later on didn’t he? He was.
JW: I’m coming to that.
DK: Oh right.
JW: I was there.
DK: Oh right. Oh Christ.
JW: Yeah. Yes.
DK: So just stepping back a bit at 44 Squadron you hadn’t flown any operations at this point.
JW: No.
DK: So you’re now at 61.
JW: Yeah.
DK: And is this where your first operations took place?
JW: And I’ll never forget it.
DK: Right. Ok.
JW: It was Munich.
DK: Right.
JW: And I was terrified. Absolutely petrified. You see, try and imagine this you see. I was, I was what was called a spare and it filled any gap in a crew when a chap dropped out for some reason or other.
DK: Oh right. So you weren’t allocated an actual crew at this point.
JW: No.
DK: No.
JW: At any rate I was in the crew room there and my name wasn’t on the list to fly so, fair enough. And this chap came to me, he said, ‘Oh, you’re a spare.’ I said, ‘That’s right.’ ‘Well come with us to do a night flying test.’ Oh I don’t mind doing that. So I got my parachute. My parachute and the harness. Went out to the aircraft. We had a little run around Lincoln and that. Lovely. I was getting out the aircraft to get my stuff, he said, ‘I shouldn’t bother taking it out. You’ll be alright for tonight.’ ‘What?’ [laughs] I didn’t know their names. They didn’t know me even. There we are. I’m a stranger sitting there all on my own. My first op. And as far as I was concerned every, every ack-ack gun in Germany was stationed at Munich and firing at me personally. It was murder.
DK: And your position then is as the mid-upper gunner.
JW: Yeah. I did have a spell in the rear turret. I didn’t like it in the rear turret.
DK: No. So as a mid-upper gunner then, just for the tape, what, what’s your actual role there? Are you sort of a spare pair of eyes? Are you there making sure that everything was safe and ok? Looking out for dangers.
JW: Yeah. Well I suppose you could say, as it happened, only because it’s happened that way all I was, was an observer. I didn’t fired a bullet. In forty five operations I never fired a bullet. I never saw a German fighter. I never saw anybody. It’s pitch dark up there you know.
DK: Yeah.
JW: You know, you know. Your only enemy was your fatigue and the thing was trying to keep awake. It was terrible trying to keep awake and I evolved a method where I would count shooting stars. You’d be surprised how many shooting stars you get.
DK: Right.
JW: I used to count them and that kept me awake. Oh dear me. We had a flask of coffee along with our pack there we picked up in the sergeant’s mess. And one night, I remember true as I sit here, it was winter. That was bloody cold. Forty degrees below zero and a bit draughty too. Although I was in a Perspex bowl like thing where the joins are the wind finds it, finds a crack.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And you get this pfft on the back of your neck. It’s not pleasant. Pretty hard. Anyway, I got this flask. We were coming back actually by tradition nobody opened that flask until we were on the way back. I don’t know why. It was one of those things. Took this out, put the cup down like that, got the cork out, picked up the cup, went to pour it out. In that short time it had frozen solid in the flask.
DK: Oh.
JW: Hard to believe isn’t it?
DK: Yeah. That’s how cold it was.
JW: By the same token we were eventually issued with a new flying suit called a [pause] I forget what it was called. It was a Kapot lining and electric wiring all through it and it had a plug on the end. And you plugged it in to a socket in the turret so you’d got electric, heating. Luxury. Oh it was wonderful.
DK: I’ve heard different things about those. Sometimes they didn’t work and sometimes you got too hot.
JW: Ah, you’re right.
DK: Couldn’t get them just right.
JW: Well, course you put that on before you went out to the aircraft.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Now this would cover the whole of your body and at the bottom, on the heel, there were two press studs and you had a slipper that was also electrically heated and it plugged in. Ok. Just the heel there. Now, when you’re walking, you know, you move. You move your heel don’t you?
DK: Yeah.
JW: I found that out afterwards of course. What had happened was by walking with it, it had disturbed the wiring.
DK: Right.
JW: I don’t mean broke it. It shorted out anyway.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And it started burning my heel. I mean, I couldn’t stand that so I had to switch it off. And when I switched it off I froze.
DK: Oh dear.
JW: It wasn’t a pleasant night [laughs]
DK: So at 97 then, can you remember how many operations you did from there?
JW: With 97?
DK: For example.
JW: Well, including the Woodhall Spa one.
DK: Although, oh have I jumped ahead. Hang on. Oh 61 sorry. How many operations did you do at 61? At Syerston.
JW: Oh about six.
DK: Six.
JW: Yeah.
DK: And you were going to mention about Gus and losing his arm.
JW: I did a few more at Woodhall Spa before I joined the crew.
DK: Right.
JW: I was in a crew room one day like you normally do. I hadn’t got a crew. I hadn’t got a job. I was just joined the mob there.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And this flying officer walked up to me. I recognised his name because his name got around. He was on his second tour. He’d already done thirty and got the DFM.
DK: Yeah. Can you remember his name just for the —
JW: Yes. The name Fletcher.
DK: Fletcher.
JW: Bob Fletcher.
DK: Bob Fletcher.
JW: Robert Fletcher. Bob Fletcher.
DK: Right.
JW: He was a brilliant pilot. He really was. He was greatly underrated by the, by the authorities. He should have, he should have made quite advanced steps. He should have done. He was brilliant.
DK: So he, that was your first crew then was it?
JW: My first crew.
DK: You were no longer an extra bod.
JW: Yeah.
DK: Right.
JW: He came over to me and said, ‘I’m forming up a crew here. Would you like, would you like to join me?’ I said, ‘Oh yes, I would.’ With a reputation like he’s got. Dead cert. Ok. But it happens you see I was, once they had to do thirty and I was already one, one ahead of them by doing these other trips you see.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: Not that that mattered at the time. And then one day the squadron commander came into the crew room and said, ‘You chaps are all volunteers for Pathfinders.’ Oh thank you. So off we went to Cambridge. There’s a story about that. But if you want that I’ll give it to you but it’s nothing to do with flying.
DK: Can I, can I just go back one bit.
JW: Yes.
DK: At, I don’t know, I made a note of this. Where were we? [pause] It was at 61. You were at Syerston weren’t you?
JW: Syerston.
DK: And you mentioned about Gus Walker. His accident.
JW: Yes.
DK: And you said you were actually there when he —
JW: Yeah.
DK: What can you just tell us about that?
JW: Oh yes. I was going to tell you about that wasn’t I? I was there at the time. That’s right. Actually I was on leave when it actually happened but I got the full story first hand.
DK: Right.
JW: What happened was — bombing up the aircraft there was a slight hitch. One of the bombs fell off on to the ground. It burst into flames because it was one of those. It was an incendiary. And the word was sent to the flying control tower saying that there were no, there are no explosives on the aircraft. They said, ‘Incendiary.’ So the fire brigade went out there and that sort of thing. And it happened that Gus Walker was up in the tower at the time. The news came through. Straight away he said, ‘They’ve made a mistake. There is explosives on the aircraft.’ He dived down and got in his staff car and tore down to the aircraft and pulling the chaps out, ‘Get out, get out, get out of the way,’ he said, ‘It’s going to go off.’ And it did go off. And that’s when he lost his arm. Now, he went to hospital of course. At Nottingham. And a number of the ground staff were also badly injured. Some were killed, some were injured. They went into another ward of course. Now, the officer’s mess got together and funded a huge basket of fruit and things like that and sent it to him. When he, when he got to the hospital he said, ‘No.’ he said, ‘Take that down to the ward to the airmen.’ He is an airman’s officer. He was.
DK: Yeah.
JW: He was a great chap.
DK: Yeah. So you’ve, you’ve then gone to Woodhall Spa. After Syerston was it Woodhall Spa did you say?
JW: Yeah.
DK: And that’s where you met Bob Fletcher.
JW: That’s right.
DK: And so how many operations did you do with Bob and the crew there?
JW: I must check. I’ll look that up.
DK: Ok.
[pause]
JW: Won’t take a minute.
DK: No worries.
[recording paused]
JW: Let’s see. Where are we? 97 Squadron. Woodhall Spa.
DK: Ok.
JW: One, two, three, four, five, six. No, that wasn’t. No. Five.
DK: Five.
JW: That, that was at Bourn. The last trip I did at Woodhall Spa was to Spezia.
DK: Right.
JW: That was ten and a quarter hours.
DK: Oh. That’s a long time.
JW: Now, I’m going to tell you a story now. Are you ready for this one?
DK: Yeah. Go on then.
JW: Well, this was a long stretch to Spezia. It’s about half way down the west coast of Italy. It was an important submarine base at that time and we were tasked to go down there at the request of the Navy. Obviously, because of the submarine menace.
DK: Can I just close the window because there’s some sound coming?
JW: Of course.
DK: Through there. It might be affecting the, the old recording a bit.
[pause]
DK: Just that there’s some sound coming through. Sorry.
JW: That’s alright.
DK: You were on your way to Italy.
JW: Yes. We got half way across the alps. In fact I remember seeing Mont Blanc in the distance. Over there. It was still, we were above it so we were alright. And doing my usual searches like what my job was, it was a clear night and I saw this stream coming out of one of the engines there. What the hell is that? So I reported it. I said, ‘This is peculiar.’ There was a pregnant pause then and the engineer, the engineer Joe, he was brilliant too. We were all brilliant. Anyway, he came through to us, ‘I’m sorry lads. I’m sorry. I’ve made a mistake.’ He was then doing his usual converting the [pause] not converting [pause] moving fuel from the outer.
DK: Changing.
JW: To the empty inner.
DK: Right.
JW: Had been used up.
DK: Right.
JW: Unfortunately he picked the wrong one and the one he was putting it in was already full. So the petrol he was pumping in to it was just going straight out the overflow. And that’s what I could see. This stream. All this stream down there.
DK: So it was petrol.
JW: We lost about two hundred gallons of fuel.
DK: Oh no.
JW: Which we could ill afford to lose on a trip to Spezia.
DK: Yeah.
JW: So it was, there was a little bit of, up in the front in what we called the office while they were working out what they’re going to do. And Bob said, Bob made the decision of course, as he should do being the pilot. Carry on. We’ll take our chances. Now, the rest of us knew that we were going to come down in the drink somewhere. We hadn’t got enough to get back home. We came back over the Bay of Biscay actually. We did our job. We bombed the bloody place. Coming back, and old Joe as an engineer he was absolutely brilliant. He was. He was good. A lot older than the rest of us. He was like a grandfather to us. Joe. I can’t think of his other name. Oh wait a minute. I’ve got it here. [pause] He’s not on here. That’s funny. That’s very strange.
DK: There’s some names on the back there. He’s not, not there is he?
JW: Ah.
DK: As the —
[pause]
JW: No. This is a different crew.
DK: Oh.
JW: I was flying with a different crew there. No. No. I thought he was bound to be on there. No. I’m afraid I don’t remember his name now. I’ve got it somewhere.
DK: Yeah.
JW: But I can’t put my finger on it at the moment. No. Sorry, I can’t help with that.
DK: No. But he was a good flight engineer then was he?
JW: Flight engineer.
DK: Yeah.
JW: But he’d be dead by now. I mean —
DK: Yeah.
JW: I’m ninety four so, and I was only a kid to him. Time has taken its toll. That’s the original logbook.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Which is a disgrace so I copied it into another one.
DK: Ah.
JW: This is cleaned up, this is. I cleaned it up. Oh that’s old Bennett.
DK: Yes. So just going back to your trip to Italy. You’ve lost two hundred gallons.
JW: Yeah.
DK: You’ve obviously made it back to the UK.
JW: We did.
DK: You did. So —
JW: Without getting our feet wet.
DK: Yeah. So that was really down to the flight engineer then. Managing.
JW: Oh absolutely.
DK: Managing the petrol.
JW: He was brilliant.
DK: Down to the last.
JW: How the hell he managed to. He must have been, he must have been feeding petrol vapour into the engines.
DK: Yeah.
JW: I don’t know. He was very good. He saved us all. But that’s our crew you see. We were like that.
DK: So, from, so you’re with 97 Squadron at Woodhall Spa and then you said you’d then gone to the Pathfinders.
JW: Yeah.
DK: And you were basically told to go there. You were just ordered there. So no, no volunteering or anything.
JW: That’s right. Yeah.
DK: And you’d gone to Bourn at that point.
JW: Well, yes. The mathematics is a bit hard to explain really but as we were getting towards the end of my time — oh yes. I forgot to mention this. One of the concessions we had in Pathfinder force was we were allowed to count each trip as two . So a full tour would be fifteen and not thirty.
DK: Right.
JW: That saved my life didn’t it? And that’s how I came to finish early.
DK: So you did forty five operations altogether.
JW: Forty five.
DK: Forty five. Yeah.
JW: Yeah. Yeah.
DK: And were you with the same pilot? Fletcher. At Bourn.
JW: Oh yes.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Bob Fletcher. Yeah I picked him up. I’ve got it in here somewhere. I picked him up actually — let’s see now. A lot of rubbish in here. Flying officer. He was a flying officer at the time. Here we are. Oh yes. I had three trips with a crew but they had just about finished. They had, they had done twenty seven. They needed three more to do.
DK: Right.
JW: They did the three and they finished. So once again I was back in the pool.
DK: Right.
JW: Lennox was his name.
DK: And that was 97 again was it?
JW: Yeah. So I picked up Bob Fletcher. The first trip with him was St Nazaire. That was the target.
DK: Have you got a date for that?
JW: On the 2nd of April 1943.
DK: Right.
JW: Yeah. We dropped, we dropped eleven one thousand pound bombs. Eleven. Oh well, that’s what it says there. Who am I to argue? Yeah. And thereafter we were in, in the thick of it with all the others. Bob, quite rightly got promoted to flight lieutenant around about [ pause] let’s have a look. God, they took a long time promoting him didn’t they? He should have got it. Well I’m blowed. I never knew it took that long.
DK: That long. Longer than you thought.
JW: He’s still flying officer.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Yeah. He’s still flying officer. Well I’m blowed. Yeah. I don’t understand this.
DK: It’s a bit later on than you thought.
JW: Unless I missed it. Ah I’ve got it. The first time he flew as a flight lieutenant was the 27th of August ’43.
DK: Right.
JW: That’s right. And the target was Nuremberg. We dropped one four thousand pound bomb, three one thousand pound bombs and five target indicator marks. Markers. A little story about that really. PFF wasn’t the original title promoted. When [pause] who was promoting it? I think Sir Arthur Harris. That’s right. Or was it? No. it was Churchill I think. Churchill promoted the idea. Sir Arthur was against it because he didn’t want to have an elite corps. He said, ‘No. They’re all good. It’s not right.’ But he did give in and they formed the new group called 8 Group. And then the controversy got worse when Donald whats-his-name.
DK: Bennet.
JW: Yeah. He was a brilliant navigator. He had it in his fingertips there. And the Air Ministry promoted him above all the other air marshalls. Made him an air vice marshall in one leap like that and it upset the apple cart quite a bit you know. He wasn’t popular by any means. They all, they all admit he was brilliant. He was very clever. But they couldn’t get along with him at all.
DK: No. No.
JW: But that’s how the story goes. A bit beyond me of course.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Yeah.
DK: As, in the Pathfinder force then what was the, just for this really, what was the sort of role of the Pathfinders as opposed to the main force? What did they —
JW: Ah yes. Yeah. Well the evolution of this was quite interesting. They, the original title was Target Finding Force. They didn’t like that. They said, ‘No. No. The others are just as good. So then they accepted they marked the route to get there.
DK: Right.
JW: Which was just as important as actually getting, I mean if you could find the place in the first place, you know. So it was named Pathfinder force. We were doing the course out. We dropped the markers along like.
DK: Right.
JW: And it was arranged by careful timing that the whole of the force doing target finding, there was our squadron and 35 squadron at Graveley and there was another squadron at Wyton who timed. Each aircraft had a specific time to be there.
DK: Right.
JW: So that he dropped his target and it burned for a few minutes but it’s going to go out. So the next one that comes along he tops it up.
DK: Yeah.
JW: So that. Very clever.
DK: Yeah.
JW: It worked.
DK: Did your aircraft then act as an initial marker? Or were you backing up or dropping the flares along the route?
JW: Well, we were all backers up really.
DK: Right.
JW: I suppose. But I mean it varied. It depended on the plans. The plans were all worked out at headquarters.
DK: Right.
JW: We were just given the orders you see.
DK: Right.
JW: We didn’t actually have to find the target. We didn’t need to look far. You could see the bloody thing there. I mean, the Mosquitoes in Pathfinder force, they were using a new secret arrangement called Oboe. Two transmitting stations sent out a beam like that. Right. Ok. And the aircraft followed it in. If they veered too much to one side they got a beep. And another one. They kept on track there. And then they gave a signal. This one here would be to keep them on track. This one here would tell him when to drop the bombs.
DK: Right.
JW: And it was extremely successful but of course they’re just flares went down. Parachute flares. Things like that. Then the rest would come along in an orderly way as far as we could make it. Just kept it going. In fact quite often when we, when we arrived there they’d been bombing for the last half hour. I mean it was well ablaze you know. There it is. But then of course the defences were alerted by that time. Oh dear it would get hot some times. Bloody Hell it did.
DK: So you never got attacked by a fighter then at any time.
JW: No.
DK: But was your aircraft hit by flak?
JW: I would have welcomed one because I was so bloody bored sitting there.
DK: Was your aircraft hit by flak at all on occasion?
JW: We got away with it.
DK: Yeah.
JW: It was bloody amazing how we got away with it but we did until that last trip when I wasn’t on it.
DK: And was that Fletcher’s crew that went?
JW: It’s, it’s an incredible story really when you think about it. When you leave here and you’re going home think about it.
DK: Yeah.
JW: I mean, the chances of that happening were so remote. I shall never forget it of course. Where are we now?
DK: Where are we now? That’s straightforward. So —
JW: Do you want some amusing stories now do you?
DK: Just one other question before we move on.
JW: Yes. Go ahead.
DK: It’s as you’ve landed and you’ve come back and the operations finished. How did you feel as you landed on the way back?
JW: How did we feel? We were bloody pleased. I’ll tell you one thing to correct. There’s a very good film. Commercial film. What’s it called? “Night Bombers,” I think it’s called.
DK: Oh yes. Yes. Yes.
JW: And at the end, at the tail end of that film the crew landed and they’re getting out of the aircraft and the voiceover said the first thing they do is to light up a cigarette.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Balls. The first thing you did was go down to the back end of the aircraft and pee up against the tail wheel. You’ve had nine hours without going to the [laughs] I don’t know if anybody’s ever told you this but there is a chemical toilet, elsan toilet.
DK: Elsan.
JW: In the aircraft.
DK: Yeah. Yeah. You never used that then?
JW: Of course not. It’s bloody silly. Can you imagine? There we are. Pitch dark. We had to have our oxygen mask on. Full clothing on.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Fumbling around trying to get — oh it’s ridiculous. They even had a separate can of fluid to top it up, there was.
DK: No.
JW: And after the war when they used the Lancasters to take the ground crew out to, on a sightseeing] to see what we’d done during the war.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Including taking the WAAFs as well. Because the WAAFs were there they put a screen around the [knocking on door] Come in. [pause] They put a screen around the toilet.
Other: Sorry to disturb you. Are you keeping an eye on the time?
DK: Oh. Alright we’ll come down. Ok.
Other: No problem. See you in a few minutes.
JW: I’ve told them to come. You’re having lunch.
DK: Yeah. Oh excellent. Oh great.
JW: I’ve forgotten what it is. Mine is pork bake. I don’t know what the bake is but I know what the pork is. I don’t know what the bake is though. And what’s the other one? I’ve taken the one anyway.
DK: Yeah. Ok. Shall, shall we pause there then?
[recording paused]
DK: I’ll tell you why. Because that was going to be my next, next question really was —
JW: Yes ok. You go ahead. Fire away.
DK: How you look back on that now and what do you miss about that period?
JW: Yeah. Well it’s, it’s very difficult to answer because it’s, there are so many aspects involved you see. I had two [pause] three, three separate careers really. First of all aircrew which was one life. Then when I finished, when they took me off aircrew I was on Training Command. That’s another life. And then eventually I was made redundant from supply because they were running down. And, being interviewed by a squadron leader I was, I don’t know if it’s got it on there but I was sent to an RAF station. We didn’t have any aircraft. What was the name? Somewhere in Leicestershire. Oh God what was the name of it?
DK: Bruntingthorpe.
JW: That’s it.
DK: Yeah.
JW: That’s where the jet engine was developed.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: That’s right. I was sent there as another holding unit and in the interview he said, ‘What skills have you got?’ I said, ‘Nothing really. I never got around to doing skills.’ So he said what is your hobbies and things?’ I said, ‘Well,’ I said, ‘I’m very keen on, on the railway organisation.’ He said, ‘Are you?’ I said, ‘Yeah. I’ve got a copy of the Bradshaws timetable. The old original one.’ You know, a big one like this. The chaps knew I had this and if they had wanted to go somewhere they used to come to me and say, ‘Would you plot the route for me?’ And I used to go through it. It is a work of art going through that book. It was.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And later LNER, LMS, Great Western.
DK: Yeah.
JW: That sort of thing, you know. He said, ‘Oh,’ he said, ‘Well look, I’ll tell you what. I’m going down to London this weekend and I’ll pop into the Air Ministry and speak to the Movements chaps there and see if they can find you a slot.’ Now, I took that with a pinch of salt. I mean how am I going to? How shall I be that lucky? So, I said, ‘All right.’ And nothing happened for about a month and then I was called forward, out again. The chap said I’d got to report to the order room. I went, ‘Alright.’ And he said, ‘You’re posted to Euston Station.’ ‘To Euston?’ ‘Yeah.’ He gave me all the documents and off I went. Got to Euston station there and I asked to speak to the chap in charge. He didn’t know anything about this posting at all. He said, ‘I don’t know anything about it, at all. Maybe it’s our admin people over the road. I did. They didn’t know anything either so they rang up the movers in the Air Ministry. They said, ‘We’ve got this guy here,’ and I heard one side of the conversation. They must have said, ‘What’s he like?’ He said, ‘Oh, he looks alright.’ Oh thank you. They said, ‘Right, tell him, tell him to go to Victoria station. Report to flight lieutenant,’ what was his name, Orange. ‘Flight Lieutenant Orange.’ Ok. I went there and he was a nice chap. He was auxiliary.
DK: Right.
JW: Not in the full RAF.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And he had a lot of experience just lately of young officers, young aircrew officers no more use for them.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Because they were running down and they went there and just sort of abused the situation. Did nothing, you know. Sort of went off and things like that. And he said and he was quite amazed when I asked him, ‘Can I do this?’ Can I do the other? I said, ‘I’d better go and see the station master, hadn’t I?’ He said, ‘Why?’ I said, ‘Well, it’s normal isn’t it?’ I was treating it as an RAF station. I went to see him. I wish I could remember his name. He was a typical, typical station manager. Pin striped trousers.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Bowler hat and [laughs] and we got on famously because we were chatting about things a bit, you know. At any rate a few days later I met him on the forecourt. I was wandering around. I did a lot of wandering around picking up information you know.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: He said, ‘I’m coming down. I’m going to see off the Golden Arrow,’ he said, as his job, a Prestige. Two. There were two Prestige trains in Victoria. One was the Golden Arrow. It went to Dover and then across to Paris. And the other one was the night sleeper. It went and left about 7 o’clock and the whole train was shipped across.
DK: Right.
JW: It was. So you, and it was all first class, Pullman and that.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Now both trains because they were Prestige trains he thought it was his business to go and see them off and he took me along with him. And I thought that was lovely. A very nice gesture. I enjoyed that. He said, ‘What are you doing here any rate at 7 o’clock in the evening?’ I said, ‘Well, I’ve got nothing better to do.’ He said, ok. ‘Cause I, I was living with my family. My mother’s family.
DK: Yeah.
JW: At Enfield which is about twelve miles north of London. Yeah. There was nothing for me to do. So he said, ‘That’s great,’ and we got talking about things. One thing and another. We got along famously and then one day I do my usual walking over the concourse there and there was a hell of a bloody great queue to get tickets from the ticket office there and I spotted an RAF uniform in there. He had a collar on. A white collar on. I thought I’d better have a look at this. So I went across, and I said, ‘Excuse me sir.’ And I introduced myself. I had a red armband on you know. ‘Can I help you?’ He said, ‘Well I think you can,’ he said, ‘I’m the chaplain to the senior chaplain of the RAF and he’s going on a, he wants to go on a tour of Europe to visit all the RAF stations in the occupation zone.’ The occupation days that was you see.
DK: Yeah.
JW: He said, I’ve got, I’ve, got to get, ‘I’ve got to get — he sent me to do all the bookings. Get all the tickets and that sort of thing,’ he said. I said, ‘Well you’re in the wrong bloody queue aren’t you at any rate? That’s for inland routes. Come with me.’ I took him around to the other station where the continental booking office was. I don’t know if you remember this in Victoria. They had two different booking offices.
DK: I do actually. Yes. Yes.
JW: Yeah.
DK: Yes.
JW: Well we were in the original one. Our office. RTO’s office. And they had been moved to the back of the refreshment bar there at the end of the concourse. And I took him around the back, knocked on the door and who should open the door but this ex-ATS girl who was on the staff with us there. And she got a job with the railway in the booking office. That was jolly nice. And we had a little chat and I said, ‘Look I’ve got a padre here who wants this, that and the other,’ I said, ‘Can I leave him with you?’ She said, ‘Oh leave him with me.’ So he left and I walked on. Some little while later. I think a month later or something, I think I had a call from this, his name was Dagger, Reverend Dagger.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: And he said, he wanted to thank me very much. ‘You saved my bacon,’ or whatever he was saying. He said, ‘It all went swimmingly. That girl was wonderful. She knew her onions. She knew her railways anyway.’ She fixed him up with everything. The lot. He went off with a bundle and off he went. The chief had a lovely tour around there and that was that. That was fine. A good job. A good job I had done. It had its ramifications later on. I’d met my wife in the meantime in Jersey.
DK: Yeah.
JW: At the West Park Pavilion dance place there. It so happened by sheer coincidence she, my wife had previously been in hospital with some fever. What’s it called?
DK: Scarlet fever or, scarlet fever.
JW: You’re right. Scarlet fever. And she recovered now but her aunt lived in Jersey with her husband who was a Jersey man. And she invited her, my wife, to go over to stay with them a little while to recuperate.
DK: Yeah.
JW: So they set off. Her, her younger brother Derek who was a tall chap.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And her best girlfriend across the road. Audrey. The three of them. How the hell they managed to go through all the rigmarole of travel to get to Jersey but they did it. And any rate the first night I was there I’d been over, I went over previously in February just to have a look at the place. And I was very pleased with what I saw and I thought this is a place for a holiday. Soon as I got back I had a chat to my roommate there. He was an army officer. I said, ‘We ought to go and have a holiday there you know.’ He said, ‘Right.’ So we arranged to have our leave at the same time. I took him down to Paddington. There’s another route from Paddington to Weymouth.
DK: Yeah.
JW: We went that way.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Took him there. I said, ‘Do you know, I’m going to take you to the Palais,’ because servicemen always do that. The way you meet girls was at dances, you know. And I took him along there. When we got there it was, we were a bit early and the band was just coming on with their instruments and things and there was hardly anybody there. But I noticed at the far end, up that end there were three people sitting there. Two girls and a chap. I thought, as all servicemen do, look around for what they called an available bit, you know [laughs] And I thought she’s nice. I like that. So as soon as the band got themselves together and struck up for the first dance I walked across in uniform. The full, the full regalia. And I remember clearly for the first time in my life I was full of confidence. I don’t know how it happened. I felt, it was the uniform I think. I always felt good in uniform. I strode across with all the confidence in the world. ‘May I have this dance please.’ She said, ‘Oh yes.’ Got on the floor and she was light as anything. She was a beautiful dancer. I thought, you know, I can’t, I’ve got to say something. You’ve got to have a conversation haven’t you when you’re dancing?
DK: Yeah.
JW: So I said to her the usual thing, ‘Are you a local girl?’ ‘Oh No. No. No. I’m here on a holiday.’ ‘Oh, are you? Where are you from?’ She said, ‘Nottingham.’ ‘Oh, that’s my favourite city.’ And it was.
DK: Yeah.
JW: I loved it. I was telling the truth, I loved it because I was at Syerston you remember. That was their watering hole.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Nottingham. And I said look I’ve got my mate down the bottom there and we’ve got a jug of claret cup which is what they do there. Instead of having drinks they give you a big glass jug and they mix it up. Half of it is claret and half is lemonade.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Top it up.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And they serve it up with glasses there and you just help yourself when you want it. Not a bad idea. I said, ‘We’ve got a claret cup already.’ I said, ‘Can I ask you who are those people? Who is that chap?’ ‘That’s my brother.’ Oh that was, I’ve heard that before. Anyway, I said, ‘Well come down and join us.’ She brought them down shared a nice little foursome there, you know. It was quite jolly. A nice evening. And we all disappeared and afterwards and I saw her home. St Aubin. She lived in St Aubin, that’s right. Up there. I made a date for the following day and she turned up at the weighbridge there and I didn’t, I hadn’t planned anything. It was unusual. I’m a great planner and I hadn’t. I don’t know why. Anyway I said, ‘Let’s get on a bus and have a ride,’ So we got on a bus, took her back to where she was at St Aubin. We got on another there took us down to a little bay which I’d discovered. There was a big bay called St Ouen’s. Huge thing. And the island’s prestige hotel called L’Horizon. The Horizon. L’Horizon it was called.
DK: Yeah.
JW: It was a good five star hotel. Very good. Very top class you know. Now, as that bay goes around when it gets to this side here instead of going around there it ended in another little bay called Ouaisne. And we had a bus. Went from St Aubin to this place. We went down there and sat on the sand there. Had a little cuddle. Sat reading and things like that and on the point as this little bay went around the corner there was no beach but there was a whole pile of rocks been worn smooth by the water over the years. And I loved walking over them, climbing over them, you know. So I had a little walk around, came back and said, ‘Its nice around there you know. Do you want to have a look?’ And she’s a game girl. She always was. She came with me. We were climbing over these rocks. We found a little spot there. There was one big shiny smooth slab there slightly inclined. Well that’s just the job isn’t it? So we got on there and had a cuddle on there and spent the whole afternoon there. And I took her to the back as the tide was coming in. We just got around the corner before the tide cut us off actually and got on the bus back in. And I made a date for the next day. This went on for a fortnight.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Every afternoon bar one I took her out. We were getting thicker and thicker and thicker you know. She was lovely. And very, well the only way I can explain is it was compatible if you know what I mean.
DK: Yes.
JW: I felt at home and at ease.
DK: At ease. Yeah. That’s important though anyway.
JW: Yeah.
DK: Feeling at ease.
JW: Going back to the bus at weighbridge and she sat there and I sat here and I was getting very embarrassed because she kept looking around and gazing at me all the time. I’m not used to this. Then we got talking. I asked her how old she was. She said she was sixteen. Oh my God. I’m cradle snatching.
DK: So how old were you at the time then?
JW: I was twenty five at the time.
DK: Oh ok.
JW: A bit too old for a sixteen year old. And she was messing up. She was pulling my leg. She wasn’t. She was twenty actually.
DK: Oh that’s ok then.
JW: Yeah. But it made my heart sink you know. Particularly with this gazing at me all the time. I thought oh bloody hell. I’m not used to this. Anyway, we got around that alright. Then we got settled in very nicely. Now, when it came to the end of the holiday she had to go back because she was booked to go back on the boat on the, on the Saturday. Butch and I were going back on Sunday. The day after. So I had my last afternoon with her on the Friday before. Instead of catching the bus back I said, ‘Let’s walk around the point and have a look around there.’ We walked around the point. We found another little bay, a little bay there and there was a little island there all on its own with trees and everything on it. I said, ‘I’ve never seen anything like it. This is lovely.’ I said, ‘I’ve got the urge to swim in the skinny.’ So I took my things off. I said, ‘Are you coming?’ She said, ‘No. No. I’ll stay here and read.’ I said, ‘Ok.’ So I went in and I was swimming around. Lovely. And I came out. The sun was shining and I was warming up. She was laying there and I laid down beside her. Now the rest of it is a bit personal.
DK: Say no more.
JW: Except to say that we only cuddled. Nothing else.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Absolutely.
DK: Yeah.
JW: I don’t know what got over me that times.
[recording paused]
DK: So its back on again. It’s been off. Don’t worry.
JW: Well, he successfully baled out.
DK: So if I could just recap there. So Wally Layne was the wireless operator.
JW: That’s right.
DK: And —
JW: He was a warrant officer at the time.
DK: He was a warrant officer.
JW: Yeah.
DK: And he baled out.
JW: Right. Well he survived the parachute jump alright and he started what they call evading. It was our duty to evade if you could and he spent a week. All he had was the escape kit that we were all issued with.
DK: Yeah.
JW: It had things like a tube of condensed milk, some chewing gum. Bits. And vitamin tablets. Things like that to help us. And what he could pick up on the way wasn’t very much. I think he said turnips he managed to get hold of. Anyway, after a week he was so weakened by this that he decided he’d had enough. He was a prisoner of war. He staggered out in to the street and fell in to the arms of the first person he could find who happened to be a policeman. The policeman invited him to the hospitality of a prisoner of war camp. And when he got to the prisoner of war camp he got to the gate going in, from what he was telling me, he got to the camp and the first person he saw there was our previous navigator who’d been shot down in another plane. They laughed their bloody heads off [laughs]
DK: So can I ask who survived the shooting down then? The wireless operator, Wally and the pilot?
JW: Yeah.
DK: Fletcher. And there was two others who survived the —
JW: The bomb aimer.
DK: The bomb aimer.
JW: That’s that chap.
DK: Yeah. Can you remember his name?
JW: Jack [pause] bloody hell.
DK: I think we’ve got it.
JW: I think it’s somewhere on there.
DK: I think we’ve got it on there. The bomb aimer. Because he’s the one on the photo.
JW: Yeah.
DK: And who else survived?
JW: Yeah. I can’t think.
DK: So the wireless operator, pilot.
JW: And the engineer.
DK: And the flight engineer.
JW: That was Joe. And I can’t think of his surname.
DK: Joe. Right.
JW: Joe. The older chap. He was like the father to us. We were all a lot younger than him.
DK: So the rear gunner, the mid-upper gunner.
JW: The rear gunner was killed instantly. The mid-upper gunner who was the chap who took my place, he was killed instantly.
DK: Can you remember the name of the rear gunner?
JW: And our replacement navigator. He was killed also. That just left the four of them.
DK: Right. So the rear gunner, mid upper gunner and the navigator were killed.
JW: And the navigator.
DK: Yeah. Can you remember the name of the rear gunner?
JW: Yeah. Harry Page.
DK: Harry Page. And the navigator. What’s his name? It doesn’t matter.
JW: He wasn’t with us. He wasn’t one of the original crew. He was a replacement.
DK: Right.
JW: Our proper navigator had been taken away from us and put into another crew. Took one particular operation and was shot down. So we lost him.
DK: Right.
JW: So they gave us a new navigator. I should know that name. I’ve got it somewhere.
DK: It doesn’t matter. It doesn’t matter. And I notice you were at Kinloss in October, November ’43. Is that when the plane crashed with the cadets on board?
JW: Yeah.
DK: So, we didn’t actually record that unfortunately. You couldn’t tell the story again could you? So you’re on a Armstrong, was it a Whitley?
JW: Yeah.
DK: A Whitley.
JW: Armstrong Whitley. That’s it.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Terrible plane. Oh terrible. Used to fly like that [laughs] In point of fact it was so bloody slow and underpowered.
DK: Yeah.
JW: That as I said that runway went out to sea. If we’d got an inshore wind like this the chap up here would do this for a lark, he’d put the throttle right back. Almost stall. And he would hover like that. The wind [laughs] Oh no.
DK: So how many, how many air cadets were on board? How many air cadets were on board at the time?
JW: Oh I don’t know. It was all shrouded in memory. I can’t remember. I’m guessing. I think there was some female cadets. Did they have female cadets?
DK: Probably didn’t.
JW: There must have been. But I don’t remember. I should say about four. Four or five.
DK: And you came down in the sea there.
JW: In the sea.
DK: Yeah
JW: Yeah. Landed in the sea. Wheels up. As I say the water was only four feet deep.
DK: So the dinghy came out by itself then.
JW: The dinghy came out on its own. We grabbed the dinghy, put all the kids in and pushed it ashore [laughs] When I think about it was bloody funny you know. It wasn’t very funny at the time but there we are. Oh dear me. It’s a story that nobody believes of course. Oh dear. Although, It’s funny enough though a few years back I took my son up to Scotland as I told you. And one of the, one of the reasons was that I’d made arrangements to take him to Kinloss to see the airfield here I flew from.
DK: Right.
JW: And we got off the train at Forres . The station at Kinloss had been closed. RAF Kinloss had its own railway station on this line. This was the main line from Inverness to Aberdeen.
DK: Yeah.
JW: We used to have a little station there called Kinloss and there was a footpath we used to walk across, over the fence and we were in the airfield. It was very handy. Getting back late, you know [laughs] At any rate where was I? Oh yeah. Kinloss. I forget. I’ve lost my trend. Jack Beesley, that was the chap’s name. Beesley. Jack Beesley.
DK: And he was the —
JW: Got it?
DK: He was the —
JW: He was the bomb aimer.
DK: He was the bomb aimer and he survived.
JW: Yes.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Yeah. He did.
DK: So, after the war then, did you stay in touch with any of the four surviving crew at all?
JW: Sorry?
DK: Did you, did you stay in touch with the, with your crew after the war?
JW: No.
DK: No.
JW: Because we went our ways. We were all over the place. Joe came somewhere up near Bolton. Somewhere like that. And another one came from Birmingham. Who was that? [pause] Harry Page came from Bristol.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Wally Layne, Grantham. Bob Fletcher, he was at Burton on Trent. He was at Burton on Trent. Who have I missed?
DK: Wally, Bob.
JW: I came, I came from Enfield, Middlesex. That’s a touch, I’ve got a touch of Cockney in me you know [laughs] I spent most, a lot of my pre, nearly all my pre-RAF days working in London. At the headquarters there of the Co-op.
DK: Right.
JW: The London Headquarters.
DK: Yeah.
JW: In Leman Street.
DK: Yeah.
JW: East 1.
DK: Just, just looking at your operations here I notice you’ve got “Target award.” Is that because you were the most on target or — ?
JW: Recall is it?
DK: Target award.
JW: Oh target award. Oh yes. I’ll show you that.
DK: Oh right. Ok.
JW: Are they in this? Are they in this book or are they in that book?
DK: So you got one of those for Milan, Nuremberg.
JW: That’s quite true. Yeah.
DK: Spezia, Italy.
JW: But not with Bob Fletcher. It was other crews.
DK: Right. Because that was, they were with 97 Squadron.
JW: Yeah. Let’s see what I’ve got here. I’ve got all rubbish here, haven’t I?
DK: Oh that’s a Nuremberg one.
JW: There’s another one.
DK: Right. So —
JW: Do you want another one?
DK: So that’s the target award for Spezia on the 13th and 14th of April 1943.
JW: Yeah. Some things are repeated, of course. I don’t know. Some —
DK: This one then. That’s Fletcher. That’s with the Fletcher crew.
JW: Yeah.
DK: Yeah. So then Milan 14th to 15th of Feb 1943 — target award. And Nuremberg 25th of the 2nd 1943. So the pilot then was Lennox.
JW: Lennox, that’s it. I flew.
DK: Yeah.
JW: The three trips I did with him. His last three before he finished his thirty ops.
DK: So these target awards then were, were they they based on how close you got to the target?
JW: Photographs.
DK: Photographs.
JW: When you dropped your bombs, when they dropped the bombs though they also dropped a flare chute.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Not a chute, a flare thing, you know which is due, which is timed to detonate at a certain level. And as it detonated it lit up the target and it showed where you drop the bomb.
DK: Right.
JW: But it’s a bit hard to get that really because you’d got cloud to think of and all sorts of things to think about. So, it wasn’t, it wasn’t all that easy. We weren’t, we weren’t conscious of it of course at the time.
DK: So just for the recording here the Spezia one on the 13th and 14th of April.
JW: Yeah.
DK: The pilot’s Fletcher and you get Sergeant Mason, Flight Sergeant Robertson, Flight Sergeant that would be Wally Layne. Sergeant White, yourself. Pilot officer Bale and the Sub Lieutenant Lett. Was he Royal Navy then?
JW: [pause] Yeah. [pause] Ok. Shall I put them back in the —
DK: Yeah. Sure. Yeah. Yeah.
JW: This you might be interested in. Look at it that way.
DK: There you go.
JW: That’s a bomb. Oh you’ve twisted it around.
DK: A bomb bay.
JW: No re-gain.
DK: That way.
JW: That way. That’s it. That’s the four thousand pound bomb.
DK: Bomb.
JW: That’s right.
JW: And those are incendiaries.
JW: That’s right. A hell of a load isn’t it?
DK: Yeah.
JW: That aircraft, the Lancaster was really, really a winner you know. It was, it was a great boost for AV Roe.
DK: That was going to be my next question actually.
JW: Yeah.
DK: What did you think of the Lancaster then?
JW: Marvellous. Yes. She was a, she was, it was quite a comfortable aircraft really. Flying this is. Mind you, where we were, the rear turret was a bugger and I steered clear of that. Some bright bloody bugger up at headquarters got the idea that if you remove the Perspex in front they can see better. He has to put goggles on to make up for it so where’s the saving? All you got was cold. As you know when you push something through the air you get a backdraft.
DK: Yeah.
JW: You get it in a car isn’t it?
DK: Yeah.
JW: Well you’ve got a gale blowing in there and it’s bitter cold. It really is bitter. Your saliva which drips down from your mask, that freezes and it can block the tube.
DK: So how many times did you fly in the rear turret then?
JW: I can have a look.
DK: Yeah. Ok. But you were mostly —
JW: As little as possible I can tell you.
DK: As little as possible. So it was mostly the mid-upper turret.
JW: Well, you see, in the early days I didn’t have much clout as the saying goes. But as I got more and more experienced in things and surviving, our crew had got a reputation on the squadron of being the lucky people. We were lucky. No doubt about that. They couldn’t understand how we escaped so much. We did. And I’ll tell you Bob, he didn’t cut corners. I’ll swear to any bible you like we went to the target and he went to the bloody target and he dropped his bombs on the target. That’s how we got the target awards. And he came back. Now, he was a good chap. Now, you want to know, what am I looking at?
DK: How many times you flew in the rear turret.
JW: Oh yeah [pause, pages turning] It’s here somewhere. Ah yes. There’s [pause] well that was a training flight. 8th of October of ’42. Now then. Mid-upper. Mid-upper. Mid-upper. Here we are. Conversion course at somewhere or other. I was rear gunner all of those. That’s right. We didn’t have a mid-upper there. That was, we were doing a conversion. The stupidity, the apparent stupidity, let’s put it that way, of what goes on in wartime among the passing things down. You know. Well, there we were at Syerston flying with a crew and suddenly we were sent to Swinderby, just up the road for a conversion course to four engine, four engine aircraft. What the hell did they think we were flying in any case? I mean it’s so ruddy stupid it’s hard to believe. There we are. I’ve got it here.
DK: So at the OTU and Heavy Conversion Unit was that all Lancasters?
JW: Yeah. Somebody had got their wires crossed I expect.
DK: Yeah. Was it? Was it Lancasters at the OTU and the Heavy Conversion Unit?
JW: Yeah. Here we are. I did some. Sergeant Goodwin, as a rear gunner and also, that’s right — one, two I did a lot of training flights. Only one operation.
DK: Oh right. So only one operation in the rear turret.
JW: There’s some more there.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Another one there. Mine laying. A lot, a lot of exercises went on. Kept us busy didn’t it? Rear gunner. All these are rear gunner. Oh yes. Here we are. Gardening. They called it gardening. Sowing the mines, you know.
DK: The mines.
JW: Essen. Berlin. Dusseldorf. Two at Dusseldorf.
DK: And that was in the rear turret.
JW: Yeah. These are all rear gunner. I did more than I thought.
DK: Ah.
JW: Hamburg.
DK: For the recording that’s, you were at the Baltic mining on the 14th of December ’42 and the 9th of January ’43. And then Essen the 11th of January ’43.
JW: Yeah.
DK: Berlin 16th of January. Dusseldorf 23rd of January.
JW: The 14th of, the 14th of February.
DK: Yeah.
JW: ’43. I joined 97 Squadron.
DK: Yeah. So Dusseldorf again 27th of January.
JW: Yeah.
DK: And Hamburg 30th of January.
JW: That’s right.
DK: 1943. And —
JW: They were all rear gunners they were.
DK: They were all rear gunner. Right.
JW: I didn’t know, I didn’t know I managed all that. Good gracious.
DK: So that’s at least one, two, three, four, five, six times. You were rear gunner more often than you thought.
JW: There’s still some rear gunners here. Lennox. It’s got to come to an end soon. Ah [pause] ah my first flight with Bob Fletcher. I even put his decoration in. DFM.
DK: And what date was that?
JW: That was the 30th of March ‘43
DK: Right. So that was a training flight was it?
JW: That’s my, that’s my first flight with him. That was the mid-upper gun. I exercised my seniority. I’m going in the top turret thank you. And old Harry Page was stuck with the other one. He didn’t mind. He’s a tough old bird he was old. Old Harry was. No. That’s all, that’s all it was. No more.
DK: So all your operations then up to the 30th of March were in the rear turret.
JW: I didn’t like it one little bit.
DK: And just here 24th of July 1943 was Hamburg and the first use of Window. Was that the dropping out of the, the reflective flares? The reflective paper then? Window.
[pause]
JW: Window. Yeah.
DK: Yeah.
JW: That’s the strips of metal.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: But that, right I’ll tell you now a little story. Not a story but the fact. There was one anti-fighter device which didn’t get its proper recognition. It was a thing called Tinsel. All this was, it was a, it was the cheapest piece of equipment you could ever bother to think and it was the most effective. And it was ignored. That’s higher up. All this was was a microphone that was attached to one of the inner engines and the wire, and the cable went through the wing into the cockpit and down to the wireless operator’s position. And it coupled to his Morse code.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Now, on briefing all the wireless operators were given a wave band to listen out on. Right. And that’s all the squadrons all doing it. And what you had to do, what they had to do was to listen out, when they weren’t doing something else, listen out. As soon as they heard a German voice — on the key.
DK: Yeah.
JW: It transmitted this awful noise from the engine. There were a few sore ears down there I wonder. But it never got recognised as an effective. It probably sounded a bit too simple probably. All it was was a microphone, a bit of adhesive tape and wire.
DK: And wire. Yeah.
JW: A shame you know because, because the wireless operators got used to it and they started using it for their own purposes and they would tap messages to each other because you can’t broadcast when you’re flying.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Because they can pick you up. But if you’re transmitting this bloody noise the people, they can’t hear you, you see.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And come in, ‘I’ve heard from Joe and,’ so and so and so. ‘Oh really.’ [laughs] [pause] We saw Nettleton go down.
DK: Really.
JW: We didn’t know at the time it was him. We were coming back from one of the Italian jobs. Milan or Turin and he came back over the Bay of Biscay. That way to avoid coming over France. Daylight by now because it’s a long trip. Broad daylight and I was flying there and occasionally, it was very interesting flying along on your own. You think, on your own. And suddenly another one there, another one there, another one there they were popping up and people in the same stream going down. You know. Very interesting. And I was looking down there and I saw this one down a bit low there and flying like that and suddenly his nose dipped down like that. He went straight in the water. I noted the time. And when I reported this back at interrogation afterwards I found out it was Nettleton. So nobody knows why he went down.
DK: Yeah. Is it, is it possible to check your logbooks? I just —
JW: Sorry?
DK: The aircraft P Peter. Does it have the serial number in your logbook by any chance?
[pause]
DK: 1943.
[pause]
JW: I’ve got a lot of rubbish in here.
DK: Did you, did you make a note of the serial numbers?
JW: Yes.
DK: I’m just. P Peter.
JW: Here we are. JA 708.
DK: Ok. And that was operation to Hanover on the —
JW: Hanover. Yeah.
DK: 22nd of September.
JW: That’s right.
DK: 1943.
JW: Yeah. My last trip that was.
DK: And then the following night. Hanover again when the aircraft was lost.
JW: The following. Ah. Now then, another little story coming up. Now here we go. They flew off without me. A bloke in my place. And the target was Mannheim.
DK: Oh Mannheim. Ok.
JW: It was. But they never found it. They never hit it. Now I had a letter many many years later from the editor of the local newspaper of a small town which lies in between Mannheim and Ludwigshafen.
DK: Right.
JW: They’re both inland ports.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: About in the middle. And I can’t remember the name of it. He wrote to me. He said he’d heard of my survival and he’d like a little more information because he said for the anniversary of that particular night they were going to put some show on or something.
DK: Ok.
JW: And he wanted to get all the information I think he could out of it. There wasn’t much I could tell him because I wasn’t there. He appreciated that. But he did send me a diagram of the town centre which was completely obliterated. They got the lot down there. It was the wrong target. Great shame wasn’t it?
DK: Yeah.
JW: These things happen don’t they, in wartime doesn’t it?
DK: So which town was this then that —
JW: Well I don’t know. I can’t remember the name of it.
DK: Right. Ok.
JW: It begins with the letter K I remember.
DK: So the target was Mannheim but they —
JW: They should have bombed Mannheim but the Pathfinders had made a mistake. They targeted this little town instead.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And this little town got the lot. Seven hundred Lancasters dropping bombs on them.
DK: And that was the 23rd of September 1943.
JW: Completely obliterated the whole town centre he tells me.
DK: And that was, just for the recording here the 23rd of September 1943. Yeah.
JW: Is it, he had a title. He was a professor of something or other.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Editor of the local newspaper.
DK: Yeah. Ok. Ok well let’s stop the recording there. I’m sure you are.
[recording paused]
DK: So it’s recording now so —
JW: Ok.
DK: Consider what you’re saying. So 97 Squadron then. What do you —
JW: Right. Woodhall Spa.
DK: Yeah. Ok.
JW: Right. Well it so happens that our parent station was Coningsby. [But you didn’t really notice that?] And they were so close that the drem circuit, which is a ring of lights around the airfield.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And they crossed there. Think of this. They’re going that way around like that and down like that. This one’s going the same way like that. But when they get there they’re in opposite directions. We thought that’s a bit hairy. Fortunately there was no flying at Coningsby. They were busy putting a hard —
DK: Runway.
JW: Runways down. Putting hard runways down. But we were so close to Coningsby really. All our, all our admin work was done at Coningsby. Now, I went back to Coningsby twice. The first time was we’d all subscribed. In the Association not the Squadron Association, we subscribed to a stained glass window to commemorate the squadron. And that was being placed in the chapel on the station. The RAF station there. A proper do on a Sunday morning there. Even got one bloke there playing the bugle. He couldn’t play it to save his soul [laughs] but never mind. It was a gesture. We got that done. I guess, I got another, another instance where I broke my thoughts about the future. A lot of the chaps there with me were wearing the DFM. Which means they were airmen. Not officers. That’s just, just a little aside. At the general meetings each year the first time I went I shared a table with a couple there. Two couples in fact. A big table. Yeah. They were original people from the squadron in wartime days and come to think of it they weren’t particularly happy about being there. They thought, I got the impression they thought it was a waste of time but I didn’t say anything at the time naturally. But it added to my thoughts about the whole thing you know. And when I was first approached by Ann Savage who was this WAAF, ex-WAAF who was acting as secretary she, I don’t know how she found me but she got me and talked me into joining. Before joining I rang my pilot Bob Fletcher at home and I asked him for his, his opinion. He said, ‘Don’t touch them with a barge pole.’ He wouldn’t have it. No. Out. Oh dear. But pressure was put on me to join and I thought well I do owe something. I mean you must know by now how lucky I’ve been. I do know something. So I, I gave in and I went along to that. The next AGM and reunion. The other reunion there’s a misname. It wasn’t a reunion at all. It was an AGM really. There was so few people there who were actually on the squadron during the wartime days. Now, that’s what I call a reunion. Me meeting old friends there.
DK: Yeah.
JW: I knew nobody. And nobody knew me. These two couples at the table there they weren’t particularly happy about it all. The next year I went again. I didn’t see them again. They never turned up again. I noticed a few others that I remembered were there. They didn’t come again. The third time I went nobody came there who was on the squadron during the wartime days. Completely out. And going back to that business I said about, about the youngsters there this particular organisation now is devolved into just a club for the young people. And I try to influence them a bit. The chairman was a retired wing commander. Bomb aimer. Ken Cook. And he and the secretary were together like that and they had some sort of interest in the hotel. The Admiral Rodney. Admiral Rodney in the middle of Lincoln? Oh well [laughs] And Hornchurch is, it’s a sink town. It’s dreadful. They’ve got a little stream that runs through the town there. It’s only a little stream but you get all the rubbish in there. Bedsteads and trollies and all sorts of things. It’s a dreadful place. It had a Woolworth’s there.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And it hadn’t been changed since the wartime days. It had ordinary floorboards. No lino or carpet. Oh God. Oh no. No. I said, I thought came into my mind this is not going to attract anybody.
DK: Yeah.
JW: You’d have one say never again and I tried to steer them away. I thought Lincoln would be the ideal place.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Lincoln was the centre of Lancaster country you know. We all know that. Everybody. It’s always written up on it and they wouldn’t listen because this hotel. They got hat and glove with the proprietor of the hotel I think. They took over the hotel and allocated the bedrooms and things like that. No. That’s not the future at all. Any rate, the wing commander, he wrote to the other members of the committee misinterpreting exactly, misinterpreting entirely what I had wrote to him. He said I was trying to tell them to buy a sack of Kevin’s books and dish them out as rewards or something like that.
DK: Yeah.
JW: Not at all. That wasn’t it at all. I was talking about the location of the place. So I bowed out. I said it’s not worth it. It’s not worth worrying about. Except for Kevin. He stayed on. He became the secretary. Acting secretary shall I say. I don’t get much from him these days. He’s very busy. Like all of us when you retire you start getting busy.
DK: Yeah.
JW: But there you are he keeps on saying I’ll come and see but it’s a long way to come from Peterborough just to take you out to lunch isn’t it?
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
JW: And I haven’t got a house now to offer hospitality. He stayed with us before when I had a house at East [unclear] but that’s gone now.
DK: When you were based at Woodhall Spa did you use the Petwood Hotel?
JW: Yeah.
DK: At all. Was that, was that somewhere you used to go to then as the mess?
JW: Well the last time we went I took my wife with me. A bit of luck once again. Just my lucky streak. And somebody from the hotel staff, somebody in authority, they said, ‘Oh we’ll change your room for you.’ We had some sort of little room. They gave us a lovely room. Private bathroom. The lot. It was well done you know.
DK: Yeah.
JW: And it so happened that after the meeting and all the fun and games and things like that, people drifting away that more or less left Kevin and his lady and me and my wife and one or two others there drifting away. And we were taken, my wife and I were taken with Kevin up to this room and people were going back to their room, passing. Raising an eyebrow. They knew this was a good room. We got the plum. So that’s it. That’s it. Time to quit. Any rate I wished them the best but when you come to think of it though when they first asked me to join that’s over twenty years after the war. It’s a bit late to start a reunion isn’t it? Twenty years after the event isn’t it?
JW: It is. It is a little bit.
And then Bob saying don’t touch them with a bargepole. I don’t know why. I don’t know what his objection was but he wouldn’t have anything to do with it. Yeah. It was a bit downmarket I must admit.
What? The Petwood?
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Interview with Ernest James White
Creator
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David Kavanagh
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2016-10-27
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
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Sound
Identifier
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AWhiteEJ161027
Conforms To
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Pending review
Pending revision of OH transcription
Format
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01:42:38 audio recording
Language
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eng
Coverage
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Description
An account of the resource
James White worked as a wages clerk for the Co-op before volunteering for the Air Force. He had intended to join the navy but he saw some recruits being shouted at so he turned around and crossed the corridor to join the RAF. He had always had an interesting in flying because his uncle lived near Hendon Airfield and he had enjoyed watching the aircraft as well as making models. When he had completed his final operation as a gunner with 97 Squadron his crew still had one to do and so he volunteered to join them. The gunnery leader refused his offer and he went on the operation himself. The crew failed to return from that operation and the surviving members became prisoners of war.
Contributor
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Julie Williams
Spatial Coverage
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France
Germany
Great Britain
Italy
England--Cambridgeshire
England--Lincolnshire
France--Saint-Nazaire
Germany--Hamburg
Germany--Mannheim
Germany--Nuremberg
Italy--La Spezia
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1941
1943
44 Squadron
61 Squadron
8 Group
97 Squadron
air gunner
aircrew
bombing
bombing of Hamburg (24-31 July 1943)
Botha
Cook’s tour
Lancaster
Lysander
memorial
military service conditions
Oboe
Pathfinders
RAF Bourn
RAF Graveley
RAF Morpeth
RAF Syerston
RAF Waddington
RAF Woodbridge
RAF Woodhall Spa
sanitation
searchlight
Window
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/1165/11730/ATownsleyH180314.1.mp3
24a47333c28c33c487d7aace5982444b
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Townsley, Henry
H Townsley
Description
An account of the resource
Four items. An oral history interview with Warrant Officer Henry Townsley DFM (b. 1920, 994575 Royal Air Force), a memoir, list of operations and artwork. He flew operations as a flight engineer with 97 Squadron.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Henry Townsley and catalogued by Nigel Huckins.
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2018-03-14
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
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Townsley, H
Transcribed audio recording
A resource consisting primarily of recorded human voice.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
CB: I’ll just do the introduction. My name is Chris Brockbank and today is the 14th of March 2018 and I’m in Diseworth near Derby, talking to Henry Townsley DFM, about his life and times as a flight engineer. So Henry, what are your earliest recollections of life.
HT: Well, I think being born at a place called Harrington, Workington. I was born there in 1920.
CB: And what do you remember about that?
HT: Well, I can remember it being quite depressing in those days, a lot of unemployment.
CB: What was the main local employment?
HT: Well, steel working, place called Moss Bay was a steel plant and It was iron and steel. Of course it was, there was quite a bit of coal mining and the mining of the ore at Egremont, a few mile away and then there was the land so we had all the ingredients for the ore in the area.
CB: Right. And what did your father do?
HT: Well, my father was the, was a chauffeur for quite a long, got the chauffeur uniform, many years, yeah.
CB: SO there was the town, but fairly countrified as well.
HT: A town of twenty six thousand.
CB: Was it? Right.
HT: Yeah, so it was fairly large town.
CB: And where did you go to school?
HT: Ordinary elementary school until I was fourteen. And then of course I left school and I think perhaps I was in the air force before I started other things moving.
CB: And when you left school at fourteen you must have gone to something else. What did you do?
HT: Well, I, at fourteen I left school, went into a local garage as a vehicle fitter, to serve an apprenticeship as a vehicle fitter. Quite a large garage, there were six, employed there, six craftsmen, so it was quite large: Whitehaven.
CB: In Whitehaven.
HT: Whitehaven.
CB: Yeah. And this is 1934.
HT: Yes.
CB: So that’s a long way off the war. What, did you keep working there or did you do something else?
HT: Yes, until I was seventeen. And, until, unitl the war started. I was there until war started, yes.
CB: Okay, and did you do any more education while you were working in the garage?
HT: No, I didn’t do any of that.
CB: Did you do any night school?
HT: No. No, no didn’t do any night school. It was after I left there.
CB: So you, when the war started in ’39 what did you do?
HT: ’39? Well I was actually working in this garage at that time. I just forget now what, yeah, what I just.
CB: I think we’ll stop, just for a mo.
HT: Yes, it’s just a blank there really.
CB: Okay.
HT: I was on the water vessel Chesapeake, a tanker, ten thousand ton and that sailed form Swansea, in South Wales, and I was a junior engineer, there were three. Three juniors, and there was the three senior engineers and I believe there is a chief engineer, on the water vessel Chesapeake.
CB: And that was ten thousand tons.
HT: Ten thousand tonnes, yes.
CB: How did you get into that?
HT: Well, I er, well, I was working in this garage, I think I said, at Whitehaven at that time.
CB: Yes.
HT: And one of the customers, his brother in law was the engineer, chief engineer on the ship. That’s how I started, the customer coming in this garage where I was. [Laugh] He was, he was of course working as a second engineer he was at the time, and of course he was the bloke who pushed me in.
CB: Was he?
HT: Yeah. The Anglo American Oil Company.
CB: Oh yes. And what was real the tipping point that made you want to join the Merchant Navy?
HT: I think perhaps the fact that the, my family were seafaring, before me, so, my mother’s family were all seafaring. And it was, it was that what, it was my mother’s side of the family, not my father’s were seafaring people, and so that’s why I joined the, the Navy.
CB: Before that, when you were working in the garage, then you were studying engineering. At night school.
HT: Well yes.
CB: What was that course?
HT: [Telephone] It was the Workington Technical College. Yeah. On the National Course.
CB: Right.
HT: ONC.
CB: Yup.
HT: The Ordinary National Course.
CB: And did that specialise in a particular type of engineering? Was it marine?
HT: Engineering. Several types of engineering. Several types.
CB: Yes. Was it, any of it in construction or was it all in vehicles and ships?
HT: Well vehicle engineering, yeah.
CB: Yes. So when you joined the Merchant Navy, what did they do about training you, about shipping engineering?
HT: Well, I will have had to sit me tickets for me certificates there, you know. But of course as I say, I didn’t, I wasn’t there long, only a few months, and then, of course, I moved into the air force.
CB: So what prompted you to volunteer to join the RAF?
HT: Well, I wasn’t too keen on the sea: I was sick! [Laugh] So it didn’t agree with me constitution! So that was the main reason. [Laugh] Had I been able to stand the sea sickness I would have stuck it! That’s why I didn’t stick it. Quite obvious!
CB: Well you might have joined the Army, what made you join the RAF?
HT: The air force well, I think it was the chance of flying really, yeah, it was the senior one of the two. Aero engineering was the, seemingly the coming thing, of course naturally I felt okay, seems to be the thing to go for.
CB: Did you get recruited immediately for aircrew, or were you recruited for ground crew to begin with?
HT: Oh, for on the ground, yeah.
CB: So what was the course that you did?
HT: Oh, I don’t know exactly, I did engineering courses, on the ground, yeah. I did several courses on the ground before I moved, yeah.
CB: And where did you go for that?
HT: [Laugh] Locally, it wasn’t too far out of, I just forget now, but it was somewhere local, you know.
CB: Well if you were, if your ship was based in South Wales did you go to St. Athan?
HT: Yes, I did some courses there, at St. Athan, South Wales, yeah, yes, certainly. You know you’ve left it a bit late. Mind is not as quick as it was.
CB: You’re doing okay. So they were training you initially to be on engines was it or - ?
HT: Yes. Yes.
CB: Okay. Engine mechanic.
HT: Engine, yeah. Engine fitter I think.
CB: Right.
HT: Was it? I’m not sure if it was fitter or a mechanic, I think it was fitter. I did a fitters course.
CB: Yep. Okay.
HT: So I may have done both. I have a feeling I did a mechanics course, have you got it, flat mechanic? And then I went back and did a fitters course which was three months, three or four months there were, during the war.
CB: Yup.
HT: So I did both courses. So I was a fitter, a fitter engines.
CB: So we are talking about your joining in April 1940.
HT: Yeah.
CB: And things were warming up then, in the war.
HT: That’s true, that’s true.
CB: So what prompted you to become -
HT: Aircrew.
CB: Aircrew.
HT: [Laughter] Now then. I suppose there, the fact that there was fairly quick promotion really, you know! Was probably one of the things that did it!
CB: And more money.
HT: If it hadn’t been for the promotion and that, I might not have done it! But they were all, you were pushed up to sergeant you see. So of course, naturally, that was the recruiting agent for aircrew.
CB: For flight engineers.
HT: You all had the rank of sergeant, yeah. That’s, yeah, that’s all I think. You got the pay with it, so.
CB: So you were well schooled already in the basics of automotive engineering and then aero engineering.
HT: Well, I’d been, the, in working, yeah, on ordinary car engines for some years.
CB: Yeah, quite.
HT: Five years probably, five or six years.
CB: Six years.
HT: So I was well based in the base of engineering.
CB: Yeah. And when you came to volunteer for flight engineer you had a different training from the ground engineer. What do you remember about that?
HT: Training about the flight engineer. I every, fortnight’s training,
CB: Oh.
HT: [laugh] For me anyway, it was a fortnight’s training for me, and that was it.
CB: Right.
HT: As a, at my particular status, all I had to do was a couple of weeks.
CB: Right.
HT: I passed them and was through. Others had to do three months.
CB: Yes.
HT: Particularly a fitter 2A, if he was only an airframe.
CB: Yes.
HT: Only did the airframes and not the engines. But if he’d been a 2AR just. In those days, yeah, an airframe fitter, he had to do an engine course.
CB: Yeah.
HT: So his course was three or four months you see.
CB: Yes. And you’d already –
HT: But I was already an engine fitter so I only had minute training to do you see.
CB: So on the aircraft that you were, you were being trained to fly in four engine bombers.
HT: Lancaster, yes.
CB: Yes. Stirling, Halifax and Lancaster.
HT: Yes, that’s right, I did a bit on Stirlings, yes.
CB: So -
HT: I may have done one trip on Halifaxes, which I think I did, one. But I did a few on Stirlings, I did a few trips on Stirlings, probably six or eight and then on, moved on to the Lancaster. You know, finish the training.
CB: Yeah. Just going back to this earlier training for flight engineer. You were already proficient on the mechanical side, of engines.
HT: Yes, absolutely.
CB: So what were the other aspects that you needed to focus on for flight engineer?
HT: For flight engineer well, there was the airframe side of the aircraft.
CB: Yup.
HT: Which I had to know a little about.
CB: Hydraulics.
HT: Yes, hydraulics. Well of course, yes the undercarriage, yes. But mainly, well the airframe is part of the airframe you see. So I had to be reasonably, have a reasonable idea about the airframe side of the aircraft as well.
CB: Yep. And then the electrics of course, and electronics.
HT: Yes, electrics, yes. Oh yes. They were part, involved with the engine side as well.
CB: Right. Okay. So from your training at St. Athan, then where did you go after that?
HT: Yes, I was trained at St. Athan, and, I don’t know it’s down -
CB: So then you moved on to Swinderby.
HT: Swinderby, yeah, that’s in Lincolnshire, yes.
CB: And according to your log book, you were flying in the Manchester.
HT: That’s right.
CB: What was that like?
HT: That was a twin engined Lancaster, really.
CB: Right.
HT: The same, the same airframe as a Lanc, but twin engines, that was the Lancaster. That was the Lancaster, yes.
CB: The basis for the Lanc. The Manchester was the basis for the Lancaster.
HT: Basis for the Lanc.
CB: And were the systems the same on that, in both aeroplanes?
HT: Yes, pretty well. yeah. Yes.
CB: So you went on to Swinderby, and then what did you do?
HT: Well I moved from Swinderby on to a squadron. On to 97 Squadron. Is that right there?
CB: Right. Well, it looks as though you went to Winthorpe. You went to Woodhall Spa, on to the Lancaster.
HT: Yeah.
CB: From Swinderby.
HT: Yeah.
CB: We’ll just stop there for a mo.
CB: [Cough] So we’ll take this in bites. So is it, better for you to - do you need your glasses? Is it better for you to have look at this or I’ll just take you through?
HT: Yes, I can go through.
CB: But here, [cough] as you say, [cough] 94 Squadron, at Woodhall Spa.
HT: 97.
CB: 97 squadron I meant to say.
HT: Yes, yes.
CB: And from there you did quite a few ops.
HT: That’s right.
CB: Yeah. So we’ll just go on from there.
HT: So poor old Munro he got killed, yes.
CB: So his name was Munro was it?
HT: Yeah, Munro, the pilot, yeah.
CB: You were going to say, Jessie.
[Other]: I was going to say, yeah. There’s a couple of things that I found interesting, that you said, when we was at the Battle of Britain Anniversary, you spoke about the lights that came up that dazzled you. Do you remember those lights?
CB: Oh, searchlights?
HT: Yeah. That’s right
[Other]: The searchlights that dazzled you. We was, we was all sat round listening how you got out of such, such a situation.
HT: Absolutely, yeah!
[Other]: You was diving, diving to get out of the searchlight. Which was amazing!
CB: Right. Yeah.
CB: Was that the first or second tour?
HT: Well there was a time when we were, coned as it were.
CB: Let’s just cover that. So I’ll just ask you a question, you can tell me. [Pause] Having talked about your activities on the raids, on the ops, what, what would happen, as we talked about you going near the target. What was the most difficult thing about being near the target?
HT: Well, it was just the, the flak, you know, over the target area then you were getting all the flak, that they were shooting up all around, you see.
CB: But how did they identify where you were?
HT: Well, they could see us.
CB: What, with searchlights?
HT: Above, well, yeah.
CB: So what were the searchlights like?
HT: Well they were quite bright, they were quite good, the searchlights.
CB: Hmm. And so.
HT: So what happened, if the, one searchlight caught us, then they put another on, and then another [laugh] so they cone us in searchlights, and then, they would shoot, up in to the searchlights. So he wasn’t very happy, it wasn’t very happy when they did that.
CB: Right.
HT: Yes, that’s what happened, that was.
CB: So, so what did the pilot do about it?
HT: Well all we can do, if we were at reasonable height: we could - down. The only thing we could do. Down! [Laugh]
CB: And how did he go about that?
HT: Well he just did [emphasis] that.
CB: What, vertical?
HT: In effect.
CB: Would he put it –
HT: Down as quick as we could.
CB: Would he put it into a vertical –
HT: Nose down and down as quick as we could! Got out, yeah, it was the only way to do.
CB: And how far would he go down to do that?
HT: Oh, probably a thousand feet, if possible. Maybe not. Maybe.
CB: More than that?
HT: Maybe. No, we wouldn’t go any further than that. But we’d get out of it about, probably have to go down to a thousand to make it out.
CB: To one thousand feet, or by one thousand feet?
HT: One thousand feet.
CB: Down.
HT: Down to one thousand feet.
CB: To [emphasis] one thousand. Having got there, then what did he do? Continue flying at a thousand feet or did he - ?
HT: Oh yes, until we got out of the flak area, till we got out of the area, you know, the flak area and then we would rise.
CB: This is on the way to the target?
HT: Yeah. Yes.
CB: What I’m getting at is did you get coned on the way to the target, or only at [emphasis] the target?
HT: Well, you’re talking about the target, when we’re over the actual target. Dropping the bombs.
CB: Yes.
CB: Well, it wasn’t really often, you know, that we dropped right down to the bottom.
CB: No. Not then.
HT: Not then, no.
CB: No. Because you’d get bombed. So could you see other aeroplanes near you?
HT: Oh yes. Yeah.
CB: In the dark?
HT: Yes.
CB: Because of the fires was it?
HT: Well, er yes. The fires would light it all up. Yeah. Yeah, oh yes, you could see some of the aircraft.
CB: And when the fighters came to attack you, that was outside the target area was it?
HT: Generally, yes. They could attack us in the target area. But generally yes, you were out, outside.
CB: So when you are flying along and you’re not filling in your log book, what are you doing?
HT: Er, not filling in the log book?
CB: Not filling in the log.
HT: Well generally I’d check -
CB: The flight log.
HT: I’d check. Used to check, often, not indiscriminately, often.
CB: Yeah.
HT: Probably every ten minutes or quarter of an hour at least.
CB: And what are you actually checking?
HT: Well, check the oil gauges for pressure and, for temperature, check the gauges for temperature and pressure mainly, you know. Yeah. And then there’s the fuel, the coolant, you know, the coolant system, you got to check that, that. Yeah. Yes.
CB: And to what extent are you helping as a lookout?
HT: I was a lookout, yeah, quite a lot, I would say yes. Definitely.
CB: And what are you, are you looking out for fighters or are you looking out for other bombers getting too close?
HT: Well both. Any aircraft that’s going to get in the way, or a, or a fighter.
CB: Yeah.
HT: Oh yes. You keep a check out for any bother, anything. Make sure you’re clear of it.
CB: So how often did you have to move out of the way of other bombers?
HT: Well, it depended, you know, on circumstances, where you were, where you’re flying. It depends, if you were in a jumble, if you’re in an area where you’re jumbled up, landing, it’s something like that, you’ve got to keep a check.
CB: What would you say was the most vivid experience you had of being on an operation, on a raid?
HT: Well, I’ve got a thought, but I don’t know, it, quite a few. I’ve left it too long you see.
CB: Yes. I’m sure, yeah. We’ll stop there for a mo.
HT: That’s going, isn’t it that, Air Marshal.
CB: Now, 97 Squadron was a standard bombing squadron, but at one stage then it became Pathfinder. What happened there?
HT: That’s right. Pathfinder, yeah.
CB: Yes. What happened there?
HT: Yes, it was a top squadron. 97, alongside 617, we were there together on the same base, 97, on the same [emphasis] base.
CB: At Woodhall Spa.
The Dambusters were at Woodhall Spa on the same base.
CB: And from Woodhall Spa the squadron then moved to Bourne, why did it do that?
HT: Bourne. Move to Bourne.
CB: In Cambridgeshire.
HT: That would be after the war was it?
CB: That was 19, May 1943. This is because the Pathfinder operation was transferred to there.
HT: I can’t say I, I forget a lot you know.
CB: Yeah.
HT: It went on, yeah.
CB: Okay stop there.
HT: I forget, a lot of the things, I’ve forgotten.
CB: Of course.
HT: But generally, some of the, quite a bit I remember you know, after the stint I did.
CB: So in your Pathfinding then, in July ’43, your pilot, Munro, was awarded the DFC.
HT: Yes.
CB: Any other members of the crew awarded a distinction?
HT: I just forget, now let’s see. I think the navigator, I think he got a, an award, navigator. Yeah, the navigator, and the bomb aimer and the pilot all got awards before the rest of us. The bombing team should we say. They’re the bombing team.
CB: Yeah.
HT: The bomb aimer, the navigator and the pilot. Depended entirely on them, when the bomb was dropped, as a team.
CB: Were they officers, or only the pilot?
HT: Well. some were officers, some were pilots. Some were, I think generally on my second crew I was the only one, that was, I was a warrant officer all the rest were officers.
C: Were they.
HT: That’s in the second crew, yeah. And of course the first crew, well I, after about two or three months, three of them were commissioned. So I never bothered, you know, it didn’t worry me. I made it through, I made it through, I didn’t bother.
CB: The pay was all right?
HT: Oh yeah, I was happy. I wasn’t bothered at all. So er, and I wasn’t pushed, I wasn’t pushed to be responsible for anything. So I was happy, and I mean the commission that I may have had would have had some responsibility pushed on to me, you know, but I wasn’t, so, so I didn’t.
CB: So, just keeping on the first tour, and the crew, how did they gel together?
HT: The first crew, that was Munro the pilot, and Hill the rear gunner, Bennett the mid upper gunner, and er, there was -
CB: Signaller?
HT: Watson the bomb aimer.
CB: Watson.
HT: Yeah. Suswain he was the Suswain, the first was the first bomb aimer was Suswain, in me first crew, Watson was the second crew bomb aimer.
CB: What about the flight, the wireless operator?
HT: Yeah. the wireless operator was, just forget now, the er, one of them was only an NCO, was only a flight sergeant. A warrant officer probably.
CB: But when you joined the first crew, that was at the Heavy Conversion Unit.
HT: Munro. All sergeants together.
CB: Yeah. But how did they get on as a crew? ‘Cause you joined when they were already a crew.
HT: Well Munro. When I joined we were all sergeants, and they moved ahead, and Munro undoubtedly got, was commissioned first, whilst we were flying together. Three were commissioned, there was Munro was commissioned, the navigator was commissioned and the bomb aimer was commissioned. And that was it. Three. So they were what they called the bombing team. They were responsible for dropping the bomb, you see. That’s why they commissioned them.
CB: Right.
HT: ‘Cause navigator, pilot, and the bomb aimer. They worked as a team, together.
CB: Yes.
HT: So of course that was an excellent team.
CB: Hmm. And socially, how did the crew get on together?
HT: Quite well, on the, on my crews I can’t remember any, any obstruction in any way. We all hit it off pretty well.
CB: What did you do for relaxation?
HT: Oh well, I, that’s easy, I can tell you, normally we had a drink, you know, occasionally, not tremendously, but occasionally, we would have a drink, as a crew, to get together, be together.
CB: Was that in pubs, or - ?
HT: Eh?
CB: In pubs or on the airfield?
HT: Oh that’s outside. In the evening probably. In a pub, in the local, you know. We rarely bothered, rarely had a drink on the airfield.
CB: Right.
HT: We always used to move out to have a drink.
CB: What was the accommodation like?
HT: The accommodation wasn’t too good at Coningsby, too large a base. But er, wasn’t too good.
CB: So what were you housed in?
HT: I was in the, I was in the sergeants mess, the sergeants part, I was lucky. I had a room of me own! I used to come out of my room, walk along the passage and I’d be in the bar. [laugh] That was a mess, the sergeants mess, so I was lucky at Coningsby. My room was next door, next door to the bar! Well, I came out of me place, then along to the right and there I was in the bar area.
CB: And when you went to Woodhall Spa, what was the accommodation like there?
HT: Well that was, what I was saying, it was a permanent accommodation, you see, permanent mess, you know, everything was peacetime establishment and I was, my room, I had a, there were rooms along, there were passages along you see.
CB: Yes.
HT: Outside the main area and I was in one of the rooms. I was in the nearest to the bar.
CB: This is Coningsby and your second tour.
HT: Coningsby, yeah.
CB: But in your first tour -
HT: Yeah.
CB: You were at Woodhall Spa. So, what accommodation did you have there?
HT: Oh, nissen huts [laugh], nissen huts. Old nissen huts.
CB: The whole crew’s there. How many crews in a nissen hut?
HT: Oh that one.
CB: One each?
HT: One crew would be in a nissen hut, yeah, oh yeah. Sometimes you were split, you know, sometimes you might have, you were spit up. But that was where they was a satellite airfield. Coningsby was permanent, you see, the structure there.
CB: Hmm.
HT: Yeah. Oh yeah, we were split.
CB: What about the food?
HT: Yeah, the food. I would say was reasonable, I can’t complain. The food was reasonable.
CB: Lots of fry ups?
HT: I think the food was fair, fairly good, off hand, yeah, from what I can see, particularly at Coningsby, in the sergeants mess. It was supposedly better than the officers so, there we go, [laugh] so they reckoned anyway. They reckoned so. Some of the lads that were commissioned, you know, and left the sergeants mess, they told us it were bloody rubbish in the officers mess. They were worse off, worse off, they could be, I agree. Yes.
CB: So at the end of your first tour, then you were rested, effectively.
HT: Six month. I decided I’d be off six month and I had six months off.
CB: Yeah. So your six months off was at a Heavy Conversion Unit at Winthorpe.
HT: That’s right. Six months, yeah.
CB: And so, at Winthorpe what were they doing there, and what were you doing?
HT: Winthorpe? Well, it were the same as we were doing anywhere.
CB: You were training people, weren’t you.
HT: Training, yes, same as Coningsby.
CB: Right. And what was your role in the training at the Heavy Conversion Unit?
HT: Me? I was a senior instructor, I suppose. Was responsible for a schedule of people coming through, to see that their training was completed properly and in order. So I was, er, yeah, I think I was fairly responsible really, for the training.
CB: So you had ground school, did you, as well as flying?
HT: Me? Yes. I was a fitter, so I did a mechanics course: four months, and then went back and did a fitters course.
CB: No, I’m, I’m talking about Winthorpe, when you were at, after your first tour.
HT: You have to be first –
CB: You were then training other aircrew at Winthorpe.
HT: Oh, training the aircrew.
CB: What were you doing to them there? You had, gave them tuition on the ground, did you?
HT: Tuition, yeah.
CB: And in the air, as well as in the air?
HT: Yes, we, they were given tuition in the air as well. Yes. On some occasions, not on all, but on some, yeah, they were. That was the part of the job we weren’t very keen on [laugh] to be quite honest. Oh no. So we had er.
CB: ‘Cause the nature of the heavy conversion unit was that the crew would already have been together from the operational training unit.
HT: Yes.
CB: And then [cough] then the flight engineer joined, the crew.
HT: That’s right, at the Conversion Unit. That’s right, yes. And the gunner.
CB: And the extra gunner.
HT: Yeah. They joined the crew at the Conversion Unit. Yeah.
CB: Yeah. So what are you actually doing with the flight engineer who is under training with you? Are you monitoring what he does or are you telling him what, showing him what to do? Or what is happening?
HT: Well he, I suppose instruct him, telling he’s a good idea though. He’s worked there as a flight engineer before he’s reached us, so he’s got some good idea of what he has to do. Any instructions you can give him you do. Yeah.
CB: So after your period, so what we’re talking about at Winthorpe, is, you joined that in October in ’43, and that went on until February ’44.
HT: Yeah.
CB: Then, from there you went to Warboys.
HT: Warboys, yes.
CB: So this was the NTU, so here we’re talking about getting into Pathfinding again. Is that right?
HT: Well, Warboys, an NTU, yeah, Navigational Training Unit.
CB: Yes. So it’s more specific navigation.
HT: Navigation, yeah. Is the -
CB: Is the idea.
HT: Well, that’s the, the main reason for it, navigation, yeah. So you are training the navigators generally.
CB: And this is when you now start, after that, you go to Coningsby, and this is where you are doing your Pathfinding with a new crew, and your pilot is a chap called Baker DFC.
HT: Jeff Baker, yeah.
CB: So what do you remember?
HT: Baker’s an Aussie.
CB: Is he?
HT: Yeah. Australian, yeah. Jeff Baker, yeah. So that was at – Coningsby.
CB: That’s Coningsby.
HT: That’s right, it was.
CB: So what squadron is that?
HT: 97
CB: It’s still 97
HT: I was with 97 all the time.
CB: Right. But it’s the beginning of your second tour.
HT: That’s right. Yeah.
CB: So what stands out in your mind about some of the operations there? ‘Cause we are talking April ’44, before D-Day.
HT: I had quite a, a fair amount of time for Baker. He was, I hit it off pretty well with him, he was quite a decent pilot from what can recollect of him. So, we didn’t have any breaches, we managed to do the tour complete.
CB: You said all the crew was commissioned except you.
HT: Yeah.
CB: How did the crew gel?
HT: How did the?
CB: How did the crew get on, how did they gel?
HT: Well there was, let’s see, there was, I suppose they applied for a commission, most of them.
CB: No, no how did they get on together as a crew, flying as a crew?
HT: Oh absolutely, no trouble, no real trouble anyway, no real trouble.
CB: Were they all second tour people?
HT: Er, they would be, yes, yes, they were.
CB: By definition, for Pathfinder they’re going to be second tour.
HT: Absolutely. Yes.
CB: So you all got your Pathfinder badge.
HT: Yes, you did, had to do so many trips, and you were awarded the Pathfinder badge. I don’t think it was many, one or two. Then of course you had to do a certain number and you were issued the Pathfinder badge permanently.
CB: Right. Now a lot of your flying is daylight as well as doing night time.
HT: That’s right, yeah.
CB: So how did you feel about the daylight raids?
HT: Well, there wasn’t many, there was only three I think, was there?
CB: You’ve got a good, you’ve got quite a few.
HT: Have I? Daylights?
CB: Well actually, a lot of it, I take that back.
HT: I thought I only had about three or four.
CB: Yes. It’s all to do with, yup, okay, a lot of it is actually to do with flying in the UK, daylight.
HT: Oh I see. That’s right, yeah.
CB: What stands out in your mind about the second tour particularly?
HT: I think probably the pilot that I had, he seemed to get on well with, with, Baker. I hit it off pretty well with Baker, Jeff Baker. He was the Aussie, a flight lieutenant.
CB: Did he become a master bomber?
HT: Baker? Yes. He was the flight commander, deputy flight commander.
CB: Right.
HT: He was a flight lieutenant.
CB: Yeah.
HT: The squadron leader was the flight commander you see.
CB: Yup.
HT: And then they’d have a wing commander as the squadron commander
CB: Squadron commander. Well quite a bit of the bombing at that time was of France.
HT: Yeah. Quite so, France mainly, yes.
CB: And the end of the tour was twenty five ops, you said.
HT: Twenty?
CB: You did twenty five ops on your second tour.
HT: Yes. Thirty on the first, twenty five on the second. Fifty five all together.
CB: Yeah.
HT: Yeah. It’s all down there, I think. Yes.
CB: So that takes us to –
HT: You won’t find many like that: two tours.
CB: No. More on Pathfinder.
HT: Absolutely. Oh well, of course. You’d get them, more on Pathfinder, system, yeah.
CB: So this took you through to October, the end of September ’44, didn’t it.
HT: Yes.
CB: Then where did you go after that? You went to somewhere, something different.
HT: Did I? What’s it got on the top there?
CB: It, it’s got you flying with all sorts of different pilots. And that’s when you started flying Stirlings, so.
HT: Oh, I was on a Conversion Unit.
CB: Yes.
HT: Yeah. That’s 16 61, it’ll be down there at the end.
CB: Right. Okay.
HT: 16 61 Conversion Unit.
CB: Where was that?
HT: Winthorpe.
CB: That was also Winthorpe.
HT: Yeah.
CB: Okay.
HT: That’s near Newark.
CB: And the Stirling was used as a, this is October ’44 –
HT: As a substitute. On the Conversion Unit.
CB: Yes. And then they converted to Lancasters, is that right?.
HT: That’s right. Yes, they pushed them into the Stirling initially and then of course they were trained secondly on the, on the Lancaster, yeah.
CB: Hmm. And what was the Stirling like compared with the Lancaster, completely different aeroplane certainly.
HT: Absolutely.
CB: So what was that like?
HT: Well, that was interesting. That was really interesting, I’m pleased I didn’t do my operations on it! It was disgusting. The damned aircraft would only go up to about sixteen thousand feet.
CB: Right.
HT: Seventeen. So it had the, it hadn’t the altitude that it should have had, you know. I wouldn’t have liked to do operations in, no way. Twenty was my, twenty thousand was mine.
CB: You were happier up there.
HT: Lanc. Yeah.
CB: Hmm. What was the work load? How was it different from the Lancaster workload as a flight engineer?
HT: On the, er?
CB: On the Stirling.
HT: Well. On the Lancaster you were sat together with the pilot in front and had all the controls in front of you.
CB: Yes.
HT: On the Stirling you weren’t, you were at the inter part of the fuselage, you had the flying panels there. So you weren’t, the bomb aimer, the pilot sat together, at the front, so you had the control panels in the, seemingly in the centre of the aircraft.
CB: With your own seat.
HT: On the Stirling.
CB: With your own seat.
HT: That was the Stirling.
CB: Because the Lancaster you didn’t have anywhere to sit.
HT: The Lanc you were right, you were at the front, all together you see with the pilot. You had all the controls there, the flight controls were on the left, and [emphasis] you had the throttle controls–
CB: In the middle.
HT: Between you. And you had the, the propeller controls you know, as well, together, four, for the revs, rev counters, and the undercarriage that was between you, between the pilot and you. The flaps, that was between the pilot and engineer, both could operate them. So, er, yeah, so that was that.
CB: But you, but you spent a lot of time standing in the Lancaster.
HT: Absolutely. Yes.
CB: Behind the pilot with your dials on the wall, didn’t you.
HT: Well, no. We, I had a seat and I could let it down, alongside the pilot.
CB: Right. Yeah, but the stuff behind you.
HT: In many cases I did a lot of standing as well. I didn’t sit down on take off, anyway on that rig. I always stood, so er -
CB: Yes. You felt safe enough with that?
HT: Oh yes.
CB: Even on landing.
HT: I was quite safe enough, yes, and ready for the run in…[laugh] Not really, no. I managed quite well there.
CB: But on the Stirling, then you’ve got effectively your own office.
HT: On the stern?
CB: Stirling.
HT: Oh the Stirling!
CB: You’ve got your own office, effectively, haven’t you, your seat and all your controls in front of you.
HT: They’re all in the centre. Yes, the engineer’s got a seat there in the centre as far as I’m aware, yeah. I did a few hours on Stirlings, flying, because we had them on the Conversion Unit.
CB: Yes.
HT: We were using them initially. And then moving them from there on to the Lancaster you see.
CB: Yeah. What was the most difficult thing about the Stirling?
HT: The Stirling. Well, I wasn’t actually involved with the flying of it. But I preferred the controls where they were on the Lanc, half way down the fuselage. And another thing you had about twelve tanks on the Stirling. [Laugh]
CB: Oh did you?
HT: Six on each wing. So that’s bit of trouble. You had the, you know, had the intermediate, you had the fuselage running between the it, between the two fuselages you could move one off for taxi and one on the other side, you were hid. So there was, yeah, so there was quite a lot of juggling going on in the Stirling. [Laugh] Them bloody tanks were disgusting! On that thing there.
CB: In what way?
HT: Well there were about, there must have been a dozen tanks! And both, more probably. There were quite a lot of tanks on Stirling, yeah.
CB: So how did you manage the fuel on the Stirling then, that was different from what you did on a Lancaster?
HT: Well, you had all, had all the, the systems all there just, pretty well, you know. The tanks were all properly joined, they were all joined up, you moved one from into another sort of style, you know, several tanks you could, there was your initial tank, you used for providing the engine with fuel and that was the tank that you moved all the fuel into initially.
CB: Like the Lancaster, it also had wingtip tanks, did it, which you drained early?
HT: The Stirling? Yes, there was tanks in the wings there, I don’t know exactly where, but there were tanks in the wings there. And tanks in the fuselage as well.
CB: Ahead of the bomb bay?
HT: In the Stirling, yeah.
CB: And er, how did the pilots like flying Stirlings?
HT: Well, I don’t think, I wasn’t too keen on them, so I don’t suppose they were, no. I would rather have the Lancaster any time!
CB: What about reliability?
HT: The Lancasters were much easier, you know, to control. They were far easier to control than those things. And you know, you had twelve tanks, twelve, at least twelve tanks, maybe fourteen. You had a lot of tanks, they were all in each wing, and all tied up together. Crossed over.
CB: On the, the Stirling, how reliable were they [emphasis], compared with Lancasters?
HT: Oh, I’ve not time for the Stirling compared, the Lancaster was a much better aircraft, far better. On the Lancaster three tanks in each wing, and you had two tanks linked together. The two inner tanks, the outer tank there was, you could only move it into the inner tank.
CB: Right, yeah. To the main tank.
HT: The main. You couldn’t use the fuel, I think you had to move it.
CB: Into the main tank.
HT: Into the main tank.
CB: But on the, the Stirlings were not used too much on raids later. But what was the condition of the aircraft you were using for the training at Winthorpe? What sort of state were they?
HT: Oh okay, I think, quite good.
CB: Were they.
HT: I was quite happy with the system, the maintenance, yeah. Of course we didn’t use them too much I don’t think, they were, we, just a small amount of the training, you know, initial, you know, initial training before they moved on to the Lanc.
CB: So, your time at Winthorpe, on this Heavy Conversion Unit went past the end of the war.
HT: Yes.
CB: What do you remember about the end of the war in Europe on the 8th of May 1945?
HT: The 8th of May.
CB: That was the end of the, the Germans surrendered.
HT: Yeah, the end of hostilities.
CB:Were there celebrations on the, at Winthorpe, or what happened?
HT: Not to any great extent, no. I think, suppose we probably had a drink [laugh] out of the camp area, you know, to celebrate, but I think it went down normally, you know.
CB: We’ll pause there for a mo.
CB: So you had a considerable time on Stirlings but then you went, at Winthorpe, but then still at Winthorpe you went on 16 61 Heavy Conversion Unit. You went on to Lancasters because they had the Lancaster finishing school there.
HT: Well generally I worked on the Lancs most of the time.
CB: Did you.
HT: I can’t recollect really being involved with the Stirling at all. I may have been slightly, you know, I was slightly but not to any great extent.
CB: But almost each time you flew with a different pilot because of what it was, so how was that?
HT: If I was at Winthorpe, then yes, I’m afraid so.
CB: That was because they were trainee pilots.
HT: That’s right. So I, I wasn’t flying all the time there, of course, but I did fly some of the time. Yes, we all had to do a certain amount of flying.
CB: Right. So it looks as though in August 1945 you gave up being there, at Winthorpe, and then you went to Honiley, in Warwickshire.
HT: Oh. That was after the war.
CB: Yes, September, so we are talking about much later.
HT: Oh yes, much later.
CB: That was when you were in –
HT: I returned to the air force in 19, 1948.
CB: Yes, so we’ll just cover that. It says here, total hours on release of, from the RAF on the 2nd of February 1946 was 734 total, of which 342 were daylight.
HT: Yes.
CB: A lot of that was because you were training other people.
HT: That’s right.
CB: So you left the RAF in ‘46.
HT: Yes. And returned again in 1948.
CB: But what did you when you left the RAF, in 1946? You were demobbed then.
HT: Yeah. What was I doing, yeah.
CB: Because you were an engineer of course, in the air force.
HT: I don’t know what I was.
CB: I’ll just stop there for a mo. What made you go back in the RAF?
HT: Well the job I was doing wasn’t of any real, you know, value.
CB: Right.
HT: So I thought I’d be better, better re-enlist in the mob, in the service.
CB: Yep. In September ’48 you returned, to the RAF.
HT: Well I went as a corporal, you see, I think I was, when I returned to the air force. I wasn’t at the bottom of the ladder like, at least, so I was, and it was a year or two, so of course I, I didn’t drop. I should have had, if I’d been older I wouldn’t have done it, you know.
CB: No.
HT: I was only young you see, early twenties.
CB: Twenty eight.
HT: Now had I been any, you know had I been any younger, any older, I might have had more, more about me, but er, yeah.
CB: So what did you do when you returned to the RAF?
HT: In 1946.
CB: The flying you did you would appear just to have been a passenger.
HT: Oh, I was –
CB: Was that because you were doing air tests.
HT: Oh I was fitting.
CB: Fitter.
HT: Fitter, yeah. I said I’d back, didn’t I, fitting, yeah, I was fitting.
CB: How long did you stay in the RAF after rejoining in 1948?
HT: Well I signed for three years.
CB: Ah.
HT: And of course I was in there fifteen months and then they posted me abroad, after fifteen month.
CB: Right.
HT: They kept me for four years, because I liked it a lot, I had twelve months extra to do, it was one of those things. So I got kept for four years. I got posted abroad, and I was in, where was I? I got posted to, to er, Mirpur is it? Mirpur, that’s part of India. That’s Pakistan I should say, I went to Pakistan.
CB: Which was an independent comp, country by then.
HT: It was independent yeah. India.
CB: What were you doing? Training Pakistani - ?
HT: I don’t think was doing anything there. I just passed through think, maybe there for a week or so.
CB: I’m just going to stop for a mo.
[Other]
CB: So you dropped, stopped off in Pakistan for a week or so you said, and you’re a ground fitter.
HT: Yeah. I was a corporal.
CB: A corporal airframe fitter.
HT: Engine.
CB: Engine fitter. So where were you going?
HT: Well I did a tour, I believe I was out in Malaya.
CB: Oh were you. Right.
CB: So I was at Penang. Have you heard?
CB: Yes I know it.
HT: In the north, on the coast, of Malaya. I was there. That was the, that was the rest centre, I was there on several occasions, in Penang and I was actually on the island, Singapore.
CB: Oh, were you.
HT: Yeah.
CB: Do you, what sort of aircraft were you - ?
HT: I can’t recollect.
CB: So you left the RAF again in 1952.
HT: Yeah.
CB: And what did you do after that?
HT: In 1952, yes.
CB: Because you’d signed on for three years but they made you do four. So that takes you to 1952.
HT: 1952, yeah.
CB: So you went into engineering in civilian life did you?
HT: 1952 I don’t know what I was doing.
CB: Because you’re aged thirty two by now.
HT: Yes, thirty two.
CB: What age did you get married?
HT: Oh, I was only twenty three.
CB: Were you. And where did you meet your wife?
HT: Oh, I met her at the RAF, the RAF at the RAF station. She was working in the NAAFI.
CB: In your, where you were stationed?
HT: Where I was stationed, yeah.
CB: In ’43?
HT: It would be ’42, yeah.
CB: ’42?
HT: Yeah.
CB: Right. So this was before you?
HT: It would be ’42.
CB: At Woodhall Spa, or Swinderby was it?
HT: Er, it was, er -
CB: Anyway, you were chatting her up in the NAAFI were you, and that’s how it started?
HT: In actual fact no, what happened, I, there was a dance going on
CB: Oh!
HT: At the station. So of course, I was in the sergeants mess having a drink and I decided to, that I’d go out and see what was going off in the dance you see. So I came out, and I was on me own, and I came out and there was these girls, come down from the NAAFI would be about four of them, so I tagged on to one of them then she became me wife [laugh].
CB: Never looked back did you.
HT: So she never looked back, she didn’t! So I tagged on to one of them and she was me wife! [laugh]
CB: What was her name?
HT: Iris, she was only on the NAAFI a couple of month.
CB: Oh. That’s in ’42.
HT: That’s in 1942, yes.
CB: And she, was she a WAAF, or was she a civilian?
HT: No. Civilian. Yes.
CB: And what did she do, after you met her? Then where, did she stay on the station or do something else?
HT: No, she was married then, married for life.
CB: When did you marry her?
HT: I think was it 1942 or 3? Yeah.
CB: So it was fairly quick.
HT: Oh yes, she had a family quickly, yes. So we were married, well married. We had one or two before the war finished, so it was, we had one or two kids before the war finished, two probably. Yeah.
CB: How did you manage to keep in touch, with your operational and training flying, with your wife? Did she live nearby?
HT: Yes.
CB: Her parents, what?
HT: For two, I would say that for a couple of month she lived on the unit, she was working in the NAAFI.
CB: Right.
HT: So of course after that, she left, and of course she was home you see, with her parents.
CB: Yes. But where was home for her?
HT: Her home was in Condover. Condover, you’ve heard of Condover. You’ve heard of Hera
CB: Oh yes, Condover. Yeah. I know, in Shropshire.
HT: Yeah. It’s a couple of mile from Hera. Condover. Can you remember where I lived?
[Other]: Not sure. Near Condover.
HT: You can’t?
CB: HT: In Derbyshire
CB: I’ll stop for a bit.
CB: When you left the RAF then where did you go? What did you work for?
HT: Rolls Royce.
CB: How long did you work for Rolls Royce? [Dog bark]
HT: Twenty six years.
CB: Did you.
HT: Yes.
CB: Was that a good job?
HT: Reasonable I think. I was, I was in charge of the job you know. It wasn’t well up but it was, I was in charge.
CB: Were you on Merlins engines still or had you moved on to jet engines?
HT: Merlins. I was on Merlins engines most of the time I was there. Jet engines, I just don’t know, I think I probably moved on to them.
CB: Bit later.
HT: In the end. But I was in charge of the job, yeah.
CB: That’s how you came to live in this area, was it, originally? Did you live in this area when you worked for Rolls Royce?
HT: No, I lived in Poulton.
CB: There was a Rolls Royce plant there was there?
HT: No, Poulton le Fylde. No, I used to travel into Derby.
CB: Oh, in to Derby.
HT: Poulton isn’t far you know, from Derby, so I travelled from there, yeah into Derby.
CB: Okay. We’ll stop there thank you very much.
[Other]: You went to Africa.
HT: That’s right.
CB: Now, on one occasion we missed, so lets pick up on this. You had to fly to Africa.
HT: That’s right.
CB: So what was the situation there? What were you bombing in the first place?
HT: Well we were bombing –
CB: Northern Italy, Spezia.
HT: Spezia, weren’t we. On the way back we bombed Italy.
CB: Yes. But the plane was not in a good state.
HT: Yeah, I can remember we, what was it, we were bombing in Italy, we were bombing somewhere, in Italy. Anyway, I er, we had to land in the, North Africa.
CB: Right.
HT: To refuel and then we could return to Britain.
CB: Okay.
HT: So when we landed there, I found that the aircraft was unserviceable and I left a note for the Chief Engineer to sort it out, and they did bugger all. So I thought well, I’m buggered if I’m stopping this dump here. [Laugh] So I got, the rear gunner says I’ll give you a hand to the bloody cowlings, take ‘em off, so.
CB: The cowling.
HT: The cowling.
CB: Of the engine.
HT: The engine, yeah. So the cowlings were off very quickly and the magneto points were out, and when Henry got the magneto points out they were solid, [emphasis] they were welded. [Loud laugh] You know what I mean, don’t you.
CB: Yeah.
HT: You’ve got a point on the mag. Like.
CB: Yeah. And they’re closed.
HT: You’ve got a pivot here. Have you got it? The pivot. Solid.
CB: Yeah.
HT: Points wouldn’t move. [laugh] Solid. So, what, so we looked at the aircraft next door that was cat AC, that had landed and was damaged.
CB: Right.
HT: So he took the bloody points out of one of the engines there. I didn’t ask. I took the points out. So I took the points out and put them in my aircraft.
CB: Yeah.
HT: And took off, had it not been for that, and had I left it, and I would have been there until the ground crew repaired it, and I would have been there for another three or four days.
CB: Yeah.
HT: So I didn’t want that.
CB: No.
HT: I wanted to get back. So that was the only thing I could do and I did. So you know, how many would do that? How many. [emphasis] Very, very, would do that, very few. I wouldn’t be the only one, I’d be, but there’d very few. I took the bloody points, even the points weren’t there for me to, I had to go to another –
CB: Another aircraft.
HT: I couldn’t use them, I had to go and get them from another aircraft. They were solid.
CB: Yeah. Which was a damaged one.
HT: They were welded, they were solid.
CB: That was the heat, was it?
HT: Oh, the heat, yeah, solid, so I couldn’t do anything.
CB: No. Did the engines overheat occasionally?
HT: Occasionally, yeah. But okay, that, okay that was quite an issue.
CB: Bit of initiative that was.
HT: And I, I left it for the chief engineer. I left the job for the engineering staff. And it reached the point where I had to do it myself or, stop, and remain there for some days.
CB: What was the pilot’s attitude to that? This is Munro is it, or Baker?
HT: It was either one or the other, I think it was probably Munro, so we, it was Jimmy Munro I think, yeah. So of course we were there and I, I did the job got it. Flew back. I got the, didn’t get a pat on the back, didn’t get any thanks. Bugger all. I might just as well have not bothered.
CB: But you got back.
HT: But we got back and that was what I wanted anyway. I wanted to get back.
CB: Now, just going back, further, sorry, go on.
HT: So, you know, I, I, the aircraft didn’t stop me, [emphasis] the aircraft was unserviceable and there was no one to repair it. I did it.
CB: Because you were the engineer.
HT: And I could do most of the things.
CB: Of course.
HT: So of course, naturally I, and if it was possible for a human being to do it, I could do it. And did.
CB: Having been ground crew originally.
HT: On occasions I did, and that was one occasion. In never got any credit for it or anything you know.
CB: What you did get credit for was for doing two tours, when you were awarded the DFM.
HT: Well I didn’t get the award, I didn’t get the DFM until I had completed forty five trips.
CB: Right.
HT: So I was on the way to doing two, I hadn’t completed two.
CB: No, you hadn’t finisheded two.
HT: Before they, before they suggested I should have the award, I had completed forty five.
CB: Yes.
HT: And then of course It came through before I properly finished you see.
CB: Yes. What about the rest of the crew? Were they all DFCs or only your pilot, Baker?
HT: Well I was on. Oh, Baker, Baker was a DFC.
CB: Already, yeah.
HT: And bar.
CB: Oh, and bar. And what about the rest of the crew?
HT: I think probably the navigator would, his navigator would have some, would have had a DFC.
CB: But at that stage you were flight sergeant rather than a warrant officer.
HT: I was a flight sergeant, I was a warrant officer probably, when, when I joined up with them.
CB: And wouldn’t you have got a DFC if you were a warrant officer?
HT: Well, yeah, I was a flight sergeant as you say, initially, but I moved on to warrant officer of course.
CB: But it was actually awarded to you, technically -
HT: That would have been awarded to me before.
CB: - when you were a flight sergeant.
HT: When I received the award.
CB: You were a warrant officer.
HT: Well I was told it was going to be, I had the opportunity of moving it to DFC!
CB: Oh you did!
HT: Yeah, I did, yeah.
CB: And what stopped you?
HT: Me, I said DFCs were ten a penny! There’s more, double DFCs than they had to DFMs. That’s the only reason. [Laugh]
CB: Right. Now you also got -
HT: So there you go. It’s true, what I’m telling you!
CB: Yes.
HT: You know, okay, a DF, they had far less DFMs, so they’re more important in my opinion. For the same, purely the same, one was an airmen’s award and they cut it out initially, they stopped it, it was wrong.
CB: Did they?
HT: Well, it wasn’t right, was it?
CB: No. No.
HT: So of course it was stopped. So I, so I got the DFC, DFM.
CB: DFM. You also received the Belgian Croix de Guerre. What prompted that?
HT: Yeah. Hey?
CB: What caused that?
HT: The Belgian Cross of War. I don’t know what happened there, I’m sure. The Belgians.
CB: Gave it to you yeah.
HT: They were the ones.
CB: And then you got Legion of Honour from France, fairly recently.
HT: I got that recently, didn’t I. And it was French, it was the French that -
CB: Yeah. Did that.
CB: Awarded me that. It was the MP what gave it me. He was the MP, he was the Member of Parliament for my area.
CB: Oh was he.
HT: Recently, Cumberland of course, you know, further north.
[Other}: Hope.
CB: Yeah.
HT: And I went there, and he presented it me. I don’t know what, he, he was an important joker, this MP; [laugh] he was an important bugger. What was he? I just forget now.
CB: You can say what you like Henry. [Laugh]
HT: His family and he were of some importance!
CB: If you want to take down MPs that’s fine!
HT: So I chuffed him up. [Laugh] I chuffed him up grand, yeah.
CB: Right. Henry Townsley, DFM, Croix de Guerre, Legion of Honour thank you very much for an interesting time.
HT: [Guffawing] It’s true!
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with Henry Townsley
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Chris Brockbank
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2018-03-14
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
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Sound
Identifier
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ATownsleyH180314
Conforms To
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Pending revision of OH transcription
Format
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01:12:56 audio recording
Language
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eng
Coverage
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Description
An account of the resource
Henry Townsley was born near Workington and left school at fourteen years of age and started work as an apprentice vehicle fitter. After a spell as a junior engineer in the Merchant Navy he volunteered, in April 1940, for the RAF, rather than the Navy as he suffered from sea sickness and fancied the prospects of flying. He also felt that aero engineering was the coming thing.
Recruited as an engine fitter he trained at St. Athans and then volunteered for flying duties as it was a quick promotion. Because of his engineering background his flight engineering training was reduced to two weeks
He was then posted to RAF Swinderby to fly the Manchester and then to 97 squadron, which became a Pathfinder squadron, at RAF Woodhall Spa alongside 617 Squadron. In May 1943 the squadron moved to RAF Bourne and he was promoted to warrant officer. Henry was happy to stay as an NCO and did not welcome more responsibility.
After his first tour he was rested for six months as a senior instructor at 1661 HCU unit at RAF Winthorpe flying the Stirling. He compares flying the Lancaster and Stirling in some detail.
He returned to operational flying and recalls bombing La Spezia and landing in North Africa where his aircraft went u/s but he repaired it himself in order to return home.
Henry remembers that there were no great celebrations on VE day and he was demobbed in February 1946.
After a period in civilian life, Henry re-enlisted in the RAF in September 1948 as a corporal fitter and was posted to Malaya and Singapore. He left the RAF again in 1952 and then worked for Rolls Royce for 26 years, working on Merlin engines.
Contributor
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Anne-Marie Watson
Terry Holmes
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
England--Cambridgeshire
Wales--Vale of Glamorgan
England--Nottinghamshire
England--Lincolnshire
Italy
Italy--La Spezia
North Africa
Singapore
Malaya
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1940
1942
1943-05-19
1943-05
1940-04
1946-02
1948-09
1952
1661 HCU
97 Squadron
aircrew
bombing
Distinguished Flying Medal
fitter engine
flight engineer
ground crew
Heavy Conversion Unit
Lancaster
Manchester
Navy, Army and Air Force Institute
Pathfinders
promotion
RAF Bourn
RAF Coningsby
RAF St Athan
RAF Swinderby
RAF Winthorpe
RAF Woodhall Spa
searchlight
Stirling
training
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/1085/11543/PPritchardA1701.2.jpg
665f37b1fc773d7c481a87e32db937c5
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/1085/11543/APritchardC170823.1.mp3
3aaf3d7ce542de333a9bec8d84eec5cd
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Pritchard, Arthur
A Pritchard
Description
An account of the resource
Six items. An oral history interview with Carolyn Pritchard about her father, Arthur Pritchard (2206806 Royal air Force) documents and photographs. He flew operations as a flight engineer with with 463, 467 and 97 Squadron until he was shot down. He was hidden by the French Resistance until the liberation of Paris.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Carolyn Pritchard and catalogued by Barry Hunter.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2017-08-23
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Pritchard, A
Transcribed audio recording
A resource consisting primarily of recorded human voice.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
SP: This is Susanne Pescott and I’m interviewing Carolyn Pritchard today for the International Bomber Command Centre’s Digital Archive. We’re at Carolyn’s home and it is the 23rd of August 2017. So, first of all thank you Carolyn for agreeing to be interviewed today. So, first of all do you just want to tell me about your father and what he did before the war?
CP: Yes. As he joined up on his, on his eighteenth birthday he didn’t have, after leaving school he worked for a baker’s delivering bread and that’s it really. And then he joined up.
SP: Yeah.
CP: On his eighteenth birthday.
SP: Did he ever say why he wanted to join the RAF?
CP: No. No. No. He didn’t. He didn’t mention why.
SP: Ok. So he went into the RAF and do you know what, where he went first of all? What he did?
CP: Yes. He was, he joined up on his eighteenth birthday and he was, he did his training at St Athans in South Wales. He passed out as flight sergeant and was posted to RAF Winthorpe in Lincoln where he was introduced to his Australian crew as flight engineer. And that was on the 29th of February 1944. He joined the 463 Squadron. That was the Australian squadron in RAF Waddington. They did seventeen sorties while they were in Waddington and they were Germany, over Germany, France. And on the 9th no, sorry it was the 7th of May 1944, the pilot officer Bryan Giddings and crew, that was dad’s crew, they posted, they were posted to 97 Squadron. That was the Pathfinders and that was at RAF Coningsby. They completed another three missions. Seeing action in D-Day. On their twenty first sortie, that was the 9th 10th of June 1944, on a night raid over a railway junction at Etampes, that’s south of Paris, Pilot Officer Giddings and crew failed to return. Right. I don’t know how much —
[recording pause]
CP: After releasing flares over the target the Lancaster ND764 was hit by flak and they were then attacked from below by a night fighter. Many many years later when he was able to relate his story to me he recollected the moment the aircraft was hit. The inner or outer port side engine was on fire. He wasn’t sure which one it was. The suicidal height at which they were flying, the noise, the smoke in the cabin and unable to communicate amongst each other, the cramped conditions in the cockpit, no place to wear your parachute. He always stored it on the floor. Frantically searching for it, the rush of cold air from the open back door. That was the navigator jumping out. Then he trying to prise, prise open the escape hatch at the front. Every second was wasted. Making survival impossible. The whole episode could not have lasted more than a few minutes and before he realised it was a doomed machine he, he had jumped out.
SP: So, how Carolyn, when he told you that, how did you feel when he was relaying the story?
CP: Well, a couple of years later we’d gone back to RAF Coningsby to see the Lancaster and we were able to go on board. And I could then visualise because the Lancaster wasn’t aircrew friendly at all. It was so small and cramped. And I felt so sorry for the mid-upper gunner. Where he was positioned would have been impossible for him to get out. And the tail end Charlie was, he was in this small little cockpit and again that would have been impossible for him to get out and the aeroplane was going down so fast. And eventually when they did find the bodies they were found in, in the aircraft. Yes. The three of them.
SP: So three —
CP: Were, yes it was the bomb aimer, the mid-upper gunner was, he couldn’t get out and the rear gunner which was the tail end Charlie. They are the three that couldn’t get out. The pilot had jumped out when the plane was very very low but his pilot, his parachute didn’t open. And also the wireless operator. No. I’m muddling up now. It was the navigator. The wireless operator had jumped out already and it was the navigator that had jumped out without a parachute and he was found with the whistle in his mouth. So he’d obviously survived the crash but I don’t know how long and was trying to attract attention. Yes.
SP: And how was your father when he was talking about the story?
CP: He was, he’d put the whole episode really at the back of his mind all the years we were growing up. Even though he used to talk about them. The crew.
[recording paused]
SP: So Carolyn, obviously it’s quite emotional talking about your father and the crew there so can you just talk me through what happened then after he’d got out of the plane.
CP: Yes. Because the aircraft was on fire and it was so low he’d baled out and he’d sprained his ankle. So he was hobbling around the French countryside with a damaged ankle and famously asking villagers for the way to the coast. He was trying to get back to the coast. Eventually he’d arrived at a small village, Egly and entered the local church. He’d seen a local man at the altar and [pause] and told him in broken English that he was Welsh. That he was an RAF airman. The French man couldn’t speak English and what he did he took, he gave dad a glass of water and then he took him to a café opposite the church. On entering the café dad waved a hundred franc note from his RAF kit and ordered champagne for everybody in the, in the café. There was panic as the Germans were in the village and he was hastily ushered to the back room. A young teenage boy from the village was brought in. He could speak a little English and he asked dad to explain what had happened. Dad said that his aircraft had been shot at and that he’d baled out and, but he was really uncertain with the rest of the crew and he kept asking and asking how they were. So that they could check his identity with London they hid dad in a small air raid shelter underground and if they, if he hadn’t checked out right I think they would have just left him there. Once the ok came from London the local leader of the French Resistance was summoned and put him in the care of Monsieur George Danton and his family. They risked being shot if caught hiding a British airman and he was given a new identity, well an identity and civilian clothing. His ID was a deaf and dumb Frenchman. And a bicycle. He was moved from safe house to safe house until eventually he ended up in Paris. In Antony in Paris. He was always instructed to follow a parcel tied to the back of Mr Danton’s cycle. Not Mr Danton himself. And once they had arrived at Mr Danton’s house in Paris Mr Danton went into the building without the parcel. The parcel was still left on the bicycle and a few minutes later came out, picked up the parcel, took it into the house and then dad followed. And that was the time that they could embrace each other because they knew then that they were in a safe house.
SP: So, Carolyn obviously dad’s now in the safe house. Did he talk about what life was like in the safe house?
CP: Yes. He did. He kept a diary while he was there. Life was very mundane. And there was little food. Jam and bread kind of thing. And now and again they used to try and get a cigarette for him because he was absolutely desperate for cigarettes. And then they tried to teach him. They tried to teach him a couple of French words to just to get about and whenever it was a bit safe for them to go out Mr Danton used to take him to the, some of the airfields where the German, the Germans had their weapons and aircraft and say to dad, ‘You make sure that you remember this. That when you get back to the UK and you’re debriefed that you can tell them where things are.’ That kind of thing. Yes. Yes.
SP: So, how did he actually get back to — obviously he was in a safe house.
CP: Yes.
SP: How did he get back in to the UK?
CP: He was, he was in the safe house for over two months. And then there was the liberation of Paris on the August the 24th. Right.
[recording paused]
CP: Yes. On or about the 23rd of June they tried to get dad back to the, to the UK. They were expecting a Lysander aircraft to land on, on a landing strip but they tried a couple of times but it was, they felt it was too dangerous because the Germans were still, still around. So they had to, it was just too risky so they had to abort. They tried to get him out there but eventually he hitched a lift with a war correspondent for the Sunday Pictorial. A Rex North. And they eventually got to Paris. On the way there they were, he was given a bottle of champagne which I’ve, we’ve still got today actually in the house. Undrinkable. Yes. And eventually on the 24th of August he flew back in a Dakota to the French, from the French coast to Hendon. And at that time, after that he was debriefed. He had to go down to London to be debriefed to what he’d seen. And, and that was it.
SP: Did he talk at all about the debriefing? Did he say that was like or —
CP: No. He didn’t. He remembered. He had a marvellous memory. He’d remembered everything he’d seen while he was in Paris trying to help. Trying to help while he was back. No. He didn’t actually. No, he didn’t.
SP: And what happened after the debrief? Did he, what happened to him after that?
CP: Well he, he’d, he was allowed home. One thing. One thing that struck me when I was, I had always been speaking to him over the years was how he didn’t get any counselling and everything. There were so many people killed and he kept asking, ‘What’s happened to the crew? What’s happened to the crew?’ And they didn’t know. Even the crew, years and years later after speaking to the crew’s families they hadn’t known for years, well months, what had happened to them. And he was allowed to go home. Which, he came back to our little village here and, and that was it. He had a couple of weeks here and then he was posted to Scotland as an air traffic controller. So that was the end of his war. Yes. And where he met my mother.
SP: Right.
CP: She was in the RAF as well. She was a WAAF. Yes.
SP: So, obviously they met up in Scotland and then —
CP: Yes. They did. Yes. Yes. They met up in Scotland.
SP: And came back to live in Wales.
CP: Eventually, they did. Yes. They, they got married and always lived in this little village. Yeah. My mother was from Liverpool. Yes. Yeah.
SP: And then what did your father do after the war?
CP: He worked in construction. Working for big machinery. He was offered a career in the RAF as [pause] I think in Canada. They wanted him to be trained in Canada but he wasn’t interested anymore after going through such harrowing experience during the war. He didn’t want anything to do with flying. Yes. So he took a different career.
SP: What about you? How did it affect you growing up with your father’s stories? Was it —
CP: Well, it did. He always, he always, he hid a lot. He always talked about the boys.
[recording paused]]
CP: Yes. Always talked about the boys to our families. And as we were growing up we knew about them even though we had never met them. And when my sister Shirley and her husband had got married they had gone to Europe on their honeymoon and thought they would try and trace first of all the French Resistance families to try and get back in touch again. Which they did. They managed to, to get in touch with the French Resistance. That was in 1977. I think it was 1977. And eventually my dad went over for the first time in 1977 to meet the families of the French Resistance. And ever since, all his life he kept in touch with them. They either came to our little village here to see him or he’d gone back to see them. All always visiting the boy’s graves. By that time he’d known that they perished and they knew exactly where they’d been buried and the stories. The harrowing stories that followed. Yeah. So we did know the boys. And he used to come up with some funny stories about them. Like if he had a date with a WAAF they’d all go to the pictures together [laughs] Yeah.
[recording paused]
CP: Yes. He used to talk, like I said about the boys. One was an avid reader. Always had a book. Even when they went on, on their ops at night and the pilot used to have to say, ‘Put that light off,’ because he had this tiny little light in his, he was a upper-gunner. Just in case he attracted the Germans. And I think the rear gunner used to write poetry. I’m sure dad said he did. They were well educated. Very very well educated men. I think they taught my father a lot because first of all they couldn’t understand him when he joined the crew because he was Welsh speaking all his life. Had a very big accent. Welsh accent. Could hardly speak English to be honest. Yes. And they taught him a lot of culture. Yes. Took him to London on their time off when they had time off. And a few of them used to come to our little village when they, because they couldn’t go back to Australia obviously when they had time off and they used to come to the village here. My dad’s family had met them. Yes. Lovely men.
SP: And you kept in touch you say, with the Resistance.
CP: Oh yes.
SP: Did you keep in touch with the Australian families as well?
CP: Families, as well. Yes. And that, well he hadn’t really because I’m one of eight so during, during his time while we were growing up he had a lot on his hands [laughs] So he, he didn’t have time but as we grew up and we knew about the boys I used to try and say, ‘Oh, do you remember where they came from, dad?’ And all that. Anyway, I think it was in 2004. I think it was 2004 there was a knock on the front door and a man handed my father a letter and left. So he read the letter and it was a member of the crew. It was the Webb family. And they had found out my father, where my father lived, managed to get somebody that was connected to the 97 Squadron website, Ron Evans, to deliver, who lived in Wales, to deliver a letter to dad introducing themselves. Saying that if he didn’t want to get in touch, you know, keep in touch or get in touch with them that was ok. But my father was absolutely thrilled he had their address. They lived in Sydney so, and then we, I was on the internet then so I was able to email them and say yes of course. I think it was 2006 they came over from Australia and spent six weeks in Wales with us here. And that was very nice. And then the McGill family, that was the upper gunner, they came over in, I think it was just over two years ago and we went to the Bomber Command Spire. The unveiling of the Spire. They came and we were in touch and we’re still in touch with them all. Yes. We’re still in touch with the Australians. Lovely people. Send Christmas cards every year. Have letters from them. Yes. Unfortunately, part of, well the Giddings family they’ve, they’ve died. We’ve lost touch there. The Clements family the same. But the Seales we still speak to. The Webbs and the McGills. Yes.
SP: And how important is that to you to keep that contact going?
CP: Oh, it’s very important. Yes. The boys. Memories are still, still there. And actually the, actually both families the McGills and the Webbs we actually went over to France on different occasions to stay with the Dantons and to visit the graves. Yeah. So that they could see where they were. Yeah.
SP: So, we were talking about your father earlier. You mentioned on the day of the final flight.
CP: Oh yes.
SP: For the whole crew.
CP: Yes.
SP: They had certain superstitions. It didn’t feel quite right that day. Do you just want to share that story?
CP: Yes. Yes. They used to, well they used to, you know just before they taxied off for the mission they used to wee on the front wheel. But that particular night three or four WAAFs had come down to the air, airfield to wave them off so they couldn’t carry out the weeing. So that was the night that the plane was shot down so my father felt that if only they’d wee’d. Yeah.
SP: Did you talk about that? Saying that was a superstition that they had.
CP: They all, yes. They always carried it, they did that every time they went on a mission. Yes. But not that particular night. Yes.
SP: Just chatting, is there anything else you feel you want to say about that you haven’t had the chance to say about your father or any, the impact on the family or anything like that?
CP: Well, I think, I think going back to when they used to come back from their missions and then they were always, they always were given a big breakfast. And they’d be sitting there with their cigarettes obviously. And they used to call, they used to have tablets, uppers and downers I think but he never used to touch them. But the coldness of when they used to go into the mess and the fact that their locker had been cleared and as if they had never existed. You know, the crews that had never returned. I just felt that that was very sad and he always used to feel that was very sad. Yes. And the fact that he didn’t know, while he was in France, he didn’t know what had happened to the rest of the crew and he’d asked and asked and nobody knew and it was months later that he did find out and that was so, so sad for him. Yeah. Because they were best of friends. Did everything together.
SP: That’s ok. Alright. Well, I just want to —
CP: Yeah.
SP: Thank you Carolyn very much for sharing those stories and obviously the impact on you as well.
CP: Yes.
SP: So, on behalf of the International Bomber Command Centre thank you very much.
CP: Oh, you’re welcome. Thank you.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Interview with Carolyn Pritchard
Creator
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Susanne Pescott
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
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2017-08-23
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
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Sound
Identifier
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APritchardC170823, PPritchardA1701
Format
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00:26:53 audio recording
Language
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eng
Coverage
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Royal Australian Air Force
Second generation
Description
An account of the resource
Carolyns father, Arthur, joined the Royal Air Force on his 18th birthday. Following his training as a flight engineer, was posted to RAF Winthorpe. He was allocated to a crew consisting entirely of Australians. In February 1944 the crew were posted onto Lancaster aircraft of 463 Squadron at RAF Waddington. On the 7th May 1944, they were posted to 97 Squadron at RAF Coningsby. It was from RAF Coningsby on their 21st operation on board ND 764, they were shot down 30 miles south of Paris. Carolyn describes in detail the events, from the aircraft being damaged by anti-aircraft fire and then being attacked by a Luftwaffe fighter, to the escape from the aircraft and subsequent contact with French civilians who sheltered him up to his return to the UK after the liberation of Paris in August 1944. Following his return, Arthur was granted three weeks leave. He did not return to flying, instead he retrained and became an air traffic controller. He was posted to Scotland, and it was here he met his future wife. In the 1970’s, whilst on a holiday in Europe, her sister managed to establish contact with members of the French Resistance who had sheltered Arthur. In 1977 Arthur was able to visit them and the graves of his fellow crew who did not survive and remained in contact for the remainder of his life. Carolyn recalls her father describing a superstition the crew used to carry out before each opeion. Each crew member would urinate on the aircraft wheels before boarding. Several members of the Women's Auxiliary Air Force came to wave them off on their last opeion and discretion meant they were unable to carry out their routine.
Contributor
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Ian Whapplington
Julie Williams
Spatial Coverage
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France
Great Britain
England--Nottinghamshire
England--Lincolnshire
France--Paris
Temporal Coverage
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1944-02
1944-05-07
1944-08
Conforms To
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Pending revision of OH transcription
463 Squadron
97 Squadron
aircrew
anti-aircraft fire
bale out
bombing
evading
final resting place
flight engineer
ground personnel
Lancaster
Pathfinders
RAF Coningsby
RAF Waddington
RAF Winthorpe
Resistance
shot down
superstition
Women’s Auxiliary Air Force
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https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/555/11526/PPennyJ1501.1.jpg
fff42be023f2039d6a047d63b00ab006
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/555/11526/APennyJA170905.2.mp3
9db10f0125c7c6b7a0fee8e200fdb6da
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Penny, Jim
James Alfred Penny
J A Penny
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Identifier
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Penny, J
Description
An account of the resource
Three items. Two oral history interviews with Flight Lieutenant Jim Penny (b. 1922, 1345892 Royal Air Force) and his log book.
He joined the RAF in 1940 and flew operations as a pilot with 97 Squadron from RAF Bourn. Targets included Nuremberg, München Gladbach, Berlin, Montlucon Dunlop rubber factory in France, and the Modane Tower Tunnel. His aircraft was shot down over Berlin 24 November 1943 and he became a prisoner of war. He was liberated on 3 May 1945 and retired from the RAF on 19 July 1971.
The collection was catalogued by Barry Hunter.
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2015-08-16
Requires
A related resource that is required by the described resource to support its function, delivery, or coherence.
Jim joined the RAF in July 1940 on his 18th birthday. His ‘Flight’ was sent to the US to train under the ‘Arnold scheme’. He went to a variety of bases to learn to fly (detained in 1st interview), flying the PT17 Stearman biplane, BT-13A, AT-6A Harvard, Vultee-13, and then the Armstrong Siddeley, before returning on the Queen Elizabeth as a newly commissioned pilot with the rank of Sergeant.
On returning to the UK, he was posted to RAF Shawbury (Shropshire) Advance Flying Unit. Jim’s next posting was to RAF Tilstock Heath where he ‘crewed up’. Complete with crew he arrived at RAF Sleap (an auxiliary station for RAF Tilstock Heath). On being asking if they would be willing to join the Pathfinder Force all agreed to accept the offer – PFF was elite after all. After HCU training at RAF Blyton je stated, ‘The Lancaster was the finest plane I’ve ever flown’. On 26th July 1943 Jim was promoted to Flight Sergeant.
He remembered the RAF casualties and how their work affected their mental state, particularly the Squadron Casualties. However, the awareness that they were regularly striking at the heart to Nazi Germany left the with an enduring pride in being a ‘Armada’.
Jim and his crew transferred to RAF Upwood – Pathfinder Navigation Training Unit then to RAF Bourne 97.
Jim flew to bomb Nuremberg, München Gladbach, Berlin itself many times, Montlucon Dunlop rubber factory in France, and the Modane Tower Tunnel in France. He was involved in 2 flights that were ‘Boomerang flights’. One of the October operations was to be part of the decoy flight that was to draw fighters away from Kessel onto themselves, and bomb Frankfurt.
In November 1943 they were judged to be a competent part of the PFF and were tasked to be a back-up marker crew – the ones with the GREEN flares.
They flew to Dusseldorf, Manheim and Berlin. On 24 November 1943 they were hit by flak, managed to survive, became a POW until he was liberated on 3rd May 1945.
On 6th October 1945 he reported to No 34 Maintenance Unit at RAF Montford Bridge. A year later he had refresher course at Moreton-in-the-Marsh, as a Warrant Officer.
In 1948 Jim joined the City of Lincoln, Lincoln Squadron Bomber Command at RAF Waddington. He left Waddington to join the RAF Central Flying School as a flying instructor which he found very rewarding when he sent a pupil solo. Jim tried for a permanent commission while posted to RAF Ternhill but failed because he was tone deaf. Jim was offered a branch commission at the age of 37.
He left RAF as Flight Lieutenant on 19th July 71. He had no regrets about serving in the RAF and was a part of the Shrewsbury RAFA and the Shropshire Aircrew.
Claire CampbellClaire Campbell
Transcribed audio recording
A resource consisting primarily of recorded human voice.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
CB: My name is Chris Brockbank and today is the 5th of September 2017 and I'm in Shrewsbury with Jim Penny to talk about his interesting life and times. What’s your earliest recollection of life then, Jim?
JP: Say again. My earliest recollections of what?
CB: Of life?
JP: I haven’t thought [laughs]I have no idea.
[recording paused]
JP: Well, my earliest recollections when I was four years old we had a Catholic school, a Catholic Church across the road from where we stayed stop and the canon used to walk up and down reading, I think his breviary in the morning and one day I went across there on my little tricycle and I said, ‘Are you the Canon?’ ‘Yes,’ he said. ‘When are you going to be fired?’ And he burst out laughing and we were friends from then on and remained friends until I started school which is why I know I was four years old. That do?
CB: Yeah.
JP: Well, I was born in 114 Dixon Avenue, Glasgow on the 19th of July 1922 to William Penny and Elsie Ann Harvey who was born, dad was born in 1880 and mum in 1881. Both came from Aberdeenshire. My father had two brothers and five sisters all of whom immigrated to the dominions. My father to New Zealand. His plan was to send for my mother but realised he couldn't afford the passage. He bought his passage home to marry her. My mother had eight brothers but none of the Harveys emigrated. My father, my parents left school at eleven. My grandparents were crofters and in due course my dad became a ploughman. I soon discovered, I had four brothers my memories of them are being much loved and cared for. The twins Tommy and Lorney born [pause] born in 1905 were Scottish [pairs] champions for five years. Sandy, born in 1909 was a good scholar and Bill born in 1914 at one time was the twin’s coxswain. When he was eighteen the four brothers became a crew and I became their cox. I was aged ten and we were known as the Fourpence Halfpenny Crew. My memories are that we won most of the regatta's we entered. Coxing my brothers and sometimes other crews at regattas at their request gave me an early confidence with adults. I still think it was easier for me, easier for me to adapt to service life. Tommy became an engineer. Lorney and Sandy were carpenters and Bill was a draughtsman. When war came along Bill was employed in the shipyards and both Tommy and Sandy were conscripted for the same shipyard. Somehow Laurie who [unclear] was overlooked. He was conscripted for the Army at the ripe old age of thirty eight. I went to Aberdeen, no, Albert Road Academy when I was five years old. It had Infant, Junior and Senior sections. I was very happy there. I remember the great respect I had for Miss Muir, the infant teacher and Mr Wylie the head of the Junior School in a separate building, and the senior headmaster Mr Hamilton. I also had a great regard for three teachers Mr Moffett who taught maths, Mr Crawford who taught history, and Mr Shapiro who taught English.
CB: How did your brothers treat you?
JP: Well [pause] well, all terribly well. Sandy was the gentlest of them all. [unclear] alright? Bill didn’t like me at first. My mum had an unfortunate failing. She loved the babies and when I turned up he was eight years old and he’d been the apple of her eye for eight years and suddenly there was this little brat and he didn't like me at all to start with.
CB: No.
JP: But we actually, later on became the best of friends.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Much later on.
CB: Yeah.
JP: But at first he was not too happy. I think he started mellowing when he was eighteen and became part of the brother’s crew and I became the coxswain.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I was ten at the time.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And he started mellowing then.
CB: Right [laughs] Yes.
JP: But prior to that and actually funnily enough my [pause] Bill and his wife and Ursula, my wife were, the two wives were great pals and we would warn each of them. My mother, when my mother visited us, my home all she ever did was, to them was to talk about our kids. And when she came here all she did was to talk about their kids. This was, you know she was fixated on children.
CB: Yeah.
JP: She was lovely. Yeah. But that's by the way. Anyway. Now the next bit is going to be getting into the Air Force. Is that alright?
CB: Yeah.
JP: Yeah.
CB: Why did you choose the RAF and not the Army or the Navy? You’re going to cover that?
JP: That's in there.
CB: Yeah. Okay. Fire away.
JP: Yeah. You’ve got it in there.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Right. When the war came along in 1930 I was seventeen. I tried to join up and was told to come back when I was eighteen. From an early age I’d always wanted to fly. Probably from reading so many stories of World War One pilots. Instead of going back to school I got a job at Rolls Royce where I thought learning about aircraft engines might be helpful to a pilot. On my eighteenth birthday in 1940 I was accepted for the RAF at the Recruiting Centre. There were many delays before I was, I had had an aircrew medical in Edinburgh and it was the 28th of March 1941 when I was sworn in as a member of the RAF VR. The RAF Voluntary Reserves. I was ordered to report to London Aircrew Reception Centre on the 3rd of June 1941 and I’d be nineteen the following year. On the train to London I met Alec McGarvey and Johnny Thompson who were ex-policemen. Police had been a Reserved Occupation aged twenty four, twenty five, and over and permission being given that between twenty five and thirty could volunteer for aircrew. The number of ex-police I met at my time of entry convinced me that every policeman in the entire country had volunteered. At St John’s Wood the RAF had taken over hotels and blocks of flats. We were given uniforms and our civilian clothes posted home. We had to march, ate our meals at London Zoo restaurant and were vaccinated and had three injections. I need a pause. Can you —
[recording paused]
JP: Was six weeks in Newquay, Cornwall. In my Flight of sixty forty were ex-policemen. We had drill, PT, rugger, shotguns, skeet shooting and rifle. Lectures in meteorology, Morse Code, aerodynamics aircraft recognition and navigation. This last required maths. The school boys like me helped our ex-police for as one said, ‘You didnae need much maths in the polis.’ From ITW my Flight went to Canada on the Highland Princess. In Toronto we were issued with civilian clothes and went by train into the USA. My memory is that it took the best part of three days to reach Montgomery, Alabama passing no major city or town but six hundred civilians arrived at Maxwell Field near Montgomery. General Hap Arnold commanded the South East Army Air Corps. We were the sixth [pause] no, I beg your pardon we were the fifth [pause] Right. Ok. We were the fifth six hundred to enter the Arnold Scheme. RAF men were also being trained as pilots in Texas at civilian flying schools. Observers as navigators were then called were also being trained and Navy airmen by the US Navy. It has always been a matter of great regret to me that so little has been known to the British public of the invaluable aid when most needed despite the US Neutrality Act. In three weeks we learned American Army drill and customs though we also had an RAF liaison officer wherever we went. I was in the cinema in Americas Georgia on the 7th of December 1941 when the film was stopped. The manager announced that Pearl Harbour had been attacked by the Japanese. They played the US National Anthem. Then the film began again. The next morning we were told we were now allies and would wear RAF uniforms at all times. For basic training we went to Cochran Field, an Army Air Corps base manned by Air Corps ground staff and officer flying instructors. The Vultee was an old monoplane with a fixed undercarriage and a standard instrument panel suitable for night flying. I was in trouble from the start as the controls were heavy and my instructor was no GM Austin. He’d been my instructor previously. He was a brilliant man. With a change of instructor I did well again and the aerobatics with a more powerful engine were as much fun as in the Stearman. We had to fly at night and instrument flying under a hood in the air was also practised on the link trainer. A primitive forerunner of a more modern actual ground cockpits. For advanced training we went to another Air Corps base. Napier Field near Dothan, Alabama. We flew an 86A which the RAF named the Harvard. Again, I was in trouble for not only was it light on the controls but on the approach to landing I let the speed fall dangerously low near to stalling. A stall so near the ground could have resulted in a crash which could have killed both pupil and instructor. I checked [unclear] with three other senior instructors and failed each one for the same fault. I was sent back to Canada with some other washouts. At a Personnel Despatch Centre at Trenton, Ontario, I was interviewed by a flight lieutenant who asked why I had been washed out. I said I’d failed to adjust to the flight controls after the heavy Vultee and I thought it would have been better to go straight to the Harvard from the Stearman. He said an RAF team had been sent to the USA to investigate the large number of washouts that advanced and this was just what they had recommended and he would recommend that I should return to pilot training. So I was sent back to flying but on twin engine aircraft. That flight lieutenant even apologised for realised that like most I wanted to be a fighter pilot. Years later after the war I went to the RAF Central Flying School to become a flight instructor. In a Harvard the first thing my instructor said, ‘Always rest your hand lightly on the trim control to ensure your pupil uses it correctly for it’s very sensitive. And suddenly I remembered in the Vultee on the approach to landing the trim control was wound right back. This I’d done in the Harvard at advanced and this was the real reason of the dangerous fall in speed as the nose eased up on each approach to landing. I wonder how many others had fallen into the same trap.
CB: Yeah.
JP: At the nearby airfield [pause] Hang on. I missed a bit. Something has gone wrong here.
CB: Ok. We’ll just stop a mo.
[recording paused]
CB: Right.
JP: I was then sent to [pause] number 35 SFTS, North Battleford, Saskatchewan which is a long way north. Near there was a nearby airfield. We flew the Airspeed Oxford which was a low wing twin engine aircraft with a single fin and rudder. My instructor, Pilot Officer Henry Shackleton soon to be a flying officer was another excellent instructor. Quiet, patient and with a pleasant friendly manner which put one at ease. The Oxford, for me had no vices. Indeed, at one point Shackleton asked if I would mind if he recommended me to be a flying instructor. In the mood of the time and being young and stupid I said I wanted to go on operations. On the 25th of September 1942 we were awarded our coveted wings and promoted to sergeant. Out of over sixty only six were commissioned. Our next step was at the PDC at Moncton, New Brunswick. We were to return on the Queen Mary but on the 2nd of October 1942 she was , she hit and sunk a cruiser which had tried to pass in front of her. We came home on the Queen Elizabeth. Back in England we were billeted at the Grand Hotel in Harrogate for a month. Not then so grand and we were back to rationing. RAF Shawbury, Shropshire near Shrewsbury was the first English airfield I flew from on the 15th of January 1943. It was to be the last airfield I served at on retirement on the 19th of July 1971. It has a special place in my memories for it was always a happy station blessed with very good station commanders. Right.
CB: Yeah. Yeah.
JP: We were very popular in America with the civilian population. Despite our civilian clothes they knew exactly who we were and of course when we went into uniform it was even better. And they would collect outside and take us away for the weekend and it’s strange how most of them had nice pretty daughters who also seemed to like us. Will that do?
CB: Just right.
JP: With a minute. Hold on a minute.
CB: Yeah.
[recording paused]
CB: So, you're in the Deep South really.
JP: Yeah.
CB: The American bit. So, what’s the reaction from a race point of view?
JP: Well, yeah. What I was going to say was the story I've got in here. The negro waiter in the mess.
CB: Oh, yes.
JP: Would you like that one?
CB: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
JP: Ok. While we were at America’s Georgia in the mess we had negro waiters. One day I was writing a letter. Everyone had gone and in a little compartment I was writing this letter but one of the waiters [pause] are you ready?
CB: Yes.
JP: One of the waiters came in and in a cultured voice asked, ‘Would you care for a coffee, sir?’ I was startled by his tone and choice of words, so different from the usual mess hall language and subservient attitude of the negro waiters. I said I would like a coffee and as he poured I commented on his educated tone and language and asked what he was doing here as a waiter. He said he was a graduate of a negro university and taught school for the local negro children in the evenings. He reminded me most courteously we were in the Deep South and the only jobs for negros were menial. He needed this job to support him while he taught. The white mess hall waiter overseer as you saw it, the white mess hall overseer was standing at the other end of the mess hall. I warned the waiter not to look around but to leave bowing low as he went. I gathered up my letter, drank the coffee and left. As I neared the overseer he asked in a hectoring tone what, ‘That nigger and I had been talking about.’ I told him I’d sent him for coffee and when he brought it I thanked him as was the British custom when someone did us a service. Is that what you were after?
CB: Yeah. Very —
[recording paused]
JP: Another incident.
CB: Yeah. Fire away.
JP: We accepted an invitation to church services for afterwards we would certainly be invited to a meal which was a way to meet nice girls. Some were the most courteous and hospitable people to us. The church service on Armistice Day we were quite horrified when they read out the names of those who were killed in the last, in the First World War and when they came to a negro name they always put coloured after his name and we thought that was quite dreadful.
CB: Yeah.
JP: That one. [pause]
[recording paused]
JP: Back in the UK I first went to RAF Shawbury. We flew the Airspeed Oxford while they checked our competence as pilots and we were allowed to fly over blacked out Britain. Once again, I was asked if I would like to be recommended to be a flying instructor and again turned it down. For Oxford’s training we first went to nearby RAF Tilstock Heath, still in Shropshire. There we crewed up. This was a strange experience. In a large hangar were assembled pilots, navigators, bomb aimers, wireless operators and gunners. The officer in charge said, ‘There you are gentlemen. Get on with it.’ And left. Everyone looked as stunned as I felt. How did one start? Thinking I might try and get a Scottish crew I walked over to a nearby group of bomb aimers and asked if any were Scots. Sergeant Campbell said he was from Glasgow and he knew a navigator from there. He fetched over Sergeant Jimmy Graham another Glaswegian. With him was a red-haired gunner who Jimmy introduced as Sergeant Red Dries, an American from New York who was in the RCAF saying that they wanted to be in the same crew. I was delighted and all I needed was a wireless operator. A little chap nearby said he was from Grimsby but would he do? I liked the look of Sergeant [Carnes] and said yes. I never knew their ages until long after the war. A kind lady at the Air Historical Branch gave me their, gave me these. Jimmy Graham was twenty eight. Bob [Carnes] was twenty three. Bob Campbell was twenty two. And much later from relatives I learned that Red was actually twenty nine. Dicky Fathers was twenty one. He was our flight engineer who joined us later at Heavy Conversion. We were sent to RAF Sleap, a satellite airfield a few miles from Tilstock Heath where we flew the Whitley, a bomber powered by two Rolls Royce Merlins. When we practised single engine landings I thought the Whitley had difficulty holding height on one engine. Returning to Sleap from a night cross country exercise we lost power on one engine and started to lose height. We were approaching the Pennines and with high ground to come, a black night and the possibility of altimeter error I told the crew to stand by to bale out if we fell below three thousand feet. Fortunately, we held height just above three thousand feet and made it safely back to base. That was when I found out that Bob Carne was terrified of having to bale out. It didn’t stop him flying. Now, that is courage. Navigator Jimmy, bomb aimer Bob and I were each assessed as above the average and were asked if we would volunteer for the Pathfinder Force. All the crew agreed for it was an elite force even though we had to agree for a first tour of forty five operations. We went next to Heavy Conversion Unit at RAF Blyton. There we were joined by our flight engineer Richard Dicky Fathers who fitted in well with the crew. I flew a Halifax first and then a Lancaster. In this, my diary there is an entry, “The Lancaster is really fine. Much lighter on the controls than the Whitley and the Halifax. The finest plane I’ve ever flown.” On the 26th of July 1943 I was promoted to flight, acting flight sergeant and we left for the Pathfinder Navigation Training Unit at RAF Upwood. There we flew three exercises with a staff instructor aboard. I still remember one when we flew north above the Irish Sea between the Western Isles, around the top of Scotland and down over central Scotland and the Pennines. At ten thousand feet on a clear summer day it was the most pleasant flight I’d ever made. We passed inspection and were posted to 97 PFS Squadron at RAF Bourn in Cambridgeshire.
CB: Right. We’ll stop there for a mo.
[recording paused]
JP: It was, right here we go then. It was customary to send a newly arrived pilot on two operations with an experienced crew as a second pilot. There was no dual control in a Lancaster. The flight engineer sat beside the pilot and the so-called second pilot stood behind him listening to the crew and observing what he could. My first second pilot was Pilot Officer Ken Fairlie, Royal New Zealand Air Force. On the 14th 15th of August Milan was a twelve hundred miles and took seven hours and forty five minutes and I was standing all the way. I was impressed with the crew’s intercom discipline. No chatter. All related to the task. The Alps were awesome in the moonlight. We bombed at eleven thousand feet and the flak seemed light and below us and the long journey home I was even bored. I was soon to find out that a boring flight was most unusual. For the next second pilot I went again with Ken Fairlie. This time to Leverkusen. Five hundred miles in to Germany. We bombed at thirteen thousand feet with both light and heavy flak shell bursts which I thought rather dodgy. We saw lots of flak enroute and I realised the navigator was doing a fine job keeping us clear of turns. The next op was to Berlin. They thought it unfair to send a crew on its first op to the big city so I went with Squadron Leader Savage. The flak barrage was very heavy and we were very conscious of the danger of fighters. I was to learn that flak was very heavy over all German towns with [unclear] getting heavier. One crew failed to return from that Milan, from that raid and five of the Leverkusen, the fifty six were from Berlin and we were distressed to learn that Ken Fairlie and his crew had failed to return from the Berlin operation. In August my crew and I flew three operations. Nuremberg, Munchen Gladbach and Berlin. On every op we flew we also arrived at ETA, Estimated Time of Arrival. This meant we bombed on time and our camera proved bombed on the aiming point the red and green target flares dropped by the leading Pathfinders. We always carried a cookie, a four thousand pound blast bomb, an assortment of a thousand and eight hundred and five hundred HE. High Explosives. Bombs. Some crews carried incendiaries. Circling base on the first return awaiting our turn to land my eyes were sore and blinking. The elsan too was at the rear and not available to a pilot. I solved the eye problem by alerting the crew over the sea, setting George the automatic pilot and closing my eyes for five minutes. It worked and at base my eyes were clear. The ground crew solved the elsan problem by fitting a large funnel to my seat leading to a tube fixed to the fuselage though extracting the necessary member from layers of flying clothing was not easy. A hundred and ninety five crews failed to return from those three raids and one was from our 97 Squadron. It now seems strange to recall that we could ignore the reports of the overall losses but one of our own cast a sharp gloom yet we really did not know any of the other crews. We were sufficient unto ourselves. In September 1943 we flew four operations and a routine air test which turned out to be very dicey. On the third, sorry on the third fourth, we always say third fourth because you took off in one day and landed in the next.
CB: Yeah.
JP: We went again to Berlin. The flak barrage seemed even more concentrated and we thought even more searchlights. Once again we arrived on time and bombed on the markers. This time we routed home north over the Baltic until latitude 58, level with the north of Scotland and south to base. It took longer but few fighters were reported and the twenty who failed to return were half the losses on previous Berlin raids. On the 3rd, 5th we were again on our way when less than an hour out we had a fire in the port outer engine and a runaway prop. We turned back and jettisoned the bombs in the North Sea. The [drag] created by the runway prop gave a very aching left leg by the time we got home. This is known as a boomerang and does not count as an op. I was rather pleased when I went to see the engineering officer and he congratulated me on landing safely with a runaway prop. On the 9th of September the squadron crews were at briefing but I was not on the list for that night and we were flying an air test. On return to base the windscreen was horizontal and the strong wind at right angles to the runway. Fair request to change the runway with refused and ordered the crew to crash positions before making the approach grabbing and rounding out at the last moment didn't prevent sideways movement and the starboard tyre burst causing the undercarriage to collapse. The undercarriage leg protruded through the right wing and the plane with a right off. Possibly the best approach for landing ever made it was seen by a Group Captain having just come out of briefing. When the duty controller admitted he had refused to change the runway the Group Captain relieved him of his duty and ordered him to leave the station that day. Is that one alright?
[recording paused]
CB: Right. We're re-starting now. September the 15th.
JP: Yes. On September the 15th we were briefed to bomb a rubber factory at Montlucon in France. We were cautioned to be very accurate and there were only four flak guns. What was expected to be a nice safe cooperation turned out to be quite hairy. We were to bomb at four thousand feet but others from six thousand and eight thousand. Some of us might have must have got the timing wrong as on our approach to the target we saw bombs falling all around us. One aircraft was directly overhead. Indeed, some aircraft were hit by incendiaries. The factory was completely destroyed. The next day we went to bomb the Modane Tunnel in an alpine valley. The tunnel was a main route for returning military to France. The Alps seemed to loom alongside as we bombed at thirteen thousand feet. This time the long flight didn’t bore me. I was piloting, not standing. In October a mid-upper gunner Flight Sergeant Morgan joined us for his second tour. On the 2nd 4th and 5th we bombed Munich, Frankfurt and Stuttgart. Always on time and on the PFF flares confirmed by our camera. For us the raids were uneventful apart from the usual hairy time over the targets for the flak was heavy at all three. Losses were fairly light. Seven, ten and four but one was a 97 Squadron PFF crew. We set out to bomb Hanover on the 5th but this was another boomerang for there was an oxygen failure in the mid-upper turret so we turned around and jettisoned our bombs in the North Sea. Briefed again for Hanover on the 18th we bombed successfully. Of the thousand Lancasters seventeen were lost one of whom again was from 97 Squadron. The next target was Kassel but we were briefed to draw off fighters by a spoof target on Frankfurt. There we just entered the camera run when we were caught by a blue master beam and immediately coned by all the slave searchlights. I escaped by doing a stall turn. That’s to pull up the stick up in to a stall and kick full rudder. We dived sideways. The beam went ahead. The coned plane is usually shot down by slave guns. Routed past Kassel we saw a solid oval fire. For the first time I felt rather sorry for the folk below. I regret even more our spoof had failed for forty two were lost mainly to fighters. November 1943 again it was supposed to become a PFF crew, a PFF crew with after only eleven operations. Jimmy’s faultless navigation ensured we arrived over target on ETA and Bob’s accurate bombing was confirmed by our camera. From now on we would carry back-up green TIs as well as the cookies and high explosives. Dusseldorf.
[recording paused]
CB: Right. Target indicator.
JP: The red —
Other: I thought that was what you were talking about.
CB: Keep going. Can you do that now because —
JP: Yes. Yes. Ok.
CB: So as Pathfinder then you are marking the target.
JP: Yeah. Well, what happened —
CB: So how are you doing that with, with coloured flares?
JP: I’ve just done that bit we’d become Pathfinders hadn’t we?
CB: Yeah.
JP: Right. If we can cut in there where I’ve talked about being, becoming markers. Alright?
CB: Yes. Yeah.
JP: So I’ll explain that now. Ok. Right. The system was that the most experienced pilots dropped red, a red flare. They were the initial marking the target and this was backed up by the newer PFF crews like us.
CB: Yeah.
JP: With green flares. And the wind some would cause them to drift back so they would re-centre with a further red and then that would be backed up by further greens. Is that ok?
CB: Yeah.
JP: Is that?
CB: Yeah. Yeah. That’s good.
JP: Have we got —
CB: Yeah. So, we’ve got that.
JP: You’ve got that. Some other colours were used but not in my experience. Anyway, that’s ok. So we, we were back up. We were properly PFF crew as it were.
CB: Yeah.
JP: So, Dusseldorf on the 3rd 4th of November the flak seemed heavier and concentrated around the aiming point but Bob put our greens on the reds. Of five hundred and twenty five heavies eighteen were lost. We then went to Mannheim, Ludwigshafen on the 17th. These were twin towns separated by the Rhine. Eighty three Pathfinder aircraft took part guided by a new navigator aid which only navigators and bomb aimers were trained. Need to know. They didn’t tell the pilots. The raid was successful and only one was lost. On the 18th 19th we went to Berlin. The oxygen connection to the mid-upper turret was again broken. We were well on our way and turning back risked a head on collision for there were some six hundred aircraft behind us still coming. I ordered the gunner to the astrodome where he could at least keep a look out for fighters. On the bombing run I concentrated on my instrument panel ignoring the flak but I still remember Bob’s cool calm voice while looking through the flak shell bursts as he guided me to target. On the 23rd, 22nd, 23rd the Berlin as usual was dicey but Command reported bad weather and grounded German fighters and only twenty five were lost. Aircrew were of this acceptance of losses. The nickname Butch was in the black humour of the time for Harris was held in high regard and they were proud to be the Butcher’s men. Six hundred and fifteen aircraft took part. Two FTR were lost from 97 Squadron.
CB: So, as Pathfinders —
JP: Why I mentioned, why I mentioned them then was —
CB: Yes.
JP: When you came back you were conscious of an empty table at breakfast.
CB: Of course.
JP: Because crews ate as crews. You didn't mix with the other crews. There was one crew we did but I didn't put that in. Mainly because the pilot was from Canada and knew my aunt in Canada.
CB: Right.
JP: And we became friendly.
CB: Yeah.
JP: His crew and ours. But normally we didn't mix but I think because you know the empty table.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Put a bit of a gloom on you.
CB: Yes.
JP: But you ignored the others. What was happening elsewhere. It was our own squadron that mattered based, well as far as I was concerned anyway. Where have we got to? Oh, this bit about the acceptances of Butch. We’ve done that bit haven’t we?
CB: Ok.
JP: That was the 18th 19th.
[recording paused]
JP: Where would we put it?
CB: Well, just now because you mentioned a bit earlier that you got a new mid-upper gunner.
JP: Yeah.
CB: So what happened there? What about the first one?
JP: Well [Beattie] was the first one you see.
CB: Right.
JP: He was the first one we got.
CB: A pilot officer.
JP: A pilot officer.
CB: Right.
JP: And then the next day the group captain ordered him off the station because he had, wouldn’t buy a new, he wouldn’t get have a new he could have been given one but he was going to fly in that one.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And he insisted he was going to fly in that one and the group captain ordered him off the station.
CB: So, the origin of this was that —
JP: So, that was the origin of that.
CB: Yeah.
JP: So I then got another pilot officer.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Pro tem.
CB: Right.
JP: A mid-upper rather and I had a couple of I can’t remember I had the warrant for a couple of ops and then another for a couple of ops, you know.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Something different and then this chap arrived on his second tour.
CB: Right.
JP: And as he was a second tour man they thought they’d give him to us.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Which we were rather pleased about.
CB: Yeah.
JP: He wasn’t a bit pleased.
CB: Oh.
JP: No. He wasn’t a bit pleased.
CB: Why didn’t he like it? He didn’t like your crew?
JP: He’d done a tour in the Middle East.
CB: Oh.
JP: And he came back and he only had to do a couple of tours over, trips over Germany and he was experienced enough to know just how bloody dangerous it was.
CB: Oh.
JP: And I think he didn’t, that’s this is nothing. That’s not going on there but I reckon he disconnected his oxygen. He put his feet through it.
CB: Oh.
JP: And that’s why twice, the first time we came back but the second time we were on our way to Berlin and we were halfway, nearly halfway there and all these other, I wasn’t going to turn back against that lot.
CB: No.
JP: So, I went. I carried on without the mid-upper gunner put in the turret.
CB: Yeah. What, just going back to Bates though.
JP: Sorry.
CB: The earlier one. Bates. What, the –
JP: Oh Batey.
CB: Batey. So he was outside the aircraft you said and the group captain —
JP: We were sitting as we did.
CB: What happened?
JP: We had all gone out the aircraft.
CB: Right.
JP: And we were sitting around waiting to get on board you know because it was all timed when the group captain came around, saw his, I must admit it was a wreck. I mean there were no sleeves. it was a wreck of a whatsit but it was his lucky battle dress, you know.
CB: Right.
JP: He’d done his ops on it you see.
CB: He’d already done a tour.
JP: He wasn’t going to not, he was going to keep on wearing it because it was his lucky battledress.
CB: Yes.
JP: People were funny that way.
CB: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
JP: I mean some chaps used to carry a little, I know one chap had a little —
Other: Talisman.
JP: A talisman he put at the side of the window, you know. It was a funny old time.
Other: Well, it was dangerous wasn’t it?
JP: Yeah. It was a funny old time.
CB: Yeah.
JP: But that’s why I had —
CB: So the group captain, what did the group captain say to him?
JP: He said, ‘Just, get a new battledress.’ You know. Get a proper, you know, battledress. And Batey, he should have said, ‘Very good, sir,’ and just gone on wearing it, you see. But he said, ‘No, sir. I can’t do that. I can get a new one but I’ll wear this one for my ops. It’s my lucky battledress.’ He said, ‘No. You’ll wear a new one.’ And when he refused the next day he ordered him off the station.
CB: Oh.
JP: And incidentally only just recently I found he had completed a tour with another squadron, gone out to Australia. It was Australian not New Zealand and he’d only, he died about oh a couple of years back.
CB: Oh right.
JP: Before I could get in touch with him. I didn’t find out until he’d actually died which was very annoying.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I would have loved to have met with him.
CB: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
JP: But he completed his tour of ops and I bet he wore that bloody battledress.
CB: How, how what was the cohesion of the crew like?
JP: What was the —?
CB: Was there good cohesion in your crew?
JP: Brilliant. Oh, the crew were wonderful. My crew were wonderful. I come to a bit where I —
CB: Ok.
JP: I praise my crew. With the exception I must admit of the new mid-upper.
CB: Yeah.
JP: He never, he never became a member of that crew. He flew as the mid-upper gunner but he never associated. Basically, he kept himself to himself and none of my crew or myself were able to get through to him at all.
CB: Not even on social.
JP: Yeah. He was totally unsocial.
CB: Oh right.
JP: And I think, I think frankly he was intelligent, a very intelligent chap and he knew just how dangerous it was and rather objected to it. He’d rather, in fact, he’d rather, he shouldn’t have been posted to a Pathfinder crew.
JP: No.
CB: He’d have been better off in an ordinary crew.
CB: Right.
JP: That was that one.
CB: Ok.
JP: Anyways, that’s not going on there.
CB: Let’s go on to that.
JP: Now where did we get to? The third. So, we’ve only done that bit.
CB: Right.
JP: Right. Well, we know we are now. Ok. Here we go. On the 3rd 4th we went to Dusseldorf. The 3rd and 4th November. The flak seemed heavier and concentrated around the aiming point but Bob put our greens on the reds. Of five hundred and twenty five heavies eighteen failed to return.
[recording paused]
JP: Towns. We’d done that.
CB: You have. Yes.
JP: We’ve done the twin towns. We’ll jump a bit. Did we do the oxygen connection for Berlin being broken. Did we do that one?
Other: No.
CB: Oh.
JP: Right. On the 18th 19th we were briefed for Berlin. The oxygen connection to the mid-upper turret was again broken. We were well on our way and turning back risked a head on collision. There were some six hundred aircraft behind us. I ordered the gunner to the astrodome where he could at least keep an eye. Look out for fighters. On the bombing run I concentrated on my instrument panel ignoring the flak but I still remember Bob’s cool calm voice while looking through the flak shell burst as he guided me to the target. On the 23rd , 22nd 23rd Berlin as usual was dicey but the Command reported bad weather grounded German fighters. Only twenty five aircraft were lost. Aircrew were aware of this acceptance, oh we’ve done this. The nickname Butch was in the black humour of the time for Harris was held in high regard and we were proud to be the Butcher’s men. Six hundred and fifteen aircraft took part. Two FTR were from 97 Squadron. On the 23rd 24th of November we want to get into Berlin. Stop. I just want to —
[recording paused]
CB: Ok.
JP: We've done [pause] on the 23rd 24th of November it was again Berlin. This one was to be different and at ninety, I remember as if, oh [pause] perhaps you should say ninety five. At ninety five I remember as if it were yesterday. On approach to the aiming point Bob would say, ‘Two minutes skipper.’ I'd reply, ‘You have control.’ He directs, ‘Port a bit. Steady. Steady.’ As he was about to release the bomb his voice would rise to a crescendo, ‘Steady. Steady. Steady.’ This time he said, ‘They’ve re-centred skipper. It will be another two minutes.’ This time as his voice reached its peak a shell exploded in our bomb bay. A TI exploded and we were surrounded by Greek fire, green fire. All our regs were fused and I’d no intercom to order bale out. Dicky was down by Bob throwing out Window, the metallic strips for deceiving radar and he could see me. I released my seat straps, bent forward and waved to him pointing to his parachute which was behind my seat. I knew the cookie would explode but I’d full control and hoped someone might get out. I counted eighteen seconds and Dicky hadn’t reached his ‘chute. Then I was sitting in mid-air thinking, ‘Where's my bloody plane gone?’ A delayed drop would get me clear of flack but over the aiming point and with some two hundred aircraft still to come I pulled my rip cord to let the wind drift me clear of the bombing. Hanging from my parachute I’d only myself to think about. I remember that a shell exploded nearby could [candle] the ‘chute and make it fold up and I’d drop like a stone. Courage is a strange thing. I had accepted I would die with the thought that my mum would be distressed but hoping some of my crew might get out. Now, with only myself to think about I’d never been so terrified.
[recording paused]
JP: All my crew died. The impressive skills of navigator Jimmy Graham and Bob Campbell were the main reason we were so successful with the Pathfinders. Always on time and always on target. Robert Bob Cowan our wireless op quietly passed information on radio positions fixes and wind speeds and direction by notes to the navigator. Richard Fathers, our flight engineer was always alert and helpful. When the mid-upper turret oxygen was twice broken he went back using a portable oxygen bottle and was most upset when he was unable to repair the damage. Although our gunners never came into action we had faith in their ability. Red was very much a part of our crew and very popular from when we first came together. The US Air Force tried to recruit Americans serving with RCAF or RAF but Red refused to leave his crew saying he might think about it when our tour was completed. Seventy years later I can see them and hear their voices. Sergeant Mortham had completed a tour in North Africa. He made no attempt to mix with the crew. I thought he didn’t really want to do the second tour. That’s it.
[recording paused]
JP: Right. I mean, after the war when I crewed up again later on by that time I’d been, just been commissioned and I never had this, could never get the same rapport with my crew as I did during the war where we all, we would even sleep together. I mean Jimmy, they were in a one four bedroom house and a two bedrooms and Dicky shared the two bedroom with me. We were, you know, we ate together, we went out together. You know, we did everything together.
CB: Well, you were the family, weren’t you?
JP: We were very very close in that short time. It’s difficult to describe. Any ex-serviceman who has been in action can tell you the same thing. You become close to the people you serve with when you’ve been shot at.
CB: Yes.
JP: When you’re shooting back. The Army is the same thing. Any Army chap you are, they are the ones you are close to.
CB: Yeah.
JP: The ones you are concerned with.
CB: But as the years went by and the months after the war and then the years went by how did you feel about the loss of the crew?
JP: I can’t describe it. It’s just it’s there. It’s always with me that I couldn’t save them. I couldn’t do anything. I mean, what happened was out of my control and the fact I was blown out was a, was a sheer fluke.
CB: Yeah.
JP: As one wag said after the war to me, ‘You invented the ejector seat.’ And of course, I was sitting on a, I was sitting at the pilot’s seat.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I haven’t put in here that the group captain said they were going to give us cushions because it was uncomfortable sitting on the ‘chute. I said, ‘I don’t want a cushion.’ I explained why. It would mean that the, if I had a clip on tie my and that flight engineer would have had to come back, clip it on me, then clip his on and in the meantime he was blocking the others getting past him to get out. And I said, ‘You know, this is not on.’
CB: No.
JP: ‘You’re going to block the crew getting out.’ And we’d have to, probably have to get out in a hurry you see.
CB: You got used to sitting on a parachute did you?
JP: Oh, it never bothered me anyway.
CB: No.
JP: No, it never bothered me but it wasn’t that. It was the fact that the idea of having to have a thing that would waste time.
CB: Yes.
JP: Of the crew getting out.
CB: Sure.
JP: Which was why I objected. And so he let me carry on wearing. If I hadn’t been wearing, I could have been sitting on a bloody cushion that night.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Fortunately, I wasn’t.
CB: Yes.
JP: But there we are.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Now, where did I get to oh just started —
Other: You’d just blown out of the aircraft.
JP: I’d just been blown out. Yes.
CB: So, you’re falling down with your ‘chute which you’ve opened to drift away from the stream.
JP: Yeah. Yeah. We’ve done that bit
CB: So what happened next?
JP: We’ve done a tour hadn’t we?
Other: Did all that come automatically?
JP: What’s that?
Other: I mean you were, you woke, you woke up in mid-air.
JP: In mid-air I was still virtually in a sitting position. Literally. And said, ‘Where’s my bloody aeroplane gone?’ I knew where it had gone actually but that was the thought.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And then as I say immediately unfortunately remembered that it was a shell burst near me which pulled up my parachute. But before I thought of that I think I thought about it after it was open but sitting there I thought, it’s amazing how your mind works quickly at the time. I was twenty one and I was sharp, shall we say then and I had two choices. To do a delayed drop through the flak or pull the ‘chute straight away to drift me clear because I knew the wind would drift me clear and I was right. Remember I was right smack over the aiming point when we were hit by flak. I knew what was still to come so that’s why I pulled the ‘chute straight away and I did in fact. I was I’m coming to that bit I was blown —
CB: You knew what the wind was anyway.
JP: I drifted clear of the flak.
CB: Yeah. But what height were you?
JP: Twenty thousand feet.
CB: Right.
JP: At the time. Yeah. But —
CB: So you were a bit short of air at that height.
JP: Hmmn?
CB: A bit short of air at that height.
JP: I don’t even notice it. Don’t forget I was [pause] you know, I wasn’t, didn’t, I didn’t notice being short of air at all strangely enough. I was probably above twenty thousand. I went upwards I think. Well, I know I did.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I know from my injuries what, what happened. I worked it all out afterwards.
CB: Yes.
JP: Sitting in a German cell that night.
CB: Yeah. So you were dropping on your parachute. Then what?
JP: Well, no. I’m on my parachute now. Right.
CB: Right.
JP: And we ought, and I’ve mentioned my crew.
CB: Yes.
JP: Right.
CB: Yes.
JP: Ok. Here we go. I landed in a suburban back garden well away from the bombing. The top of my head had been cut open. Later I concluded the steel panel on the pilot’s seat which was about there had first broken the Perspex but left enough to split my helmet. This must have been torn off my head when the side panel blew out. I was attached to that side panel with the intercom cord and the oxygen tube and my neck could have been broken. Instead, it was just very painful. I must have hit my legs on the wheel on the way past because my left leg was bruised black but the right leg was unharmed because I had a metal cigarette case in the front pocket which was bent in half [pause] That’s it.
CB: Keep going.
CB: That was really, I didn’t bother putting this in. I worked all, all that out that night in a police cell.
CB: Oh right. Yeah.
JP: It was pretty obvious what had happened and this was I was covered in blood because a head wounds bleed terribly.
CB: Yes.
JP: And on the way down the smoke covered in the sense that I must look as though I was badly burned when, when they saw me.
CB: Right.
JP: But I know I did because in this civilian house I was taken to by the chap that picked me up there was a mirror and I saw what I [laughs] I was in a terribly state. Anyway, here we go. I was quickly captured and with all too short a time taken by train to Dulug Luft, the Luftwaffe interrogation centre. At the Dulug they had no crew to link me with which confirmed my fear that all my crew had been killed. They thought I was a Mosquito pilot and their interrogation centred around the Mosquito and how much they knew. They kept showing me large folders with information they had on Mosquito squadrons made easy to keep schtum. Just repeat my name, rank and number because I knew sod all about Mosquitoes. I had three investigators one friendly, one neutral and one always threatening to have me shot. In between investigations, interrogations I was in solitary confinement in a small cell. One day my interrogator said, ‘You don’t like the Germans, do you?’ I broke my silence saying, ‘I was taught they were brave men and very clean people. I’ve been here a month and I still have blood in my hair.’ That afternoon a guard took me for a shower. It was a major psychological error for it gave me an enormous boost to have won that concession. A month later a guard took us to the officer’s mess to take tea with my interrogators. I was told I was to be sent to a prisoner of war camp the next day. They told me I had doubled the time spent in solitary confinement without giving anything away. I was puzzled at the time as to why they gave up on me when they did. Many years later I found a rising loss rate in January with three hundred and three POWs arriving from another Berlin bombing simply meant they needed my cell. The final Berlin raid in March cost seventy two aircraft lost with three hundred and seventy killed and a hundred and twenty to be became bombing Berlin was a battle lost. Despite my admiration for Harris I think he should have ended those Berlin attacks much earlier. Preferably before the 23rd 24th of November.
CB: When you were shot down.
JP: Yeah.
Other: Yeah.
JP: February 1944 I arrived at my first prison camp. Stalag Luft 6 which was for RAF and later American airmen, aircrew. Luft 6 was well run by Dixie Deans, the elected camp leader and a legend to all who knew him. With Red Cross parcels [unclear] we later lost at the Dulag on the Prussian border in July 1944 were moved as the Russians advanced. On the 8th of July we were at Stalag 357 at Thorne in Poland. An Army camp. The stalag number was transferred which makes me think that the Thorn camp was completely evacuated. Where the Army POW went I have no idea. On the 8th of August the RAF were sent to Stalag 357 at Fallingbostel in Lower Saxony in North West Germany. Another camp. Conditions deteriorated with the destruction of German transport. We ran out of Red Cross parcels, an essential supplement to the limited German rations. In a bitter winter cold we all lost weight and grew weaker. Now with an allied front we were moved again but not the Army. In groups of a thousand the RAF we were moved aimlessly around. My group from the 17th to the 19th of April 1945. On the 19th we reached a small town. We were issued with a Red Cross parcel each. Moving a few kilometres away we sat under the shade of trees to open our parcels. We were attacked by six Typhoons and a Spitfire. After the war I met one of the Typhoon pilots who confirmed as we had thought at the time they thought we were German troops hiding under the trees. Twenty nine were killed and fifty wounded. The wounded were taken to Bosenberg Hospital near [. I weighed between six and a half and seven stone and had diarrhoea. I couldn’t eat solid food for I had gingivitis, an inflammation of the gums. The British doctor sent with the wounded not fit to walk any further. The German doctor was excellent. Although three more died of their wounds he gave them all full care. He soon had me fitter and able to help with our wounded. On the 3rd of May I was sound asleep when a chap in a red beret woke me up. ‘You’ve been liberated lad.’ ‘About time too,’ I replied and promptly fell asleep again. A few years ago I learned that the chap in the red beret had been Brigadier Hill who commanded the [unclear] liberators. That morning there were tanks outside the hospital and we were taken to the Corps Field Hospital and then flew back to England in Dakotas. There’s that there.
[recording paused]
JP: We were taken to an airfield.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And flown home in a Dakota.
CB: So you came home —
JP: Landed somewhere in southern England.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I’ve no idea where.
CB: You mentioned about a bit earlier that you were taken by truck over the Rhine.
JP: Yeah.
CB: An open truck.
JP: Well from where we were to Fallingbostel, at [pause] oh dear. From hospital, from the German hospital. Have a wee second.
CB: That’s ok.
JP: I forget things.
CB: Yeah. But you were in, you, they put you in a truck you said.
JP: I gave the name of it didn’t I?
CB: Yes. You mentioned it just now.
[pause]
CB: But what about —
JP: I’ve not mentioned it without —
CB: The point about you were in the truck and who else was in the truck?
JP: Oh, it wasn’t a truck. We were in a sort of I don’t know what it was called but it was an open boat type thing.
CB: Oh, yeah. A duck.
JP: Quite large across. We were taken from the hospital, the German hospital.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Boizenburg.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I got the name, didn’t I? Boizenburg. From Boizenburg we were taken and we had to cross the Rhine and to cross the Rhine we had, went on this.
CB: A barge.
JP: This barge thing. It wasn’t a barge. It was a big floating thing. Very large. And there was a squaddie there shivering. He’d been in a tank which had blown up and I took my, I had an RAF issue coat, you know —
CB: Yeah.
JP: What do you call them?
CB: A greatcoat.
JP: Hmmn?
CB: A greatcoat.
JP: A greatcoat.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And I took it off and put it over the poor chap you see.
CB: Because he was —
JP: As a result it was a very windy cold day. I ended up with [pause] whatever it was I ended up with.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Flat on my back.
CB: Right.
JP: But we ended up in this field hospital and I have no idea where that is.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And from the field hospital we were taken to an airfield. I don’t know where that was.
CB: Right.
JP: And we were flown home in Dakotas to southern England. I don’t know where we landed.
CB: No.
JP: But it was in southern England.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I was put in a hospital near there for a couple of days and then I come to the next bit where —
CB: You went back to Shawbury.
JP: We went to Cosford.
CB: Cosford.
JP: RAF Cosford Hospital. Which then was an RAF hospital.
CB: Yeah.
JP: So where have we got to?
CB: Yeah. That’s it.
JP: Hmm? So back and yes so we’ve done that bit about the tank outside. Flown home in the Dakota. Yeah. So, ok, we can go then. So back in England after three weeks in RAF Hospital Cosford I was sent on indefinite leave and had a wonderful reception from my family in Glasgow. I knew I had a niece and found I had another niece and two nephews. All four and another nephew shortly arrived are still a loving part of my life. The RAF finally remembered me and I reported to Number 34 Maintenance Unit on the 6th of October 1945 and was there ‘til September 1947. RAF Montford Bridge was a vital posting for it was near Shrewsbury where I skulled with the Pengwern Boat Club. Thanks to another oarsman in 1940 I met Ursula. We were engaged in 1947 and married in 1948. Also in 1948 I was commissioned on the 2nd of February. Back flying and with a new crew we flew the Wellington at Operational Training. Much to my delight I then flew the Lancaster at Heavy Conversion again. September 1949, I joined Number [unclear], City of Lincoln, Lincoln Squadron Bomber Command at RAF Waddington. We flew the Lincoln. An enlarged version of a Lancaster. It flew higher, faster and further and carried a larger bomb load. For me it was not as manoeuvrable. Ursula joined me there in married quarters with our first born. We left Waddington October 1950 for me to go to the RAF flying, Central Flying School to become a flying instructor. My first posting was to southern Rhodesia and from May 1951 until November 1953 we enjoyed a happy country with perfect weather for flying. For flying training. A task I found rewarding when I sent a pupil solo. Our second son was born and we explored the country including Niagara Falls. Back home I was posted to RAF Ternhill. Again, near Shrewsbury. After a short time I went for a permanent commission medical and failed it as I was high tone deaf. I was quite heartbroken for I had loved flying. I was offered a branch commission in the [unclear] branch. I was thirty seven and loved serving in the RAF so accepted this gratefully. It carried the warning there was limited promotion. This turned to be no promotion and I finally left the RAF still a flight lieutenant on the 19th of July 1971 on my forty ninth birthday. I still have the letter offering me a further five years service but I had already decided to become a teacher. The RAF did not leave me. I’m a member of the RAF did not leave me I'll stop by the member of the RAF, Shrewsbury RAFA and the Shropshire aircrew. This can’t be raised because there are fewer, less of us. I went to Teacher’s College and gained my Teacher's Certificate. From 1972 to 1987 I taught English at Meole Brace Secondary School which became a, became a Comprehensive in 1981. From 1948 to 1983 I studied with the Open University and became a BA Hons. Purely an ego trip to prove to myself I could have done it in Glasgow Uni if the war happened intervened. Despite many separations between postings Ursula and I had enjoyed in many parts of our country, living in many parts of the country and also overseas in Germany. When we came home from Rhodesia with the aid of a mortgage we bought our house in Shrewsbury in 1956 and live here still. Aged ninety five and ninety when asked how we are we always reply, ‘We're still here.’ Anything else is boring. Our three sons and daughter have supplied us with five grandsons and seven granddaughters. Two married grandsons have supplied us with two great granddaughters. Another marriage is due next year and we have hopes for two who have partners. Throughout the year we have visits singly or in batches from some of the above. Every summer we have a clan gathering at our Shrewsbury home. All who can come. They all get along so well together the gatherings are joyful occasions. In 2018 we will celebrate our seventieth anniversary at the clan gathering. I am indeed the Lucky Penny. The title of the memoir I wrote and had printed in 2014.
CB: Brilliant. Really good.
JP: That does it.
CB: Excellent. Thank you.
JP: Is that alright?
[recording paused]
CB: What’s the first question?
Other: Right. So many. I'm getting slow as well I have to say. [pause] Well I thought the bit about the being blown out of the plane I mean it's such a, not unique but I mean nearly unique experience. Is there anything you'd like to say more about that? People would be fascinated I'm sure.
JP: No, it’s —
Other: I mean you treat it as though it’s, well, you were trained.
JP: Yeah.
Other: For it and that’s why I asked you whether [pause] You automatically did the things you’ve been trained for didn’t you? When you were thrown out.
JP: Well, I wasn't trained for being blown out. But I just think the mind works incredibly quickly when something like that happens. I had two options. Do a delayed drop to avoid the flak or, or open the parachute straight away to drift clear of what was still to come.
Other: Yeah.
JP: And that was the best option really.
Other: Yeah.
JP: Because I did as I say land in a suburban garden. Does that not work it out?
CB: It is but I think a supplementary question there is when you landed in the garden what was the reaction of the owner of the house?
JP: When I landed in the garden I fell over because I didn’t do the proper thing. I fell over because one leg was so badly bashed and I just couldn’t, could hardly stand on it.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And I fell over. It’s in my book.
CB: Because of the steering wheel in the aeroplane.
JP: And there was old Nick, horns and all looking at me against the fires of Berlin. And then the goat moved. I remember that bit.
CB: Good.
JP: And then I then I saw somebody. I was lying there. I couldn’t, oh my ‘chute was part over a tree so I couldn’t bury it as you should do and I saw a chap and then he went into a shelter. So I managed to get out but I kept falling over and I managed I think about two lampposts falling over and leaning up at the one post and this enormous German with a tin hat on picked me. He was a civilian, probably what do call them when we have them in this country?
Other: Sort of a Home Guard.
JP: Hmmn?
Other: A Home Guard.
JP: Probably a Home Guard, something like that picked me up, literally picked me up well I’m not very big. He carried me to an air raid shelter. A little like a little [unclear] you know, a little turning point and there was an older, an old lady, a young woman. The young woman looked like she would cut my throat. The old lady looked sorry for me. I remember her saying, ‘So jung.’
CB: So young.
JP: And oh, when we came in he said, ‘Ah, Englisher.’ You know, no, ‘Englander.’ And I said, ‘Nein. Scotsman.’
CB: He’d have been insulted.
JP: That was automatic in those days and then when the war you know when the bombing stopped they took me to their house. That’s where I saw the mirror and that was terrible.
CB: Right.
JP: That’s why they were all so sorry for me.
CB: Yes.
JP: I looked dreadful. I looked worse than I was in other words. And I was staggered to that. I could hardly walk with this leg. Then a couple of squaddies came along. Oh, incidentally just before I hit the deck the searchlight came on near me and let me see the ground and do a proper, you know pull up.
Other: Clear up.
JP: And a couple of squaddies came probably from the battery I should think and took me to a police station. At least I think it was a police station because it was a police cell sort of thing. One of them. I was there the night in the police cell. Then, the next day they took me to an airfield where they collected all the aircrew who had baled out that night and then took a train to the Dulag. And that was quite interesting because there was one chap on the way to the station, well, at the station there was a large, they were on the way in to the station. One chap was on a stretcher and three other blokes and me. By that time I was walking, was carrying this chap on the stretcher and the German, one of the civilian at the station came out at that stage and spat at them and the corporal in charge of us with his sub machine gun hit him right in the gut with it and pointed around with it. I don't know what he said but that crowd backed off. They were all civilians waiting to get out of Berlin and they backed off and he wasn’t having it. He took us into a big canteen through the one to the one at the back, sat down at a table. We put the chap, it was up to us to put this chap’s stretcher down. We sat at the table and I still remember to this day the waitress in German type what the waitress in the German type, what the waitress dress whatever it was came up with a dirty great tankard. One of the enormous tankards of beer and I think the four of us must have sat there like this [pause] probably because he laughed and raised his pint and another tankard to be shared between the four of us. And that was the German frontline troops. And at the Dulag apart from their, you know, their routine —
CB: Yeah.
JP: At the end they gave me this tea party as it were. Took the tea. And Dixie Deans, Dixie Deans incidentally had been shot down early in the war, spoke perfect Germany. He’d worked in Germany and he’d got the very good German senior officer in charge of the place, he’d got him under his thumb. He really, he was brilliant was Dixie Deans.
CB: He was a wing commander, was he?
JP: No. he was, he was, he was an airman. I don’t suppose he, well he would by that time be officially because you started as a sergeant.
CB: Yeah.
JP: You got promoted after a year to flight sergeant. I got promoted before then because I was going on to Pathfinders and then you became. a third year became a warrant officer. So Dixie I think by then would have officially been a warrant officer but as far as he was concerned he didn’t know that. He was still a sergeant.
CB: Oh.
JP: But the NCO aircrew were what’s the, where the officer’s dulag. The officer’s camp was. They were there. The NCO aircrew were there and then they opened this one at Fallingbostel and Dixie was marching. They all were assembled and the group captain who was a prisoner there Dixie had the chaps and gave a, they all marched down, Dixie gave an eyes right and he saluted and the British saluted back and the German in charge of the camp said, ‘They are soldiers.’ And our chaplain said, ‘Of course they are, you fool. They just don’t behave like that to you.’ Or words to that effect.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I was told this by, Dixie had the committee which were known as the Escape Committee but where we were well there were all sorts of stories there. They, you only want what, three feet down you hit water and we did get a tunnel out through the loo. Some brave bloke went in to this hole in the loo and got a hole in the wall above the water lever and got a tunnel out. And we did get a tunnel out there but I think only one chap got out. Fortunately, very fortunately the guard came who was patrolling outside spotted it otherwise it would mean another one. And when we went to the one in Poland it was an Army camp. Now where at [unclear] you double the whatsit and a long single bar there. Step over that you could [unclear] between the fire. When we got to the Army camp there was only that much difference between there and there and the huts we were in were about from here to there from the wire and there were six huts. There were other ones, but the first six huts and I reckon every hut there had a tunnel going out within twenty four hours of getting there. Fortunately, we were moved before we could finish.
CB: Right.
JP: Because it would have been a mass break out and they would have just shot them all.
CB: Yeah.
JP: As they did the officers earlier on.
CB: Yeah.
JP: So really it was just as well. But the ethos of the time you did your damndest to try and get out.
CB: Of course.
JP: But a lot didn’t. Some did. I asked Dixie about escaping. He said, ‘How’s your German?’ I said, ‘Non-existent.’ He said, ‘Well, until you can speak German the Escape Committee won’t help you. Only someone who speaks German has a chance of getting away. Anyone else, no.’ So it was very, one chap did get away and escaped and got picked up by the Russians eventually but he spoke fluent German and he was one that Dixie escaped whatsit. They used to, we had our own secret radio there at [Gutersloh]. So well organised and twice a week a couple of chaps would turn up, ‘BBC news chaps.’ And somebody went on the window and watch for safe and they’d read the BBC news which kept us updated with what was going on. It was terribly well [pause] and that radio. How they did it I’m buggered if I know. Mind you, don’t forget we were aircrew which meant we got a lot of wireless ops and also Dixie had the guards organised. First of all, he would or a [unclear] would be briefed. We were not allowed to just [unclear] and eventually got a guard who had taken some [ had got them to bring in some forbidden things like parts of the radio and that sort of thing. And when they got to them they pointed out that he had to do as he was told or they would be reported which meant the Russian Front you see. So Dixie and both these chaps had this all organised. New kriegies like me just ignored it. I mean we just kept schtum. Need to know basis. We didn’t need to know so we kept quiet but I went to a lot of, I know one, at least one chap who got a degree while he was in prison. He’d been shot down at the beginning of the war. He’d been there four years. Or been a prisoner for four years.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And he got himself organised and he got a degree. So there were chaps who had no interest in escape. They were just interested in surviving. Which was quite understandable. I was interested. Being young and stupid I was interested in escaping. But as I say, Dixie said, ‘No German, you’ve had it.’ Which was probably just as well because I was young and stupid in those days. I mean I turned down being an instructor twice which was a daft thing to do. I often wonder what would have happened if I had. If I’d have taken up in Canada I’d have been an instructor in Canada. Probably. But my instructor in Canada, in Cosford Hospital I met him. He'd come over. He’d done a tour and he’d been shot down. So I met him again. I wish I’d kept in touch.
CB: Small world. Yeah.
JP: I didn’t unfortunately but I was still an NCO, he was still an officer and there was a gap. I found that out when I became an officer. I could never get the rapport with my crew that I had with my crew during the war. It was, and yet it was quite common for sergeant pilots to have officer members of the crew like my first mid-upper. But the skipper was still the skipper.
CB: Yeah.
JP: You were still the boss. That was out of the time.
CB: Just going back to when you landed.
JP: Hmm?
CB: Going back to when you landed by parachute.
JP: Yes.
CB: You said that the young lady was hostile. What happened after you came out of —
JP: Well, they took me to, but they took me to, when the bombing stopped they took me to their house and that was where I saw the mirror.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And I was there, I had a drink of water I think. The big fellow was quite friendly actually.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And the old lady was quite sorry for the young fella. He said, ‘So jung. So jung.’
CB: Yeah.
JP: And we were there for a very short time before the squaddies came to take me to the police station.
CB: But did this young lady also go to the house?
JP: Oh yes. She was the wife.
CB: She was his wife.
JP: She was the wife. Well, I don’t know this for sure.
CB: Right.
JP: But I would say this was a family, local family what we’d have, what would we have had in this country? These little —
CB: Well, the Anderson shelter.
JP: Yeah.
CB: Yeah.
It was like an Anderson shelter.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Very small. I don’t think there were any kids there. I think it was just the two ladies. The old, the old lady and the young lady. I think just the two and as I say the old lady was you know one of the, I remember her saying, ‘So jung.’ And I remember him carrying me in. I saw him in daylight saying, ‘Englander,’ and my immediate reaction was, ‘Nein. Schottelander.’ But —
CB: So was this, had you drifted to the outskirts of Berlin.
JP: Hmmn?
CB: Had you drifted to the outskirts of Berlin?
JP: Oh yes, yes that’s why I was —
CB: So there was no bombing close.
JP: I drifted in to a suburban garden.
CB: Yes.
JP: Basically, which must have been on the outskirts of Berlin.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Well away from the bombing. In fact, when I landed as I say I looked up when I fell over and I landed. I released my parachute. It was over a tree and I saw old Nick with his horns and then as I say the goat moved and that was the sort of, oh Nick.
CB: Yes.
JP: I’m dead.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And then the goat and I saw that head against the fires.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Of the fires of, you know —
CB: Of the city.
JP: Where the bombing was. So I was well away from it.
CB: Yeah.
JP: So pulling the ‘chute was the right thing to do.
CB: It was.
JP: But so that was, that was —
CB: I’ll stop there.
[recording paused]
JP: These years with that —
CB: With the knowledge of the trip.
JP: Terrible regret that I couldn’t save my crew.
CB: Yes.
JP: I tried at the time.
CB: Yes.
JP: I knew I was going to die.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Because I remember thinking mum’s not going to like this or mum’s going to be upset. And the other thought was I wish I’d left a son behind. Which I thought was rather funny. I’d never actually known a woman properly.
CB: Did you —
JP: I’d courted quite a few but I’d never actually —
CB: No.
JP: I was still at that, my generation were.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Or at least a lot of them were. Some of them weren’t of course.
CB: No.
JP: A lot of my generation. I had four big brothers and they told me sod all.
CB: Yes.
Other: Yeah.
JP: Literally, I knew, you know —
CB: Yeah. Nobody enlightened you.
JP: There was no sex education in those days and, oh, I remember my brother Sandy. Only one thing he said, ‘Jim, just remember those that would I wouldn’t and those I would don’t.’ That was my advice from Sandy.
CB: Right.
JP: It took me years to find out those I liked also did [laughs] But that took me a long long time to find out. Fortunately, as I say I met Ursula.
CB: Can I just ask you again on this other topic because on a different interview I have done but did you feel in any way guilty in the fact that you were the sole survivor?
JP: I think that was part of it. I think that was the —
CB: Because you were the captain.
JP: Yes. I think that was definitely part of it. That I was the only survivor and my wonderful crew, and they were a wonderful crew really. They were brilliant. I mean, we were good as a crew. We really, we deserved to be Pathfinders but I think now and I didn’t think even when I wrote the book I hadn’t had that thought I’ve had a lot more I know, in fact I do a talk. It’s over there. I do a talk with one of the squad things on the importance of Bomber Command.
CB: Right.
JP: It started off as a talk in my book.
CB: Yes.
JP: Which I did to a school and it went very well.
CB: I bet.
JP: And then with doing research I learned so much more and I learned just how important Bomber Command was. There were two crucial raids. One was that first raid on Berlin. What happened at the time, I’ve got it in my book, what happened was that a Luftwaffe pilot dropped his bombs on London. I don’t think he was meant to. I think the silly bugger got lost probably but this is, anyway someone bombed Berlin.
CB: Yes.
JP: And Churchill was livid and ordered the RAF to bomb, bomb London rather, the RAF to bomb Berlin.
CB: Yes.
JP: Approximately eighty odd aircraft set out. About twenty nine of them got there.
CB: Yes.
JP: The others couldn’t find it.
CB: Yeah.
JP: But they did bomb it. Hitler was livid and took the Luftwaffe off bombing the airfields and the radar stations to set up the Blitz and set up the Blitz on London.
CB: Yeah.
JP: If he’d not done that we could have lost the Battle of Britain.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Because they could have knocked out all those airfields. The Luftwaffe was very powerful at that time.
CB: Yeah. Yeah.
JP: They could have knocked, you know, it could have cost us the battle of Britain if he hadn’t done that.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And the second one was the thousand bomber raid.
CB: On Cologne.
JP: Because, on Cologne. No. It wasn’t Cologne. It was another one. Was it Cologne?
CB: Cologne. On Cologne. Yeah. The cathedral.
JP: The Luftwaffe immediately realised the significance of that. That we turned Germany in to, the whole of Germany into a battlefield and they had to bring, instead of supporting the troops in the field they had to bring back aircraft, pilots, thousands and thousands of the best anti-tank gun in the war. The German got the, it’s in the book. That that gun was also —
CB: The 88 millimetre.
JP: Hmmn?
CB: The 88 millimetre.
JP: Indeed. That 88 gun was a brilliant gun.
CB: Yes.
JP: I’ve been told.
CB: Yes.
JP: I’ve been told that even by soldiers as well.
CB: Yeah.
JP: Anti-tank. But they had to bring all those back and put them all over Germany as we knew because the bastards every time we bombed a city the flak was horrendous so there was lots of guns there.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And the men to man them. It could be argued but for that the Germans could have put Russia out of the war before our invasion was ready.
CB: Yeah.
JP: So, Bomber Command was vital. Yeah. Apart from the obvious that they bombed and Harris when he got, he put up that he was going to do area bombing and they were [pause] you see at the beginning of the war Bomber Command crews dropped leaflets on Germany.
CB: Yes.
JP: Men were lost dropping bloody leaflets on Germany.
CB: Yeah. Yeah.
JP: And they were also ordered not to bomb with slightest chance of killing a civilian at the beginning. We weren’t ready for war.
CB: Right.
JP: Mentally or otherwise and those early aircraft were bloody, I know, I’ve flown two of them.
CB: Yeah.
JP: They were —
CB: Nightmare.
JP: Hmmn?
CB: Nightmare to fly.
JP: Yeah. They were alright, but they weren’t, compared to the Lancasters you know they weren’t a patch on those. The Lancasters were brilliant. A really wonderful aircraft but as I say we weren’t, we weren’t ready for war and the same people who had us operating are now, I mean I’ve been asked if I wasn’t ashamed of being a bomber pilot. That’s one of the things that set me off on proving how necessary we were. The first was when I was doing my teacher training. A young, one of the other young chaps on the course said, ‘Weren’t you a bomber pilot? Aren’t you ashamed of yourself?’ So I said, ‘Sprechen sie Deutsch?’ And he looked at me. I said, ‘Sprechen sie Deutsch?’ ‘I don’t know what you’re talking about.’ I said, ‘I’m asking if you speak German?’ He said, ‘No.’ I said, ‘Well, you bloody well would if we hadn’t bombed the bastards.’ That was my attitude at the time.
CB: Yes.
JP: I was but not so long ago a teacher, a retired teacher at the prep school here, from the prep school here three of us went to, they have a very nice little service at the, Battle of Britain service privately at the school, the prep school and three of us went to that. One was an ex-Battle of Britain pilot, a pal of mine from [unclear] and one who was, who had been involved with Coastal Command on Mossies but was a bombers still. He was a Coastal Command Mossies. And this chap asked us, you know what we’d been doing and Brian who’s the talker amongst the three of us, Brian said, ‘He was a Battle of Britain pilot.’ ‘Oh wonderful. Oh yes.’ ‘What was yours?’ he said, ‘I was a Coastal Command pilot.’ ‘Oh.’ And Brian said, ‘He was a bomber pilot.’ And his face went. Oh. And I looked at him and I thought you don’t approve of me being a bomber pilot. No. Well, of course, ‘Why did we bomb Dresden? ‘I said, ‘I’ll lend you my book on it. You’ll see why.’
CB: Yeah.
JP: Which I did. It’s up there.
CB: Right.
JP: The book on Dresden and it’s a different story.
CB: Yes.
JP: If you read that.
CB: Yeah.
JP: One of, one of the things that was so important was it was a [pause] what’s the word for it? A nice pleasant place.
CB: Yes. Well, architecturally it was superb.
JP: Yeah. But what people don’t know was that the railway feeding the Russian Front, the German troops to the Russian Front passed through there. So far as I know the Russians asked us to bomb.
CB: They did. Yeah.
JP: The other thing was why did we bomb so near the end of the war. At that time if you’d asked when the war would end they would say imminently, now or ten years, twelve years, twelve months’ time because there was no sign of Hitler giving up. So we didn’t, when I was in, I was in prison camp at the time so I had nothing to do with that but if I’d been flying I would have bombed the place I’d been told to. You just went to where you were told to do.
CB: Well, they’d only just had the Battle of the Bulge.
JP: Yeah. And also, don’t forget —
CB: Yeah.
JP: Is that the Americans also bombed Dresden.
CB: Yeah.
JP: We bombed it at night and the next morning —
CB: The Americans did it.
JP: The Americans bombed it.
CB: Yeah.
JP: But this was where the bad things come in and that same attitude which is Bomber Command was Churchill our hero at the time when he was giving his valedictory speech about the forces after the war carefully avoided any mention of Bomber Command. And there was no Bomber Command medal. There should have been. They’ve given us a stupid little —
CB: The clasp.
JP: The clasp. There should, there should have been a Bomber Command medal really.
CB: Yeah.
JP: When you think of the casualties that we had and the, there was such, so a few of us really. I was amazed really with how few of us there were overall. Over the whole lot and over a third of them got the chop.
CB: Well, forty four percent were killed.
JP: Yeah. Yeah. Well, there we are.
CB: Good.
JP: So Churchill I’m afraid —
CB: Let you down.
JP: I didn’t really approve of him.
CB: No.
JP: We’ve been virtually ignored all these years and yet, and yet from my research about Bomber Command played a vital part in the war. Very vital.
CB: Absolutely. Yeah.
JP: Yeah.
CB: Yeah.
JP: I think without Bomber Command we could have lost the war. We really could. Germany had enslaved the whole, just about the whole of Europe. There was a story told about, what’s the one part in the Alps there. Oh, what’s, what’s the country? The very [pause] oh God. The one between France and Italy. Not —
CB: Not Switzerland?
JP: Hmmmn?
CB: Switzerland.
JP: Switzerland.
CB: Yes.
JP: Switzerland. My memory is going by the way.
CB: That’s ok.
JP: Words disappear in mid-sentence.
CB: Yes. I know.
JP: You know. I’d like a cheese and [pause] and I couldn’t think of the word tomato until I went to the larder and saw it. I’m definitely going gaga. No two ways about it. But Switzerland there was a story told about the Nazi general said to the Swiss general, ‘What would you do if we invaded you with five hundred or six hundred men or whatever.’ The Swiss general said, ‘I would order all my troops to fire twice [laughs]
CB: Go on.
JP: The Swiss had his own rifle.
CB: Yes.
JP: Every Swiss was a marksman.
CB: Yeah.
JP: That’s what he was saying. If you try and invade us we will fight back.
CB: Yeah.
JP: And incidentally, by the way, again with my research Yugoslavia had a very good Army but the defensive point was there and that’s one, that part is for Germans. Because Germany after the war they lost the Rhineland which Hitler walked into without objection from anybody. They, they lost this part of Czechoslovakia. The name escapes me. It’s in there.
CB: Sudetenland.
JP: Hmmn?
CB: Sudetenland.
JP: Sudetenland. The Sudetenland. He walked, because when they lost Sudetenland that was their major defensive area so when he walked in there and took that over when they did go to return they no longer were in a position to defend themselves.
CB: No.
JP: And he assured before that happened he assured what’s his name? Our prime minister of the time.
CB: Chamberlain.
JP: Chamberlain. At the time and the French he had no further —
Other: Intention.
JP: To go any further. And Chamberlain, I heard Chamberlain on the radio saying, ‘And now we are at war with Germany.’
CB: Did you?
JP: And I’ll swear that man was near tears because he’d fought in the First World War.
CB: Yeah.
JP: So, there we are.
CB: Well, Jim Penny, thank you for a most interesting interview. Thank you.
JP: Is that ok?
CB: Yeah.
Other: Fabulous.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Interview with Jim Penny. Two
Creator
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Chris Brockbank
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2017-09-05
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
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Sound
Identifier
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APennyJA170905, PPennyJ1501
Conforms To
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Pending review
Pending revision of OH transcription
Description
An account of the resource
After volunteering for the RAF Jim Penny began his training which also took him to USA. He was present when the announcement of Pearl Harbour was made and all RAF trainees could openly wear their uniforms as the two countries were officially Allies. He found the steering on the two training aircraft difficult and was scrubbed from the course but when he was interviewed by RAF personnel he was reposted back on to pilot training. When he returned to the UK to finalise his training he crewed up and was posted to 97 Squadron Pathfinders based at RAF Bourn. On one occasion during a test flight the winds were intense and his request to land at a different runway were refused. He ordered the crew to crash positions and on landing the undercarriage collapsed. The CO witnessed the crash and when he found out that the change of runway request had been refused he dismissed the duty controller immediately. The mid-upper gunner was told on one occasion that he had to get a new flight suit because of the state of his but he refused saying it was his lucky flight suit. He was dismissed by the CO and Jim was given a new gunner. Jim Penny flew operations as a pilot with 97 Squadron from RAF Bourn until his aircraft was shot down over Berlin 24th November 1943 and he became a prisoner of war. All other members of the crew were killed.
Language
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eng
Coverage
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Spatial Coverage
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Canada
Germany
Great Britain
England--Cambridgeshire
Germany--Berlin
Germany--Cologne
Temporal Coverage
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1941-12-07
1943-11-23
1943-11-24
1944
1945
Format
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01:30:58 audio recording
Contributor
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Julie Williams
97 Squadron
aircrew
anti-aircraft fire
bombing
Lancaster
love and romance
Pathfinders
pilot
prisoner of war
RAF Bourn
searchlight
shot down
training
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/1067/11523/APearsonBM180312.1.mp3
f54de849aa13ddb751063f82b77dc740
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Pearson, Betty May
B M Pearson
Description
An account of the resource
An oral history interview with Betty Pearson (b. 1928) She lived in Lincoln and discusses her brother-in-law William Mollison Walton
The collection was catalogued by IBCC Digital Archive staff.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2018-03-12
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
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Pearson, BM
Transcribed audio recording
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Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
MC: This interview is being conducted on the behalf of the International Bomber Command Centre. The interviewer is Mike Connock and the interviewee is Betty Pearson. The interview is taking place at Betty Pearson’s home in Lincoln on Monday the 12th of March 2018. Also in attendance is son Stuart Pearson and —
GW: Gillian.
MC: And Gillian.
GW: Watkin.
MC: Watkin. Ok, Betty. Thank you for doing this interview. Just, just as a start just tell me a bit about where you were born and where —
BP: I was born in Bracebridge.
MC: Oh, so you are a local lass.
BP: Yeah.
MC: When was that?
BP: 1928.
MC: 1928.
BP: Yeah.
MC: So, tell me about who you want to talk about today.
BP: My brother in law.
MC: Your brother in law.
BP: Bill Walton as I knew him. William.
MC: William.
BP: William Walton.
MC: William Walton.
BP: Yeah.
MC: Yeah. And how did you come to meet him?
BP: Well, we used to go, my sister and I used to go to North Hykeham dance. A village dance every Saturday night and Bill was at the RAF Swinderby finishing his training I think and he used to come with his friends to the dance, to the Hykeham dance and that’s how they met. I was allowed to go. I was six years younger than my sister. I was allowed to go if I stayed in her company. But I knew they didn’t want me there so [laughs] I used to, I made my own friends unbeknown to my sister.
MC: So, what do you know about Bill?
BP: Well, I knew he was Scottish and he lived just outside Perth and they got on very well together.
MC: Where was he born? Do you know?
BP: I don’t know but it was in Scotland of course.
MC: Yes.
BP: I think probably in the Perth area, because his parents were farmers.
MC: How old was he when he joined the RAF? Do you know?
BP: Oh, I think he was about nineteen. He was a pilot when he was nineteen.
MC: Really? You don’t know where he did his training?
BP: At Swinderby.
MC: Oh, yeah he was at Swinderby.
BP: Yeah. Yeah.
MC: At the time, yeah.
BP: Yeah.
MC: Yeah. So when did, did you follow him through his career? Did, you know, were you aware where he went? What squadron he went to.
BP: No. I don’t know the, I think Stuart’s got all that business down, haven’t you? The squad, squadron number and everything.
MC: So, tell me your story about, about Bill. What do you know about him?
BP: Well, I know that they were courting for quite a while and he was often on duty flying his plane and she used to see him when he wasn’t flying of course. And then we moved from North Hykeham, my parents and my sister and I to an off licence in Bracebridge and I think I was fifteen. I knew I wasn’t allowed to serve beer so I couldn’t have been sixteen but I could eat sweets and chocolate, and I used to test the beer out of the pump. My dad used to say, ‘Have you been at this beer?’ ‘Well, I’ve got to see it’s alright, dad.’ [laughs] So, that was, that was the off licence. We were there quite a while before all this flying business happened. And of course sweets were on coupons in those days and the kiddies all used to come in with their ration books and I used to be able to cut the points out, and serve them the sweets and I enjoyed doing that. It was lovely. And then one day it was the beginning of the sweet coupons and the shop was absolutely packed out and there I was serving sweets. Didn’t look up. I hadn’t got time to look up until the shop was empty and when I did look up there was this airman in a mucky old battledress just inside the door. I didn’t recognise him he was so dirty. But then I realised who it was. Unfortunately, my sister wasn’t there. She was at the pictures with mum. So they had a bit of a shock when they came home. You can imagine.
MC: So was that when he came back from —
BP: Yes, after having been missing.
MC: So how did you, how did your sister find out about him going missing?
BP: Well, they were engaged to be married, and they were due to be married in about six weeks time. And I think they informed her. Well, they would do wouldn’t they? That he was gone missing.
MC: And he just turned up at the door.
BP: He just turned up. Yeah.
MC: So, I mean, do you know any of the, how he evaded or what happened, you know, to him?
BP: Stuart’s got all that information.
SP: The actual type written copy.
MC: You’ve got a copy of the —
SP: I had it from the War Office.
MC: From the, his escape report. Yeah.
SP: Yeah, but this is, this is the word equivalent of it.
MC: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
SP: This is exactly what he wrote. Do you want me to read it out?
MC: Yeah. You can do. Yeah.
SP: Right. “Flight Lieutenant William Mollison Walton DFC. 97 Squadron, Bomber Command, RAF.” And this is the gist of the message. “We took off from Coningsby at 20.50 hours on the 24th of June 1944 to bomb flying bomb bases in the Pas de Calais area. We were attacked by a fighter at a point south of Etaples. I baled out during the night 24th 25th of June and landed at Brimeux.” He gives a map reference then. “In a lake approximately one hundred yards square, in the middle of which there was a small island. I made my way to the island and was obliged to stay there in hiding for two days because of German activity in the area. I believe the Germans were searching for my crew and myself. During the morning of the 27th of June I left my hiding place after having disposed of my parachute and Mae West and made my way southwest around the village of Beaurainville where I hid in a wood for the remainder of the day. The wood was close to a farm which I kept under observation with a view to obtaining help when it became dark. I approached the house at night and was immediately taken inside. I remained here until the 25th of August. Ten days after my arrival I was visited by the chief of the Resistance organisation at Hesdin. On the 25th of August I was moved to an address in Hesdin and remained there until I contacted British troops on the 3rd of September. My flight engineer, Flight Sergeant Mayhew was killed when the parachute failed to open and was buried by the French at Marles Sur Canche.” And that, that’s his report basically. Three days after he was, he was found by the British troops, so I would presume when he got back to this country.
MC: So, Betty how, how long would from when he went missing to when he came back was it that, so your sister was unaware what happened to him.
BP: I think it was about six weeks.
MC: Yeah. Yeah.
BP: I can’t remember dead accurately but it was about six weeks.
MC: So, it must have been a worrying time then.
BP: It was. Yeah. Everything was ready for the wedding.
MC: Yeah. Yeah.
BP: The wedding dress on the back of the bedroom door. The cake was made already. So my sister and my mother and myself went up to Perth to spend a week with his parents. That’s when we met the fortune teller in Perth, Market Square and she was dead accurate. She really was.
MC: So did, did [pause] so when he came back so that they obviously, obviously got married.
BP: Oh yes.
MC: Was that fairly quickly?
BP: Then he was stationed at all sorts of different places, in the New Forest and Malvern.
MC: And she moved around with him.
BP: Of course. They got married and then —
MC: Yeah.
BP: The two went all over.
MC: Did he relate any of his other stories of his operations?
BP: No. No.
MC: No. No. No.
BP: No. Didn’t speak, well not to me anyway. Might have done to my sister. I forgot to mention that the fortune, the fortune teller said that he’d got a bandage around his head and he would come back. And she said to him, she said to my sister, ‘You were about to get married but you will do but not just yet.’ And the bandage was around his head when he, when he was found. Yeah. He had got injured around, just around there. As he came down I suppose.
MC: Was he in good spirits when he came back? Was he? I mean, obviously he must have been to get, to get back from evading.
BP: Yeah.
BP: I don’t know who brought him back. It’s not in your report is it?
HW: No.
BP: So, how he got back over the Channel, I assume somebody must have brought him over.
MC: What, what year was that? Can you remember? [pause] 1944, is that right?
BP: I would think about that time.
MC: Yeah. Yeah. Did you say that it said —
SP: Just after D-Day.
MC: Yeah. It’s alright. You can come in. You’re alright.
SP: Yeah. Just after D-Day.
MC: Yeah.
SP: So obviously he introduced himself to the British troops who were invading Normandy.
MC: Yeah. So what raid was he on? Do we see?
SP: It was a raid to a place called Prouville, which was a big —
MC: Oh, Prouville. Yeah. Yeah.
SP: V-1 flying base.
MC: Yeah. That would have been supporting the D-Day invasion.
SP: Yeah.
MC: I should think. Yeah. Yeah.
SP: Shot down by a night fighter.
MC: What else can you remember, Betty?
BP: Not a lot really except the wedding when we, if there’s anything on there that I haven’t told you about [pause] When he left the RAF he joined the civil aviation. Most of that was spent in Scotland somewhere.
MC: Do you know where he did his flying training?
BP: Yeah. Swinderby.
MC: Oh, I don’t think he would have. He was a pilot, wasn’t he?
BP: Oh yes.
MC: Yeah.
BP: And then he went to East Kirkby didn’t he Stuart?
MC: Yeah. So he —
BP: Yeah.
MC: He could well have done his flying training in Canada.
SP: Do you know, I —
BP: He did. He did. He did some in Canada, yeah. I remember now.
MC: He did. Yeah. Yeah.
SP: I remember you telling me that.
MC: Yeah.
BP: I’ve got here that he was training for his, to be a pilot at aged nineteen to twenty.
SP: He, he did get a —
[recording paused]
MC: He got the DFC. We do know.
SP: He did, yeah.
BP: Yeah. Yeah, he had to —
[recording paused]
MC: You have a read of it. Just read a bit out. Fill it in as you feel like —
BP: When I first met Bill it was North Hykeham village dance when he met my sister, Doreen. He was stationed at Swinderby, completing his training for a pilot and was aged only nineteen to twenty. He was a regular visitor to our home in North Hykeham, and they eventually became engaged. He moved stations. RAF, in brackets, and soon became a pilot and flew over Germany and later completed two tours and was promoted to flight lieutenant. My family and myself moved to an off licence in Lincoln, and their marriage was arranged. The wedding dress hung on the back of the bedroom door and the cake was made. Within six weeks of the wedding Bill was reported missing. My mother, myself and Doreen went up to Scotland to stay with his family for a week, and went one day to Perth to have a look around [cough] Excuse me. We saw a sign for a fortune teller. Doreen removed her RAF brooch and went inside. The information the lady gave her was very, was unbelievable, ‘You were going to get married weren’t you?’ She said, ‘Well, you still will. He will come back and has a bandage on his head because he landed in a tree.’ And I don’t know whether that was true, that bit. He was on an island. There may have been a tree. I don’t know. We went back to Lincoln and I helped in the shop. Doreen went back to work. I was serving sweets when the, in the shop when one Sunday, too busy to look up, the shop was full of people cashing in their sweet coupons. Sweets of course were rationed and it was the start of the month so the children all came in to spend their points. When the shop was empty, about fifteen minutes, I looked up, and there was a scruffy man in a scruffy RAF battle dress inside the door. Of course, it was Bill and I told him mum and Doreen were at the pictures. The reunion took place an hour later and the wedding a few weeks later, and that was it.
MC: But yourself you actually grew up during the war then.
BP: Oh yes.
MC: Yeah. So what do you remember about the area around Lincoln? There must have been a —
BP: Oh, well we lived at Hykeham and I used to cycle sixteen miles a day to work at the GPO, Guildhall Street when I was fourteen. Four miles there. Four back at lunchtime. Back again in the afternoon and four back. Sixteen miles a day. And I remember one day I cycled to work and there was a policeman on duty at the Stonebow as there was in those days and he stopped me. He said, ‘Sorry miss. You can’t go any further. There’s a bomb down there.’ I said, ‘Well, I’m sorry,’ I said, ‘But I’ve got to be at work at 8 o’clock.’ ‘Oh, alright then. Go on.’ They let me go down Mint Street. Where the bomb was I’ve no idea but I went to work. That was it.
MC: So there must have been a lot of airmen around in those days. There were a lot of —
BP: Oh, there was. All over the place. Yeah.
MC: Can you remember seeing the aircraft in the air?
BP: No. It wasn’t so much that, no. But I know one day when we were still at Hykeham, there was a bomber came over and we could recognise it by the sound of the engines. My dad had built a shelter in the garden and we all trooped down there when the siren went. One of the neighbours who was a gentleman of about seventy, he used to bring his knitting in. He used to do his knitting in the shelter. And the bomb dropped just over the road from where we lived funnily enough the [pause] there’s a crater in the field opposite and my sister thought it was her fault because she opened the door at the wrong time and the light came on. But that’s the main thing I can remember about the war really.
MC: So, what did your dad do during the war?
BP: My dad, he worked at Rustons. He was just in between those ages where he was too old to join up. He was too young in the First World War, too old in the Second. So he never went in the Forces but it was a good, you know it was a wartime job if you like he did at Rustons.
MC: And did you have any siblings? Any brothers and sisters?
BP: Only my sister, Doreen.
MC: Yeah.
BP: So —
MC: She’s the, she’s the one that married Bill.
BP: Yeah.
MC: Yeah, obviously. Yeah.
BP: Yeah.
MC: What did they do after the war? Did they stay in Lincoln? They got up to Scotland or what?
BP: Well —
MC: You said he joined the civil airlines.
BP: When he left the RAF he did. Yeah. He was in the RAF for quite a while after that and then he joined the civil aviation.
SP: Air traffic control.
BP: Yes. Yeah. Traffic. Yeah.
MC: Oh, he was air traffic control. Oh right.
BP: And then he went to, he was at Dyce, Aberdeenshire and —
GW: Prestwick.
BP: And Prestwick, yeah. They lived at Ayr when he was at Prestwick. And he was in the New Forest as well. That was nice.
MC: Certainly moved around from one end of the country to the other.
BP: They did. Malvern. He was at Malvern. Yeah.
MC: So were they good days in Lincoln in those, in that period when you —
BP: Oh we all enjoyed it, you know. They call it the good old days didn’t they? It wasn’t of course but remember I was only fifteen so I was allowed to do more than if it had been, you know, ordinary times I think.
MC: Let’s just. I mean I think we talked about his squadron. He was in ’97.
SP: 97 Strait Settlement Squadron.
MC: Strait Settlement, that was right.
SP: Yeah. Yeah.
MC: I thought they were Pathfinders.
SP: He ended, I think he ended up as a Pathfinder.
MC: Yeah.
SP: I believe so.
BP: He did, yeah. He did. Yeah.
MC: With, yeah do you know if he went to any other squadrons?
SP: I don’t to be honest.
MC: No.
SP: His daughter might be able to help on that one. She’s got some information.
MC: Does, does she still have his logbook and stuff like that?
BP: Yeah. They have got his flying logbook but there’s very little information in it strangely enough about the crash. About when the aircraft was shot down. I have got that. I can, I can dig that out.
[recording paused]
MC: You say she’s got an original letter from the French family.
SP: Yeah, from the French family and she’s had problems getting it translated. I don’t know whether that would be of any use to you.
MC: Absolutely, yeah.
BP: I mean the uni could translate that surely.
MC: Yeah. That’s right. Yeah. No. It’s, it’s very good because that’s the sort of thing that the archives need.
BP: Yeah.
[recording paused]
MC: So did, were you old enough to go to the dances in them days?
BP: My goodness me, yes. I was only allowed to go if I stayed with my sister.
MC: With your sister, you said. Yeah
BP: She was six years older than me you see.
MC: And how old were you?
BP: When I started to go to the dance, and put my lipstick on when I got outside.
SP: When you got outside.
BP: I’d be about fourteen I should think.
MC: Fourteen. Yeah.
BP: Yeah. And I probably looked a little bit older. I used to get plenty of dance partners.
SP: Yeah. I bet you did.
MC: Yeah.
BP: That’s where I learned to dance.
MC: Yeah.
BP: North Hykeham Parish Hall.
MC: Yeah, a lot, were there a lot of RAF boys at the —
BP: Oh, God. Yes.
MC: They were all RAF boys at the dances.
BP: Plenty of partners, and the local lads didn’t like that much at all.
MC: No.
SP: Yeah.
MC: Where did you have the dances did you say?
BP: North Hykeham.
MC: Oh, North Hykeham.
BP: There’s a church hall just near the church there.
MC: Oh, the church hall. Oh right. Yeah. So where did the lads, the RAF lads come from? Do you know which stations?
BP: Swinderby.
MC: Mainly Swinderby.
BP: Yeah.
MC: Yeah.
SP: Yeah. He did learn to fly in Canada because I remember you telling me that. I think he probably told me as well.
BP: Yeah.
SP: Learning to fly in Canada. But, yeah I can, I can well his son was the same age as me and I can’t remember my Uncle Bill talking about the war at all.
BP: No.
SP: Did he —
BP: No. No.
SP: He did, I think he did recall an incident where they were taking off and a Lancaster flying in front of his exploded, you know. Faulty bomb and the whole thing went up. I remember that.
BP: I can remember you telling me that. So he must have told you.
SP: Well, either me directly or dad.
BP: Yeah. Yeah.
SP: It might have been dad. I do remember that so —
[recording paused]
MC: Yeah. I mean you say about the, you know it being too late and yeah, and the politics, yeah.
SP: Yeah. It beggars belief it’s taken that long. The rate of attrition amongst bomber crew was, well as you know was huge wasn’t it?
MC: And you talked about Coventry.
SP: The apologists for Dresden I think had an influence on the decision not to commemorate Bomber Command’s exploits, but I think if we had a conversation with the relatives of the Mayor of Coventry at the time, he might have something to say about that. So whether politics has played the major part in this delay I don’t know but I think the Centre’s an amazing building. I love the way it’s so interactive, and I think that will help a lot of the younger people get a grasp of what they actually went through in the war because they live in the IT age and it’s very technically advanced isn’t it, the information?
[recording paused]
MC: So, I gather Bill is obviously no longer still alive.
BP: Oh, no. He died when he was about sixty two.
MC: Sixty two.
BP: Yeah.
MC: He wasn’t very old then.
BP: Cancer. No. And my sister as well. She was sixty two. They both died.
MC: Oh really. Both died at sixty two.
BP: Yeah.
MC: Oh, goodness me. Yeah.
BP: Well, Doreen was six months older than Bill and she died six months after Bill had died so they were the same age more or less.
SP: Are we —
[recording paused]
MC: So, when are you actually he was obviously brought back through the lines by the French.
SP: Yeah.
MC: And then he —
SP: I’ll just —
MC: And then he tied up with the British troops did he?
SP: Yeah. I’ll just re-read this. These are his exact words.
MC: Is that what you read before?
SP: Yeah. The document says, “Secret,” at the top of it but I don’t think that applies anymore, do you? For a while I did wonder about that because being an ex-copper, signing the Official Secrets Act I thought maybe I shouldn’t be doing this but God, it was 1944. “On the 25th of August I was moved to an address in Hesdin and remained there until I contacted British troops on the 3rd of September.
MC: Oh. So he contacted the British troops.
[recording paused]
MC: Right, it’s just to say thank you Betty. Anyway, thank you for the interview, and to you, Stuart.
SP: No problem.
MC: Much appreciated, and we’ll, we’ll get this on file. Thank you very much to both of you.
BP: You’re welcome.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with Betty May Pearson
William Mollison Walton
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Mike Connock
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2018-03-12
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Sound
Identifier
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APearsonBM180312
Format
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00:22:31 audio recording
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
England--Lincolnshire
France
France--Hesdin
Description
An account of the resource
Her brother-in-law William Mollison Walton, after training to be a pilot in Canada, was based at RAF Swinderby with 97 Squadron. In 1944 his aircraft was attacked and he baled out. He spent two days on a small island where he buried his parachute, He was eventually being taken in by a French family. William was visited by the chief of the resistance organisation and was taken to Hesdin where he remained until British troops helped him back home. William ended up as a Pathfinder.
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Sue Smith
Julie Williams
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1944-06-24
1944-06-25
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Civilian
Conforms To
An established standard to which the described resource conforms.
Pending revision of OH transcription
97 Squadron
bale out
bombing
bombing of the Pas de Calais V-1 sites (24/25 June 1944)
evading
home front
love and romance
Normandy campaign (6 June – 21 August 1944)
Pathfinders
RAF Swinderby
Resistance
superstition
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/177/11356/LBattyPH220759v1.2.pdf
14a45ff205dd3cf87ee5b5b106fa8586
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Batty, Philip
Phil Batty
P Batty
Description
An account of the resource
19 Items. The collection consists of one oral history interview with Philip Batty (b. 1925). He discusses the death of his older brother Dennis early in the Second World War, his wartime service with 50 Squadron at RAF Sturgate as a wireless operator/ air gunner, and his long post war career. The collection also includes a number of group photographs of airmen after training, photographs of aircraft in southern Africa, his log book and propaganda material.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2016-10-14
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Batty, P
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Philip Batty's flying log book for navigators, air bombers, air gunners and flight engineers
Description
An account of the resource
Flying log book for navigator’s, air bomber’s, air gunner’s, flight engineer’s for Philip Batty, wireless operator, covering the period from 7 February 1944 to 31 October 1949. Detailing his flying training, post war flying and instructor duties. He was stationed at RAF Madley, RAF Staverton, RAF Dumfries, RAF Husbands Bosworth, RAF Winthorpe, RAF Sturgate, RAF Linton, RAF Weathersfield, RAF Tarrant Rushton, RAF Silverstone, RAF Heany and RAF Thornhill. Aircraft flown in were, Dominie, Anson, Proctor, Wellington, Lancaster, Halifax and C-47. He flew 4 Dodge operations to Pomigliano and Bari with 50 squadron. He also carried out paratrooper, supply drops and glider towing with 297 squadron.
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Great Britain. Royal Air Force
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
One booklet
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Text
Text. Log book and record book
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
LBattyPH220759v1
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
Italy
Zimbabwe
England--Essex
England--Gloucestershire
England--Herefordshire
England--Leicestershire
England--Lincolnshire
England--Northamptonshire
England--Nottinghamshire
England--Yorkshire
Italy--Bari
Italy--Pomigliano d'Arco
Scotland--Dumfries
Zimbabwe--Bulawayo
Zimbabwe--Gweru
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1944
1945
1946
1947
1948
1949
1945-08-21
1945-08-25
1945-09-07
1945-09-10
1945-09-13
1945-09-15
1945-10-02
1945-10-04
1945-10-08
1945-10-10
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Mike Connock
1661 HCU
1665 HCU
297 Squadron
50 Squadron
85 OTU
97 Squadron
Advanced Flying Unit
aircrew
Anson
C-47
Dominie
Flying Training School
Halifax
Halifax Mk 5
Halifax Mk 7
Heavy Conversion Unit
Lancaster
Operation Dodge (1945)
Operational Training Unit
Proctor
RAF Dumfries
RAF Husbands Bosworth
RAF Linton on Ouse
RAF Madley
RAF Silverstone
RAF Staverton
RAF Sturgate
RAF Tarrant Rushton
RAF Weathersfield
RAF Winthorpe
training
Wellington
wireless operator
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/917/11159/PLambertRW1801.1.jpg
50acb4821fe24c967c2fcc3a49e4e7f9
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/917/11159/ALambertRW180820.2.mp3
7d38449922f636d635cac0250fdd78b3
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Lambert, Richard William
R W Lambert
Description
An account of the resource
An oral history interview with Flight Lieutenant Richard Lambert (b. 1925, 1850934 Royal Air Force). He served as a flight engineer with 101 and 15 Squadrons.
The collection was catalogued by IBCC Digital Archive staff.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2018-08-20
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
Lambert, RW
Transcribed audio recording
A resource consisting primarily of recorded human voice.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
RL: Ok. This interview is being carried out for the International Bomber Command Centre. The interviewee is Mr Richard Lambert. The interviewer is Jennifer Barraclough. The date is the 20th of August 2018 and it’s taking place at Mr Lambert’s home near Auckland in New Zealand. Ok, Mr Lambert.
JB: Right.
RL: Thank you very much for —
JB: Ok.
RL: Taking part. Could you tell us a little about your early life and how you came to join up?
JB: I couldn’t wait to join up and at that time the recruiting age was seventeen and a quarter whereas in the Fleet Air Arm it was seventeen and a half so had to go to the seventeen and a quarter. On that day I cycled in to Guildford in Surrey to, to volunteer and the office was closed. Here we are with a war on, and a volunteer and they’re closed. Anyway, I went, went back on the Monday and volunteered. That was at seventeen and a quarter and a couple of days. So I always wanted to join the Air Force anyway, and so there was a scheme. PNB. Pilot, navigator or bomb aimer. And the initial part of that training was that you would be, you were all about the same intelligence but you’d be graded at a Tiger Moth flying school which was one of the three things you could be, a pilot, navigator, bomb aimer. So if you went solo the chances of getting a pilot’s job were enhanced. If you didn’t obviously they sent you off to Canada to be a navigator or whatever. So that was ok. But then the work for D-Day was well on the way even in 1943. And so, yes having volunteered the first thing we’d do of course is sit around and do nothing because the training was already catching up with surplus to requirements virtually. So we reported to Lord’s Cricket Ground to be uniformed and pick up all your gear and so on. Then off to the first course, the ITW which was in a place called Cannock Chase in, in the Midlands. And that was a six months course but basically having read about it since then it was just a time filling exercise because we went, after six months we went up to Scotland for an ITW, Initial Training Wing which was part of the normal training. So we lost six months already. So down to the Grading School on Tiger Moths. Then around about that time well we went down to London. No. That’s not true. We went to London for regrading and they, they had V-1s and V-2 bombs dropping on us. Dropping on us from Regent’s Park. Anyway, after all of that I was once again declared redundant and we were in London. We did aptitude tests and I became a trainee flight engineer. And then that went to the Technical Training Schools in Locking and St Athan’s. Big places. All part of the 1933 expansion and yeah so I became a flight engineer in those, in those days you didn’t do any flying at all. You just did technical work. So then of course once more I was redundant and I became a ground engineer. Flight mechanic’s course at Cosford. Cosford was the holding place for the returned prisoners of war so they became, they had priority to go in to Cosford. Cosford’s accommodation. And we were shipped to Hereford. And then we were redundant once more. We went up to Lossiemouth of all places. And then from Lossiemouth they started a new scheme for people that could sign on for a three year engagement for just three years and a bounty. Anyway, I was lucky at Lossiemouth. I found favour with the group captain even though I was just a scruffy redundant flight engineer and he got me on the next course to, back to St Athans. So that was about 1947 or something like that. And finally I went to Lindholme which was a Bomber Command base and finished my training as a flight engineer. And then I went to, all the bomber bases in those days were commanded by ex-prisoners of war. The squadron I went on was 617, not that you would recognise it as 617 with a Squadron Leader Brodie who had been a prisoner of war. And of course some of the pilots were flight, were chaps who’d decided to stay on and they became, Peter [Dunstall] was an escapee from Colditz. Although I don’t think he’d escaped from there but anyway Peter was in charge of 101 Squadron which during the war was a radio counter measures squadron, and I believe the shot down rate for that was higher than the rest of the, of Bomber Command. Anyway, I soldiered on in Bomber Command for a little bit longer and then they started, by then it was, the war was off and but they, the Cold War was winding up. We were still flying Lancasters and Lincolns, Lincoln and, but they started pilot recruiting. So this is what I really wanted to do in 1943. So after various aptitude tests in North Weald I went on a pilot’s course and finally became a pilot and rejoined. I could have gone anywhere after that course. I could have, I didn’t have to get back to Bomber Command but I thought well I’ve done all this time with Bomber Command I’d go back because I was familiar with it. So I went to a place called Hemswell and stayed there for quite a long time, 97 Squadron which was a Rhodesian squadron. And then I did some, did some flying for the Dambuster film which, which was fun. And then, then I was grounded. I had a bit of trouble with my ears so became a station adjutant at a place called Tern Hill in Shropshire, and I stayed there two or three years. And then what did I do? What happened then? I can’t think. Oh, I went down to Thorney Island as a, I did a jet conversion course on Vampires and Meteors training navigators and that was a pleasant stay because I had a house further along the coast in a place called Rustington and so I was, I was living at home, commuting to work, it was all very pleasant. So I was there for a couple of years and then I became a bit disillusioned with, I had passed all my promotion exams but the chances of getting a squadron was a bit remote and so I, I resigned and I was going, I had some property to build in a boatyard but the government changed and the money was not available and so on and so on. So I then went down, I had a contact with a chap who had an executive aeroplane and I went to, went to see him and he said, ‘Oh, that’s alright. Come and see me.’ So I flew. I was initially going to say, ‘I’ll fly for you for nothing,’ because I just needed the experience. Not the experience. The time. So, I then worked in [pause] doing executive work and then living at my, I just carried on living at home which was all very pleasant. So I was just like an airborne chauffeur which after a while I didn’t really want to do so I joined British United Airways. And then I stayed with them for eight years, something like that flying various aeroplanes until we, it became jet conversion on BAC 111s. Then my first wife got ill, but she had relatives out here so I thought it would be a good place for her to be. So we came out here and I joined, luckily Air New Zealand. So I was a ground instructor with Air New Zealand. Stayed with them for quite a few years and then retired. And that was me more or less.
RL: Fine. Thanks. That’s really interesting. Thank you.
JB: It’s a tale of perseverance to become a pilot and enjoying the piloting. It was fun working for this, as an executive pilot had its fun sides but my wife was ill, and it was all sort of a bit all downhill for us then. But anyway, there we go.
RL: Thank you.
JB: Oh I could tell you something about —
RL: Yes.
JB: Around Scampton was obviously, it was Bomber Command, but Scampton and Lincolnshire was Bomber Command. Apart from Yorkshire. But there was, there was a pub just down the hill called the Dambusters. And that’s where we did the flying for the Dambusters. They resuscitated four Lancasters. Three of them they put dummy bombs on so they could take them on, take them off which showed some close up pictures of the bomb which was in plywood. And yeah, I can’t remember then when that was but rationing was still on in England and they had, for the film unit they had a mobile caravan canteen. And so rationing as I say was still on and so we ate with the, with the film people. I can remember big T-bone steaks and stuff like that which was fun. And we did all the all the crowd scenes. They used RAF people to do the crowd scenes and the Lancasters were flown by me and four other blokes, and Richard Todd would come on. He would, he would go on the leader, the flight commander’s aeroplane and I went with, it was supposed to be Micky Martin, the Australian flight commander. So that was, we took off on the grass airfield which was at Kirton Lindsey which, Scampton at the time of the war didn’t have any runways. So they took off in a three and they ran at that two or three times to make it look more than it actually was. And then we did the routine flying which was identical to the 617 Squadron briefings, and the same accommodation. Same airfield except they had runways which we were at Kirton Lindsey for no runways. And yeah, we flew late afternoon or early evening over all the reservoirs that they could find and Derwentwater was the main one of course. And yes, so finally of course the film is repeated over and over again. It’s been on, it’s been on the Chaser. You know, which aeroplane of Bomber Command which of course it was a fantastic exercise to do and successful but of course they lost a lot of chaps. Yeah. And they lost the reminder on a raid on the Kiel Canal I think soon after that. And they lost the chaps on the way back across the North Sea. So having survived the Dambuster raid they were shot down. Terrible time and I have found since then of course that all the things I volunteered for as a young person were absolutely suicide jobs. In desperation when I was on the ground I volunteered as a parachute instructor. So I went to Ringway and jumped out of a, out of a barrage balloon and that sort of thing. But one of the chaps on the course got spinal meningitis so we were all quarantined and then I was sent back to Lossiemouth. Yeah. It’s crazy what you do. What else can we say?
[recording paused]
RL: Ok.
JB: One of the Bomber Command exercises that we did which again was good fun was again to go out to Egypt. Their detachments were called Sunray and the idea was to fly out through Castel Benito and into the Canal Zone and we’d stay there for a month. So we’d do bombing and gunnery exercises. It was just like a camp that they used to have before the war. So we’d stay there for a month and fly home again. On the way back once, Peter Tunstall who’d just been released from prisoner of war camp and so on got in to trouble with the storm clouds in the south of France. And of course he went so high he didn’t check that the, an airmen that, we were carrying passengers home subsequently died because he was ill. They landed at Tangmere but it was a bit late then. That was one of the exercises. And then of course the film thing. That was, that was pretty good. Yeah. I can’t get over the fact that we were still flying wartime aeroplanes that were long gone. Although the V-force aeroplanes were just coming in. Valiants and so on. Fran, has just, this is going to be edited I guess. Fran just mentioned that.
Other: [unclear]
RL: The, there was, well one of the biggest things that influenced my life in the Air Force was I was so lucky. I was overpaid on a pay parade. This was when I was on Lossiemouth. Over paid ten pounds or something like that and at the time I didn’t realise it but after lunch I went back to my room and realised I’d got ten pounds more than I should have. Lossiemouth was a long way from home and I thought now, I could go home, see my mother with this extra money. Buy a ticket and so on. But common sense said go and report it. So I went around to the accounts office and said, ‘I think I was overpaid,’ and the, the accountant was so pleased to see me because he was responsible for the ten pounds. He would have had to find ten pounds. Anyway, he came and said, ‘Thank you very much.’ And they said, ‘Just a minute,’ and I was taken in to the group captain. And this is, I was working outside at the time on aeroplanes so I was pretty scruffy I guess. Anyway, we talked together and he then said, ‘Is there anything I can do for you?’ I said, ‘Well, I’ve just signed on for three years but I’m not doing a refresher course.’ And so he obviously, he didn’t promise anything but a few days later I was on the refresher course at St Athans that I mentioned earlier. So that was, if I hadn’t been there I would have done the three years on the ground and never flown. But then I did, and of course I got a civilian licence when I left the Air Force so that was lucky. Yeah. So there was something else I was going to mention.
[recording paused]
RL: Go again.
JB: Yeah. I said, I mentioned about volunteering for things. These chaps in in Bomber Command there was a Flare Force. That’s right. I remember. Bomber Command had closed down after the end of the war and the Pathfinders and all those top class people were just let go. And they suddenly realised that Russia was getting nasty and that they needed what they subsequently called the Flare Force and a lot of people might not have heard of that. So we went from the Pathfinders to Flare Force and the squadrons were 97, 101, two Mosquito squadrons 103 and 197. I think that was it. So, and then we just did exercises. People get killed on exercises. Mosquitoes crashed once or twice. Yeah. And of course, most of the people, most of the people became instructors and or either left, and left the Air Force. But it was hard times in those days. If you came out of the Air Force the chance of getting a job was a bit remote. And if you weren’t selected for a commission or, I was, again I was lucky. I was junior chap on the squadron and I always liked to fly the communication aeroplanes which might have been an Anson or an Oxford or something. So I would go and volunteer to get checked out on that aeroplane. So on, on 15 Squadron which was flying B29s we had some, they called them Washingtons. They thought I was going, it would be a good sort of Joe job, ‘Give it to Dick. He’ll do it.’ Anyway, the phone went and it was this group captain who was Gus Walker who’d had his arm blown off during the war. Gus Walker wanted to fly so I, I could fly the Oxfords and he wanted to fly so, and he was a major winner of some golf. One armed golfing champion. Gus Walker. Anyway, I said I’m going to go to with the group captain with his one arm and I’d operate the throttles and generally keep a look out. So that was quite pleasant. So, it was good to have lots of Brownie points when you’re doing that. When you’re a junior and so on. So that was, that again was lucky. And then as I say with my ten pound win that was a good introduction to the group captain and so on. Yeah. I can’t think of any other Brownie points that I achieved at the time. You need Brownie points. Yeah. What do I say then? Bill French was my wireless operator who was, I think he’s anglo-Indian. I’m not sure. But anyway he was Indian of some kind. A jolly good wireless operator. So we’d operate doing that. I kept in touch with the crew initially but they all seemed to die very young. My navigator Roddy Williams, he died ages ago. And a chap called Coffe. C O F F E. Coffe or something like that and he was a a navigator. And my crew, I went to be a station adjutant but my crew went to, out to Christmas Island to do the initial bombing with the atomic bomb for the RAF. Yeah. That was, but I missed that. Yeah. I did do a very hush hush photographic exercise in, over turkey which is I don’t know what that was about. Anyway, there you go.
RL: Ok. Thank you very much.
JB: Ok.
RL: That was great.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with Richard William Lambert
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Jennifer Barraclough
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2018-08-20
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Sound
Identifier
An unambiguous reference to the resource within a given context
ALambertRW180820, PLambertRW1801
Format
The file format, physical medium, or dimensions of the resource
00:21:41 audio recording
Language
A language of the resource
eng
Coverage
The spatial or temporal topic of the resource, the spatial applicability of the resource, or the jurisdiction under which the resource is relevant
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
England--Herefordshire
England--Lincolnshire
England--Shropshire
England--Somerset
England--Staffordshire
England--Sussex
England--Yorkshire
Scotland--Moray
Wales--Vale of Glamorgan
Description
An account of the resource
In 1943, when Richard was 17 and a half, he cycled into Guildford to sign up to volunteer for the Royal Air Force. He reported to Lords cricket ground to collect his uniform and gear and then went for training at RAF Hednesford for a six-month course. After that he went to the initial training wing in Scotland on Tiger Moths. He became redundant, but then went to technical training schools in RAF Locking and RAF St Athans and became a flight engineer. After becoming redundant for a second time he became a ground engineer, doing a course at RAF Cosford, before going to RAF Hereford and then RAF Lossiemouth where he signed on for a three-year engagement. Richard was posted to RAF Lindholme and became a flight engineer with 617 Squadron. After various aptitude tests and a pilot course he finally became a pilot and went to RAF Hemswell with 97 Squadron. He then stayed in RAF Ternhill, Shropshire for two or three years before going to RAF Thorney Island for a jet conversion course. After leaving the RAF he joined British United Airways, staying for about eight years. When his first wife became ill, he joined Air New Zealand as a ground instructor before retiring. Richard was involved in the making of the Dambuster film.
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Sue Smith
Julie Williams
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Pending review
Pending revision of OH transcription
101 Squadron
15 Squadron
617 Squadron
97 Squadron
aircrew
entertainment
flight engineer
ground crew
Initial Training Wing
pilot
RAF Cosford
RAF Credenhill
RAF Hednesford
RAF Hemswell
RAF Kirton in Lindsey
RAF Lindholme
RAF Locking
RAF Lossiemouth
RAF Scampton
RAF St Athan
RAF Ternhill
RAF Thorney Island
Tiger Moth
training
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ef6b69d8536b3e5ebdb6b4231318428f
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/864/11106/AHaytonK171004.2.mp3
2342cec6176bee1aa281e272dd002da5
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Hayton, Ken
K Hayton
Description
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An oral history interview with Ken Hayton about his father George Stanley 'Stan' Hayton (1912 - 1971). He served as a fitter at RAF Woodhall Spa and RAF Riccall.
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IBCC Digital Archive
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2017-10-17
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
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Hayton, K
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JS: This interview is being conducted for the International Bomber Command Centre. The interviewer is Joyce Sharland. The interviewee is Ken Hayton. The interview is taking place at Mr Hayton’s home in Andover on the 17th of October 2017.
KH: Yes.
JS: Right. So, Mr Hayton, can you tell me about your father?
KH: My father was George Stanley Hayton. Always known as Stan. And before the war he was employed by Lloyds Bank. He was born in Durham City in two thousand and err now then let me get this right [pause] in 1912, and lived in the city all his life until his death in 1971. In, around about the early time, early days of 1940 he was given permission by the bank to join the Royal Air Force as a volunteer. Which he did. And I know that he did join as a volunteer because initially his uniform had the letters VR under the albatross on his shoulder flashes. It would be 1940 that he joined up because I have recollections as a small boy of going to Durham Station to see him off. I believe his initial training took place at RAF Padgate. And then after that was completed he went on to his trade training as a fitter armourer which I think took place at Lytham St Anne’s. I’m not sure about that but I think that’s where he went. Once that was completed he was posted to Bomber Command into 97 Squadron which was based at RAF Woodhall Spa in Lincolnshire. A satellite unit to RAF Coningsby. And he remained there right throughout the war or almost to the end of the war. And towards the end of the war he was posted to RAF Riccall in Yorkshire where he was involved in preparing all the redundant 303 Browning aircraft guns for storage in case they were ever needed to be called back into service. He was demobbed from RAF Waddington in around about the latter part of 1945. I do believe that he was offered a commission if he was prepared to stay in the Royal Air Force but his duty he felt was to the bank who had released him early. So he then was demobbed and joined Lloyds bank where he remained employed until he retired after having served forty years. During his service at Woodhall Spa he was involved in bombing up Lancasters for raids over the occupied territories and when 617 Squadron was due to take, take-off for the Dams raid 97 Squadron was moved back to the parent unit at Coningsby and 617 Squadron came in to Woodhall Spa. I can only think that that was done from a security point of view because it would be much easier to maintain security on a single Squadron station like Woodhall, rather than on the main base of 617 Squadron which was of course RAF Scampton. My father was involved in the bombing up of 617 Squadron for the Dams raid. And I only learned about this when after the war and the production of the film, “The Dambusters,” my father and I went to see it at the cinema in Durham. And on the way home we were discussing various things in the film and it came out that my dad had been involved with 617 Squadron. And when I asked him about the parts of the film which showed the aftermath of the raid on the countryside I said I wondered if that was anything like what had actually had happened and whether the filmers had got it anything accurate. And he said, ‘Yes. It was just like that.’ And immediately after that he said, ‘But don’t tell your mother I said that.’ I can only think that that comment was made because he had been taken over the Dams in one of the Mosquito reconnaissance aircraft which did the photo reconnaissance after the Dams raid. I’ve no proof of that but I can’t see any other reason for the comment which he made except that he was there. He had been very much involved in the bombing up of the aircraft and this I think was why he wanted to go and see the film because neither he nor I were great film goers. When he was at Woodhall there was an incident at a bomb dump near Snaith which is not too far away from Coningsby and Woodhall when a Lancaster came down on the edge of the bomb dump and my dad was involved in the clearing up operations. And I think that had an effect on him because we never ever had chops as a meat meal and he could never stand the smell of lamb being cooked. No other reason that I can think of for that reaction other than the involvement that he’d had in clearing up what obviously must have been carnage with the Lancaster coming down on the, on the edge of the bomb dump. At one time during the war my mother and my sister and myself went down to Woodhall Spa because my dad couldn’t get any leave. It was during a high pressure time I think of bombing raids and he wanted a pushbike. And being the elder of the two children I was given the responsibility of looking after the bike. I can remember feeling quite proud that I’d been given the responsibility of taking care of this bike all the way down from Durham to Woodhall Spa. During that journey we passed through York Station not long after it had been blitzed by the Luftwaffe and it really was in a very bad state on one side of the station. Of course the Luftwaffe went for York because it was a main railway junction during the war and if they could have disrupted the railways it would have had a marked effect on our war effort. The other effect I think that I learned about with on the family was when my father came home on the odd occasion that he could get home on leave he always changed out of uniform into civvies before he saw my sister because my sister was younger than I was and she thought that the RAF was a sort of box that my father was locked up in and the uniform always brought that home to her. But we can only think that that was one of the reasons that dad always got changed as soon as he came home. There was not a lot of other effect on us as a family except that once my father had joined up we moved out of the council house and went to live with my maternal grandparents in the city which overlooked the river and the Cathedral. And just thinking about that period in the early days of the war Durham City is what might be regarded at the centre of a hub of a wheel with the perimeter being on the three main rivers. The Tyne, the Wear and the Tees with the shipyards in Newcastle, Sunderland and Middlesbrough. And at the beginning of the war we used to get all the air raid warnings if enemy aircraft were coming in for any of those three places. But we never had anything over the city. And eventually we stopped getting air raid warnings unless the aircraft were heading inland. So we were very, very fortunate. Not so my wife who was a Sunderland girl and she lived through the various Blitzes in Sunderland and it had obviously an effect on her as a young girl. Much more so. And I didn’t realise until after we were married and we were talking about things that had happened during the war how fortunate we had been as a family because my maternal grandfather was a great gardener and had allotments which provided vegetables. And we also had an orchard at the back of the, at the back of the house so that we always had fruit. And he kept chickens in the orchard so we always had meat. And it made me realise, talking to my wife just how lucky we had been having all those facilities when I heard of the sort of things that she had had to put up with in Sunderland. So, you know there were many things that happened during the war which folks don’t realise. I mean that was only a distance of twelve miles between Durham City and Sunderland and yet such a difference in the effect on families that lived in, in those two places. My maternal grandfather had been a forge smith in Yorkshire and at the beginning of the First World War he was sent up to Durham to work in the forge there. And they sent him away from Yorkshire because the recruiting officers were fed up with him trying to join the forces and told him he was much more valuable making the armaments for the forces rather than him going out into Europe. So that was how the family from Yorkshire came to be based in Durham city and how my parents met. Because my paternal grandfather was trained as a pharmaceutical chemist and during the First World War he was stationed in Mesopotamia. I think as part of the Northumberland Fusiliers. But I’m not certain about that. He eventually moved into the motor trade and that was how I knew him all my life. The effect, I think on my mother wasn’t anything that I ever knew about or thought about. She had started training as a teacher before the war and of course like all women had to do something and once my sister got to school age she went back to teaching. So as a family we were still a fairly compact unit. Whilst we were living with my grandparents as I say we were in a house that overlooked the river and the Cathedral. And there has been for many many years the knowledge that if ever the Durham Cathedral were to come under attack for any reason whatsoever St Cuthbert who the Cathedral is dedicated to and who is buried in the Cathedral would save it. And of course Von Ribbentrop was determined to obliterate all the main Cathedrals in the United Kingdom if he could. And shortly after the raid which destroyed Coventry Cathedral we had an air raid warning in Durham and that was as I say by this time quite unusual. So we were due to go down into the cellar of the house which was our air raid shelter but looking out of the window there was the mist rising off the river. And of course the river is an ox bow around the central peninsula of the city on which stands the Cathedral and the castle. So this mist rose off the river and it’s always been said that that was St Cuthbert’s way of protecting the Cathedral. And certainly that mist blanketed the whole of the city and we could hear the German aircraft over the top of the city. It was definitely German aircraft because their engines weren’t synchronised like the English or British aircraft engines were. And they were over the, overhead going around and around. Nothing happened and eventually they flew off. The all clear went. And as the all clear went the mist descended back to the river. And I can vouch for that because as a youngster I saw it out of the windows of our house. My grandparent’s house. And it’s made a lasting impression as you can probably gather. I really don’t know that there’s much else that I can say apart from the fact that my own Royal Air Force service which was three years as a regular and two and a half years on the reserve and during that time the one thing that I was very proud to wear was my father’s cap badge. Sadly, I no longer have that. I have my own cap badge but I think my father’s cap badge must have gone back with my uniform when I had to return it to RAF Fenton which was my call up base when my two and a half years reserve service was ended. The only other thing of my father’s which I have apart from his ‘39 ‘45 Star and Defence Medal is a piece of metalwork which I know was part of one of his trade tests in which I think was part of the bomb release mechanism for a Lancaster. I can’t be sure about that but the trade test would be taken after he’d started working on Lancasters so I think it’s a fair assumption that that’s probably what it is. I don’t know that there’s much else that I can say.
JS: You said you recall going to the station to see your father off.
KH: Yeah.
JS: How old were you then?
KH: I’d be about seven.
JS: About seven. And you went with your mother and your sister?
KH: I don’t think my sister went. My sister would only be about three. Three and a half and so I don’t think she went. She would probably stay with my grandparents. But I, I can certainly recall going to the, going to the station in Durham and seeing, seeing dad off on the train. Little bits of things like that they do stick in your memory and you know it’s a bit like the [pause] the memories of the 9 o’clock news during the war. Alright, as a youngster you don’t appreciate everything that is being said but the things that stick in my mind are Big Ben, and my grandparents sitting in the lounge and everybody being quiet and listening to the news. It was a nightly ritual and you know its little things like that which, you know I think need to be kept in mind. And I think future generations need to know how important it was to us at home to know what was going on. And the only way we could get recent, decent reliable news was the BBC. And you know it was important to everyone I think and I’m quite certain that my family weren’t any different from countless other families throughout the country. At 9 o’clock every night the wireless was turned on and we had the news. There wasn’t all the current news from the battlefield and all the rest of it and I think it’s perhaps just as well. I think we get too much of this instantaneous news now and it doesn’t give people time to digest really what’s happening. Yeah. Instant gratification in a different form. Perhaps I’m being old fashioned.
JS: Did, as far as you’re aware did your mother ever receive letters from your father. Was he able? Could he write letters? Could he communicate? Make phone calls perhaps. Do you ever recall him making contact when he was away?
KH: I don’t recall any phone calls. I don’t think, in fact I don’t think we had a phone in the house so that wouldn’t have been possible. Letters I think possibly he did get able, he was able to send. I mean as he was based in this country I don’t think there was any problem in that respect. But it didn’t sort of register on me as a, as a youngster. I mean that’s not something that I would have been aware of I don’t think. The only things that I was aware of were, you know the pleasure of having him come home on leave on the occasions when he could get home. And as I say the occasion when we went down to Woodhall Spa and it would be during my school summer holidays. And the one, the one thing apart from the pushbike being my responsibility the one thing that I can remember of that little holiday from our point of view was seeing a Lancaster loop the loop. Which was totally out of order. And I believe talking to my father afterwards that that particular exercise had such a damaging affect on the airframe of the aircraft that it was written off and I believe the pilot was severely disciplined because obviously you don’t write off expensive aircraft. But it shouldn’t, it shouldn’t have happened but I can remember seeing it and was quite surprised. It was just one of those little things that come back to mind as you, as you think about what, what happened. And another thing that has just come back to my mind thinking about that was at the beginning of the war just after my father had joined up and before we moved in with my grandparents I can remember being taken into the shelter in the garden when there was an air raid warning and looking up into the night sky and seeing searchlights over towards Sunderland and seeing what was obviously an aerial dogfight because you could even at a distance of twelve miles you could see the tracer. And that, that’s something which has just come back to me since talking about seeing the Lancaster. We shouldn’t have been out of the shelter but, you know youngsters do things that they shouldn’t do even, even in wartime. Yeah.
JS: So, did life for you as a young lad, did it more or less go on as normal? You were going to school. You were helping around the house presumably, were you? Were any of your friends lives touched in a bad way by the war? Did any of them lose close relatives.
KH: No. Not that I can say. I mean, as youngsters we didn’t sort of discuss the, we didn’t discuss the war. It was something that was going on and we had the black out and there was no possibility of after school work or sports clubs or anything like that. They were all off limits. When school was over you went. You went home and you stayed at home. You couldn’t go and play out. Which we could once the war was over. But we didn’t [pause] I can’t recall sort of discussing or talking about the war as a youngster at school. Not even when I got to Grammar School just towards the end of the war. The only thing that was noticeable when I got to Grammar School was the fact that there were quite a number of older teachers there who had obviously stayed on beyond retirement because the young teachers had gone into the forces. And I was made well aware of that because both my, my uncle and my father had gone to the same Grammar School and some of the teachers that taught them taught me. Which was sometimes a little embarrassing because on occasions, I can remember one particular occasion in the physics laboratory when I’d been assisting in dealing with some electrical experiment which had a series of plug keys connecting wires up and one thing and another. And that master was one of the masters who had taught my father. And in operating one of these plug keys I’d managed to disconnect some of the, some of the wires. And the master just looked at me and just sort of tut tutted and said, ‘Your father would never have done that.’ Which you know, it was a little embarrassing at the time but you get on with it. But it was only things like that I think which made you realise that the war had had an effect. Then of course towards the end of my Grammar School career a number of the teachers who had been away on war service were coming back and the older ones took well-earned retirement. Not something which you would tend to think about until later on when you look back and you think, oh I wonder why that happened? And then as you get older yourself you realise why these things happened. It’s not, not something that you think about a lot but when you do think about it, it all comes back. Yeah.
JS: Do you have any recollection of the atmosphere on the day the war ended and the immediate aftermath of the war ending? Can you remember, were there were celebrations in your street? Can you remember your family saying anything or general air at school of relief?
KH: Not really. Again, it was something that yes there were celebrations in the city quite clearly. But as a youngster, bearing in mind what, I’d be only ten or eleven when the war ended. It wasn’t the sort of thing that you got involved in very much. It was, you weren’t old enough in those days. A ten year old or an eleven year old was still regarded as a child. Unlike nowadays where they tend to be treated as semi-adults. But so, yes there were celebrations and yes a sense of great relief and the hopes that everybody would come home safe. Which, you know was important but not something which as a youngster really impacted on you. I think obviously it would impact on my mother and my grandparents on both sides because not only was my father in, in the Royal Air Force but one of his younger, his youngest sister was also in in the WAAF. So that you know the family I think were a case of well, great relief when they both came home safe and sound. So yes there was a sense of relief and, but as a youngster it perhaps doesn’t penetrate the consciousness in quite the same way as it does as you’re older. But as a family my, we had sort of my paternal grandfather as I say was in Mesopotamia in the First World War. My uncle, my mother’s older brother had been in the Durham Light Infantry between the wars and strangely enough very much like his father he couldn’t go back in to the Army at the beginning of the Second World War because he’d become an employee of the Ministry of Agriculture which was a Reserved Occupation and although the Durham Light Infantry wanted him back he couldn’t go back. So he took it on himself to get involved with the Army Cadet Corps and he ran the Army Cadet Corps in the city for a number of years. Even after the war. Until I think he got to an age where he was voluntarily retired. But it was something which again we, we just took on board. It was part of parcel of, of what we were doing. In much the same way as my grandfather because he had allotments and whatnot could supply friends and family with, with fresh, fresh veg and so on. And also, I think, I know we used to sell apples from the door and presumably what was raised from those went to, went to charities or went to support the, probably went to support the Army Cadet Force I would think because my uncle was so involved in it. These are odd little things which you think about if, you know if you sit down and put your thinking cap on.
JS: And you said after your father was demobbed he came home in his demob suit.
KH: Oh. Yes. Of course all Service personnel got a demob suit. And the one thing that I do remember was that it was a brown suit which was most odd because going back into the bank I don’t think he would wear a brown suit in the bank. Not in those days. Banking was very much more formal than it is now. In fact, I think if my father was still alive and was still involved in banking he’d be horrified at some of the things that happen. One of those things. But yeah. The, the demob set up is a little bit different then I think from when I came out. I mean I had to sign the Official Secrets Act of course when I, when I signed on, and again I had to sign it again at the time I was demobbed. But I spent my three years at RAF Innsworth as part of the Record Office where I was working in the Stats Section until I was seconded to the Home Command Coronation Unit which in fact happened to be based at Innsworth. And we did all our training on one of the local airfields which I believe is now a civil airfield which was RAF Staverton at that time. And we eventually, having completed our training ended up in Kensington Gardens under canvas for the actual Coronation. And of course Coronation Day was a dreadful day weather wise but we were fortunate. Our section of the route lining force were in the Haymarket. And the Haymarket in London in those days was two way traffic and it had islands down the centre. And I was on the edge of the road in the middle of one of these islands and the royal coach came past my side of the island and the outriders that are normally alongside the coach during the procession because of the narrowness of the road had to go in front and behind. And as the coach passed me Phillip must have said something to Her Majesty and she turned to speak to him and I have a photographic memory of seeing her turn towards Phillip. So I had a full face view of the Queen on the day of her Coronation. Granted, around the barrel of a 303 but still something that one never forgets. And that, that night or that afternoon after we’d got back to Kensington Gardens I think it must be the only time that the Royal Air Force had issued the men with a rum ration. It had been such a dreadful day that we were all taken to the mess tent and dished out with a tot of rum. And that evening three of us went off into, into London because up ‘til that point we hadn’t been allowed out of Kensington gardens. But we went to look at the fireworks and we went down to Buckingham palace to see the royal family and their guests going off to the ball at Hampton court. And because we’d been trained in crowd control as part of our Coronation training we were able to link up with the police to control the crowds outside Buckingham Palace that night. And again something which I didn’t discover until I was married and talking to my wife about the Coronation in London and had discovered that she had been in London with her uncle and aunt and they had been at Buckingham palace on that night. Although obviously neither of us knew the other but we were both there at the same time. Strange coincidence. But we, after we’d seen some of the fireworks on the Embankment we were looking for a drink and all the pubs of course were packed out to the doors as you could imagine. And eventually we looked through the doors of one pub and somebody seeing three RAF uniforms it was like a tidal wave. The crowd opened up to the bar and we were given straight access to the bar and I don’t think we bought a drink for ourselves the rest of that night. One of those things where you know men in uniform in those days were regarded with consideration and there wasn’t any of the problems that sadly we have now where men are told not to wear uniform when they go into towns and so on. Which is, I think very, very sad because the armed forces now and then do a remarkable job in protecting what we have in a democratic country. And it’s sad that men in uniform have got to be told to, not to go in to towns in their, in their uniforms. Although I’ve got to see we do see some uniforms in Andover which we still, it’s not the garrison town that it once was but there are still quite a lot of Service personnel around and we do see some of them in town and nobody ever I’ve never come across anybody making any adverse comment on what I’ve seen in Andover. But I know it does happen in some places. Sad. Very sad.
JS: I expect your parents were hugely proud of you serving in the RAF. Did you ever speak to your father about your time there?
KH: Not, not specifically because the only thing was talking about the Coronation obviously because that was, that was something which you know happens once in a generation. But most of, most of the work that I was doing wasn’t something that you would, you would talk about. Alright you know I mentioned the Official Secrets Act and I was based in a section which dealt with personnel for all the RAF stations throughout the world by command. So you just didn’t talk about it because, well in those days there were so many different commands and obviously a lot more RAF bases throughout the world than there are now that it would have been impossible anyway to keep in mind what happened in any particular RAF camp in the Middle East, or the Far East or in Europe or wherever. But it, it would never have occurred to me to have discussed anything to do with that. It was something which wasn’t to be discussed even, even with my father. Yes. We’d talk about inconsequential things like guard duty and having, you know things like hearing the experiments with the after burners for jet engines which took place at a company called Rotol which was just up the road from RAF Innsworth. And also seeing some of the test flights of the, the RAF Javelin. The Gloster Javelin which was in its test flights was always supported by a Meteor. And seeing those two aircraft together made you realise how big the Javelin was. Because of course it was being built at Gloucester, in the factory on the outskirts of Gloucester which was not far from where the Record Office Unit was. So things like that. Yes. You could remember and you would talk about it. I would talk about with my father, you know because he’d obviously been involved with Lancasters and Manchesters, and I think it gave him a taste for flying because when he came out of the Royal Air Force he joined the Newcastle Aero Club and got his private pilot’s licence which, so that he flew Tiger Moths and Austers. And both my wife and I flew with him in the Tiger Moth. I can remember going to the Aero Club on one of their at home days when there had been all sorts of demonstrations and one thing and another and my dad had said to my wife, ‘Come on. I’ll take you up.’ And they went. They went up and flew out over, over the border country. Over North Northumberland and so on and it was, it was a very nice night.
SH: Very cold.
KH: And it was, yes. As my wife just said, very cold. And it must have been quite light up there but it was getting quite dark on the ground and I can remember the flight engineer who was a very, very good pilot himself standing on the grass outside, outside the hangars striking matches as my dad came down. That was, that was quite amusing. Yeah. So we maintained a contact with flying although I never had the opportunity or the time to get a pilot’s licence myself. But I do remember flying with my dad on several occasions when I was at home from university. Yeah. Yeah. Strange. Strange how things have a knock on effect because although my father’s uncle was one of the early members of the Newcastle Aero Club I don’t think there had been any thought of my dad getting involved until he came out of the Royal Air Force. One of those things. But yeah.
JS: You say you kept up that connection with flying. Did he keep up any connections in terms of any Associations? Did he meet up with people he’d served with? They were quite a fluid bunch as I imagine in various parts of the country.
KH: You see, I think there was only one person that he ever sort of had contact with after he came out of the forces. See the Royal Air Force is rather different from the Army, for example where in the Army you move as a regiment or as a section of a regiment. So that you have that connection with a bunch of chaps or girls who are together as a unit. In the Royal Air Force there’s a subtle difference between the aircrew and the ground crew. The aircrew will move with the Squadron. The ground crew tend to move as individuals between units because they, they are posted. And I know this from my RAF experience myself in the Record Office. They are posted as individuals to, to a unit. To an RAF station. They’re not posted to a Squadron like they were during the war. But even during the war as exemplified by the fact that although my dad was posted to 97 Squadron and was based at Woodhall Spa when 97 Squadron moved out it was only the 97 Squadron aircraft and aircrew that moved out. The ground crew remained there. And that’s how my father came to serve with 617. Because 617s ground crew would remain at Scampton. That’s the difference. So that you don’t have that sort of ongoing connection except as aircrew. I mean, you talk, if you talked to people who have been aircrew and we’ve got a near neighbour who was in the Royal Air Force and he still goes. He was a, he flew helicopters and various things. And he still has Squadron reunions. But I think that’s the difference. Understandable when you know how the, you know sort of how the system works. I don’t know about the Navy although my niece has just retired as a naval officer. I don’t know. They, they are sort of posted to ships more or less. So I think the navy and the Royal Air Force have a similar —
JS: System.
KH: A similar sort of system. Unlike, unlike the Army and probably the Royal Marines.
JS: And he didn’t discuss the war much?
KH: No.
JS: In the years that followed it. He went back to working at the bank as you said.
KH: Yes.
JS: Because he felt he owed them that because they had released him to go.
KH: Yes.
JS: And he stayed working in Durham.
KH: He stayed in Durham. He, he for a short while he was moved to Bishop Auckland which is about twelve, twelve or fifteen miles outside the city. He moved to Lloyds Bank there for a short while but didn’t move out of the city because it was within easy travelling distance. So, yes he remained at Lloyds Bank in Durham until he, until he retired. Yes. He became a sub manager at one of the sub branches of the city but it was a sub-branch in one of the mining villages. So it was not a case of having to move. So we, as a family we remained in the city and I only left the city when I joined the Royal Air Force myself and then when I went to university and then, you know that sort of broke the, broke the connection although after, after we were married because my wife and I were married in the city in our parish church and after having lived in the East Midlands we moved back to the North East but not to the city because I was then working in Newcastle. So it was only my parents who remained in in the city and they both remained there until they died.
JS: And you lost your father at quite a young age, didn’t you?
KH: My father. Yes. He died very very suddenly when he was only fifty nine. Which was a great shock. Particularly as, or within, within the previous fortnight he’d had a full flying medical and passed. Passed his full flying medical and then had a massive heart attack within a fortnight. So it was, that was quite a, quite a shock for all of us.
JS: For all of you. Yeah.
KH: And at that time my sister was in, was living in Australia because her husband was a civil engineer and he was working out there and so, she wasn’t here when he died.
JS: And your sister’s name you told me was Ann.
KH: My sister was Ann.
JS: Ann. Yeah. And your mother’s name for the record.
KH: My mother’s name was Hilda.
JS: Hilda. That’s right.
KH: Her maiden name was Lambeth. L A M B E T H. And that is my middle name.
JS: Ok. And she stayed in the city, did she?
KH: She stayed in the city. She remained in the family home that was bought. That they bought after the war when my father was demobbed and until she eventually went into Sherman House Hospital which was a Church of England Old People’s Home which was where she died after having, having had a series of strokes unfortunately.
JS: And you did give me the address of the family home at the time.
KH: The family home that was bought after the war was 24 Church Street Head. Church Street having been split into two sections, Church Street proper which ended where, just above St Oswald’s Church which was our parish church and the parish church. The infant school which was attached to the parish church that was sort of the dividing line. Up to that point it was Church Street and from there up to the crossroads at the top it was Church Street Head. One of those peculiar things that you get in cities where one street has two sections.
JS: Yeah.
KH: Yeah. It was, in those days it was basically on the outskirts of the city and just beyond the road that ran across at the crossroads there was the university. One of the university science colleges there. But beyond, but that was quite small. And beyond that were woods that, the woods which surround the city and a lot of that land was owned by the university because the majority of the land around Durham City was owned either by the university or the Cathedral, and all that land now is occupied by new colleges. There are one, two, three, four. At least four colleges now on the south side of the city. No five. Because there was a female college opened. That was the first one to be opened just after the war and it was opened by the Queen when she was Princess Elizabeth. So there are all those colleges now are built on what were woods and fields. It’s quite, quite an alteration. And I haven’t lived in the city since 1961, and, and I’m quite certain that there have been a lot more alterations since. Well, I knew the city obviously beyond ’61. I didn’t live in the city after ’61 but obviously my mother and father did. So until we moved south in 2000 I was in and out of, in and out of the city so I know what developments went, went on up to the beginning of the current century but what’s gone on in since then is anybody’s guess from my point of view. Obviously there must have been a lot more development but —
JS: Yeah.
KH: Not that I’m aware of.
JS: Places change don’t they? Yeah. Right. Well, that’s really comprehensive. Thank you very much for all that for your time in, and your patience in talking to me about that. Is there anything else that you can think that you would like us to say for the record given that it is a Digital Archive. Was there anything that you would like to say? Anything you can think of now or any comments that you would like to make?
KH: Not really. Except, the only thing that I would say is that I feel that it is vitally important that what the likes of my parents, my wife’s parents and their generation what they did for this country should never ever be forgotten. And the generations that come up it should be made quite clear to them why we are still a free country. And they should never assume that things will just drop into their lap. Everything that is worth anything has to be fought for and cherished. Those are the things that I think are sometimes lacking in the teachings now of the youngsters coming up like, like our granddaughter. I mean our two children when they were at school were taught a certain amount of history and in fact, it’s quite amusing. They came home on one occasion and we, we discovered that they were being taught the details of the ‘39/45 war as history. So we decided as parents that we weren’t just parents we were history. But you know, that was, that’s the lighter side of it. But I think seriously the current young generation I don’t think they’re taught the history. Not just what happened in two world wars although obviously they’re getting a lot about the First World War just at the moment but I think, you know some of the so called ancient history of this country on which a lot of our civil rights are founded. A lot, a lot of that doesn’t seem to be taught anymore and I think that is very sad. And I think, you know the education system needs to be looked at in that respect because we can’t afford to lose our history because that is part of our identity. Alright. I might be pontificating a bit but I do feel fairly strongly about it and I wouldn’t want to be called a Little Englander but you know I think we need to be proud of Great Britain and ‘great’ being the important part of it.
JS: I don’t think many people will disagree with you. I think that’s absolutely a fair point. Well, again thank you very much. Thank you for your time and your patience and thank you to Sybil as well, your wife who is here with us. And I very much appreciated you taking the time
KH: I’m only too pleased to have been able to do it because I think it’s important that those of us who lived through the war should leave a record of what, what happened so as far as they’re concerned. And you know sadly the people who actually fought the war for us are becoming few and far between now so it’s only the likes of us who are now getting sort of towards the end of our active life as you might say you know we’re the only ones who perhaps have a memory of it. And if those memories disappear a bit like the, some of the memories of the First World War which have just disappeared and only been found by archaeologists and things like that. Because there was no such things as digital recordings.
JS: No. No.
KH: Which is what we’ve got now.
JS: No. We’re fortunate to have the tools now at our disposal and that’s what the Digital Archive is all about.
KH: Yeah.
JS: Which is keeping those memories alive and keeping that message alive
KH: Yeah.
JS: So that, so what you’ve done for us today is really important.
KH: I’m pleased.
JS: So thank you very much both of you.
SH: It’s ok.
KH: Pleased to help.
JS: Thank you.
KH: Really pleased to help. Thanks
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Interview with Ken Hayton
Creator
An entity primarily responsible for making the resource
Joyce Sharland
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2017-10-04
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
The nature or genre of the resource
Sound
Identifier
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AHaytonK171004, PHaytonK1701
Format
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00:59:30 audio recording
Language
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eng
Coverage
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Civilian
Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Second generation
Spatial Coverage
Spatial characteristics of the resource.
Great Britain
England--Durham (County)
England--Gloucestershire
England--Lincolnshire
England--Tyne and Wear
England--Yorkshire
England--Durham
England--London
England--Newcastle upon Tyne
England--Sunderland (Tyne and Wear)
Description
An account of the resource
Ken Hayton’s father, George Stanley Hayton (Stan), worked worked for Lloyds Bank. In 1940 Stan left his post to join the Royal Air Force; Ken recalled going to Durham station to see his father off, travelling to start basic training at RAF Padgate. Ken believes his father completed his training as a fitter armourer at RAF Lytham before joining 97 Squadron at RAF Woodhall Spa. When 617 Squadron replaced 97 Squadron, Ken remained and was involved in bombing up 617 Squadron aircraft ahead of the Dambuster operation. Stan was sent to help with the clear up of a Lancaster crash on land near a bomb dump and for the rest of his life he could not stand the smell of lamb being cooked. Towards the end of the war Stan was posted to RAF Riccall where he prepared redundant .303 browning aircraft guns for storage, he was finally demobbed from RAF Waddington in 1945 and returned to Lloyds Bank where he remained until retirement. After the war Stan trained for his private pilot license at Newcastle Aero Club and took both Ken and his mother flying in the club’s Tiger Moth.
Ken describes his schoolboy life in Durham, including leaving the Anderson Shelter one evening and watching searchlights scanning the sky over Sunderland. One bombing on Durham was shortly after Coventry had been bombed: the mist rose from the river and shrouded the city, with local folklore being St Cuthbert protecting the Cathedral. During his father’s service at RAF Woodhall Spa, Ken recalled travelling there with his mother from Durham by train and seeing extensive bomb damage to York railway station. Ken served three years in the RAF, posted to RAF Insworth a non-flying RAF station where the RAF Records Section was based, transferring to the Coronation Unit for training ahead of the ceremony in 1953. He recalled route lining in the Haymarket, due to the narrowing of the road he was very close to the Queen’s coach and in the evening went to Buckingham Palace and assisted the police with crowd control. Ken recalls watching The Dambusters film with his father in 1955 and his father commenting on the accuracy of the film.
Temporal Coverage
Temporal characteristics of the resource.
1940
1941
1942
1943
1943-05
1944
1945
1953
1954
1955
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Jim Sheach
Julie Williams
Conforms To
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Pending revision of OH transcription
617 Squadron
97 Squadron
bombing
childhood in wartime
crash
Eder Möhne and Sorpe operation (16–17 May 1943)
ground personnel
Lancaster
RAF Innsworth
RAF Padgate
RAF Riccall
RAF Waddington
RAF Woodhall Spa
searchlight
shelter
superstition
Tiger Moth
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/818/10801/PFearnsH1701.2.jpg
8507b318fd85683be6792d3505bbeccd
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/818/10801/AFearnsH170724.1.mp3
ce8cfbef19c41548e6c2de7fa30a072a
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
A name given to the resource
Fearns, Harry
H Fearns
Description
An account of the resource
11 items. An oral history interview with Sergeant Harry Fearns (b. 1925, 1591683 Royal Air Force), seven photographs, his service badges and identity card. He flew operations as a flight engineer with 100 and 97 Squadrons.
The collection has been loaned to the IBCC Digital Archive for digitisation by Harry Fearns and catalogued by Barry Hunter.
Publisher
An entity responsible for making the resource available
IBCC Digital Archive
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2017-07-24
Rights
Information about rights held in and over the resource
This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
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Fearns, H
Transcribed audio recording
A resource consisting primarily of recorded human voice.
Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
BW: This is Brian Wright interviewing Sergeant Harry Fearns at 2.15 on Monday 24th of July 2017 at his home near Bury, Greater Manchester. Also with us is his daughter, Gillian Bailey. Harry, if I can start off with some straightforward questions for you, please. Can you tell me your date of birth, where you, and where you were born?
HF: Date of birth was 24 1 25.
BW: 24th of January 1925.
HF: Correct.
BW: And how many were there in your family? Did you have any brothers and sisters?
HF: Yes. There were six of us.
BW: How many brothers and sisters did you have in —?
HF: Well, I’ll start at, I was the eldest. There was Harry, Gordon, Joyce, Margaret. Was that my six? That sounds about right.
BW: That’s four.
HF: Four.
BW: There were two more.
HF: Oh.
GB: John. Brother, John.
HF: Oh yes, John.
GB: And Kathleen.
HF: And Kathleen.
BW: And what was, what was family life like? Where were you growing up at this time? Were you in Bury or were you, were you born elsewhere in the country?
HF: No. I was born in South Yorkshire.
BW: Ok. Whereabouts in South Yorkshire.
HF: In a little house [unclear] Barnsley.
BW: Barnsley. Ok.
HF: West Middleton, near Rotherham. But we always talked about Barnsley being the leading place not, not Rotherham.
BW: So, you were close to Barnsley.
HF: Yes.
BW: And where did you go to school?
HF: Wath on Dearne Grammar School.
BW: How do you —
HF: Wath upon, U P O N
BW: Wath upon —
HF: Wath. Separate word, upon. Upon.
BW: Wath upen?
HF: Dearne.
GB: Wath upon Dearne. So, it’s W A T H —
HF: D E A R.
GB: Upon-D E A R N E.
BW: Right. I haven’t heard of that. That’s [pause] Wath upon Dearne.
HF: Nice little place.
BW: Was it a bit of a village?
HF: It was a mining village really.
BW: And what did your dad do? Was he a miner?
HF: A miner.
BW: What about your mum?
HF: Too busy with the family to have any work.
BW: So, your dad was the worker and your mum looked after the rest of you.
HF: That’s it.
BW: And what was, what was your school like?
HF: Well, for the year, typical Wath, typical Grammar School.
BW: So, you went to a Grammar School then.
HF: Yes.
BW: And what age did you leave? You would be fourteen? Or was it after that?
HF: Sixteen. I left and I went to work for the Prudential Insurance Company. At the same time I applied to be in the RAF and of course that was about [pause] 1944. So, obviously that was during the war years.
BW: And what prompted you to join the RAF?
HF: I really wanted. I don’t know how I’d describe it.
GB: But you told me you’d always wanted to fly.
HF: Well, yes. That could be summed up.
BW: And did you want to be a pilot or a navigator or did you want to be say a gunner or or other crew member?
HF: Well, like those in reduced order.
BW: Ok.
HF: Pilot first. Navigator second. Engineer. Then a navigator err air gunner.
BW: And when you went for the interviews did you tell them that you wanted to be a pilot? What happened?
HF: Oh yeah.
BW: What happened so that you, you ended up as flight engineer?
HF: I think what one can say is that they’d got enough at that time. They hadn’t lost enough, putting it crudely. So, it depended what was available when we were called for to be signed on.
BW: So, you were working for Prudential Insurance at this time. Were you? What sort of position were you in the, in the company?
HF: Just a rent collector. Well, not so much rent. A collector of premiums.
BW: And the war had been going on a few years at this point can you recall at that time did it feel like it was coming to an end or that it was going to continue longer than it did?
HF: We thought it was coming to an end. Thought we were helping. All the flying and the fighting. Not that I did any fighting but [laughs]
BW: Did you join up with any friends?
HF: Not exactly friends but certainly some of my old, my pals went around about the same time.
BW: And you’d had an ambition to fly. What [pause] I’m trying to understand whether you and your friends perhaps wanted to get some action before you joined up or whether it was more that you’d heard a lot of the RAF and what it was doing.
HF: I think it’s the latter. You know, we just wanted to fly. We didn’t particularly want to shoot any guns or —
BW: And where, where did you start your training? Do you remember?
HF: St Johns Wood, London.
BW: And what was it like? Was it what you expected it to be?
HF: I thought it was great. We used to march from [pause] I’ve just forgotten the the place where we were sleeping. Something Court. And we used to have PT and exercises early in the morning. Then we did some studies. You might do an hour navigation, an hour generally but have to early on [pause] what was I about to say? [pause] Yeah. We moved on some of our exercises. We went in to Lord’s Cricket Ground. Marching up and down at Lords and doing sort of [pause] after about two months of that they farmed us out and in my particular case was to an aircrew training establishment at Newquay, Cornwall. Have you come across it?
BW: That’s quite a way away.
HF: It was.
BW: From London. It’s a good —
HF: Yeah.
BW: Hundred miles.
HF: But they needed, afterwards you realised they were, that near the end of the war they wanted to get rid of at least accommodation belonging to private people, I suppose. And as soon as they could get rid of the larger establishments then they got rid of places like Newquay. For example, the one after that we went to was Stormy Down in Glamorgan. Porthcawl. That’s the place it was near.
BW: Porthcawl.
HF: Yeah.
BW: It’s a lot easier to get from Newquay to Porthcawl then it is from Newquay to London.
HF: Yeah. Yeah. I read that.
BW: And so you were going through your basic training at this stage.
HF: Yes. This time.
BW: Whereabouts did you do your engineering training? Was that at Stormy Down?
HF: No. St Athan School of Technical Training. Massive place.
BW: Do you recall how long you were there?
HF: No. I would have thought it was about an hour err an hour, a year because they kept stopping as they found out, presumably found out that there were staff they didn’t need they moved them on. On to the next stage and the facilities would be left for some chaps behind. They would spend most of their time playing football.
BW: And so you were training at St Athan. It says, is it Number 4 School of Technical Training? Or trade training.
HF: Something like that. Is it on there.
BW: Yeah. It’s there.
HF: Oh, it’s there [laughs]
BW: And according to your logbook you got sixty five point two percent.
HF: Yeah.
BW: And you trained on Lancaster 1s and Mark 3s.
HF: Yes.
BW: Were they 1s or was that a type of aircraft that you selected to train on or were you —
HF: Oh no.
BW: Directed on to —
HF: You will go.
BW: And how did you feel about that? Being put on Lancasters.
HF: Perhaps relieved that we were not a gunner. An air gunner. It was interesting at the time.
BW: And it looks from your time of joining up to the time of finishing the course at St Athan that the war had actually ended during that time.
HF: That’s about right. Yes.
BW: What can you recall of that? That time? Were there, did you still feel like there was a role for you now that the war had ended or did you feel a bit surplus perhaps?
HF: No. I think we, it’s better to be moved to the southeast and fighting the Japs there. And the aircraft you saw were different to the two colour system. They were, and they had an idea was to give them some protection from other aircraft. Other aircraft attacking you. So, in fact the aircraft that you showed was the Lancaster 1 FE, Far East.
BW: And so it, was it a particular type or version of the Mark 1 that was dedicated for Far East service? Is that why it was called a Lancaster 1FE?
HF: Not really it was just, it was planes they took into the hangars and made adaptations. I couldn’t remember exactly which they gave us. Except obviously, the F, the FE bit.
BW: So, you left St Athan and I think you went to an OCU. An Operational Conversion Unit. And that was 230 OCU at Lindholme.
HF: Ah, yes. Yeah.
BW: And it, it shows from your logbook you starting there in 1947. What do you recall of Lindholme at that time?
HF: Typical Bomber Command plane. [pause] And we kept on doing the same job and by then for a time passed to Lindholme which was virtually mixed in next door to Finningley. And Lindholme, my main recollection of Lindholme was in nineteen, February I think it is, ’47 and the big freeze. We spent loads of time with shovels getting the ice and snow off the runways.
BW: So [laughs] so you joined up to fly and there you were on the runway.
HF: That’s it.
BW: With your spade.
HF: Yeah.
BW: Shovelling snow. At these OCUs it was common for the different trades to get together and form a crew. Can you recall how that happened for you? How you met your other crew mates?
HF: I can remember it. I remember it plain as anything. That we all went in a hangar and they called out, you know, ‘Joe. Joe Smith.’ These, they’d be the skippers, pilots would be called in and they’d say, ‘Right. Pick your navigator. Pick your engineer.’ And eventually build the crew.
BW: So, it sounds fairly similar to what they were doing actually in the war years. Putting them in a hangar and telling them to sort themselves out.
HF: Yeah.
BW: So, you wouldn’t necessarily, did you meet your pilot first or did you meet other crew mates first and then decide which pilot you wanted? Or did the pilot kind of choose you? Or —
HF: I can’t remember whether I was selected or what was left sort of thing.
BW: And what can you recall of your crew mates?
HF: I can’t explain really. Didn’t see a lot of one another except when we were flying.
BW: Were you not billeted together as a crew?
HF: Subject to rank, yes.
BW: So were you all NCOs or was one of —
HF: Well, no. One —
BW: One or two officers.
HF: What did you call him? Leicester? Register. Mike Register. I remember him. He definitely, he got in to the officer’s mess. And we, in other words the sergeants and flight sergeants we’d go in the NCOs mess.
BW: Do you remember how many of you were? Were NCOs? Was there only one officer? Was, was he the pilot? Presumably he was the pilot.
HF: He was. Mike Register.
BW: Yeah.
HF: And the navigator. Scott somebody. I can’t remember his name. He might be in here somewhere.
BW: And did you keep, when you were billeted were you billeted as NCOs or were you in some cases they were by trade. So the gunners would be kept together and so on but that doesn’t seem to have happened with you.
HF: No. It didn’t.
BW: So, you were all mixed trades but still in the NCOs—
HF: Yes.
BW: In the NCOs mess. From your logbook when you were on the OCU do you remember any sorties at that particular time? Any incidents during your, sort of training together?
[pause]
HF: No. I can’t.
BW: Ok. You moved from there I think, to 100 Squadron.
HF: Was that at Hemswell, as well?
BW: And they were as I think you say at Hemswell. But you converted when you joined the squadron. You converted to Lincolns.
HF: Yeah. Well —
BW: Instead of the Lancasters.
HF: Yes.
BW: Can you recall what —
HF: The passage of time. The Lincoln was a bit bigger.
BW: How would you compare it to a Lancaster? Did you have a favourite between the two?
HF: Oh yes. The old Lanc couldn’t be beaten in that respect.
BW: And how did the Lincoln differ from an engineer’s point of view?
HF: It seemed altogether quite efficient. Difficult to explain what it might be for the rest, all the crew and the different engines and things like that. But we had fewer, fewer mistakes. We didn’t have any crashes which was a surprise really.
BW: But having flown Lincolns you preferred the Lancasters still.
HF: Definitely.
BW: Did you notice any particular difference between the Mark 1 and the Mark 3 at all?
HF: 3.
BW: Was there anything notable?
[pause]
HF: No. All I think it was was a larger engine.
BW: And when it came to you actually preparing to carry out a sortie what would you as a flight engineer be doing? Can you recall what kind of things? What kind of steps you would be taking to prepare yourself and then carry out the sortie?
[pause]
HF: You’d check that the, the aircraft site you’d got, that they’d allocated to you, you’d be like, you’d like it so that that to be one as it were you had flown before but nevertheless you used to go out to the [pause] I’ve forgotten the name of the place where the planes were dumped.
BW: Dispersal.
HF: Dispersal. Thank you [laughs] You’d go out to your dispersal and as it were meet your aircraft. See this chief of the engineers. Yeah. And sort yourself with any, any problems there might be. And equally, the engineer would keep an eye on me as a flight engineer often looking down on them because they thought that the flyers were having an easy time.
BW: So even though you were perhaps taking more of a risk as air crew because you would be awarded flying pay in your, in your salary the engineers on the ground still looked down at you because you were not seen perhaps as proper engineers.
HF: Certainly, the chief engineers felt that.
BW: Had any of them flown do you know? Had any of the chief engineers been aircrew at all and then taken a ground job?
HF: No.
BW: So, they didn’t really know what risks you were taking then.
HF: Well, the stories one hears.
BW: You mentioned just before that when you were allocated an aircraft you always hoped to get one that you had flown before and it seems from from that and from your logbook you didn’t have a regular aircraft that you were allocated. Was there a favourite one or a particular one that you felt more comfortable with or was better for you and why would that be?
HF: Well, in a way they would all be the same because for example, you were coming up in the size of the Lincoln 1FE then what are the chances all of you would be on the higher plane? So, they were not all the same.
BW: At 100 Squadron there had been four or five Lancasters on the squadrons books that had flown over a hundred missions in the war. Were they still there at the time do you recall or had they been retired by that point?
HF: I don’t know. I can’t remember that.
BW: Were there any aircraft still there that had maybe war markings on them? Say the number of bomb sorties that they’d, you know sort of, bomb symbols to indicate the number of missions.
HF: They had. They had. I remember one or two like that but I can’t remember which they are.
BW: Did you try and avoid those at all?
HF: No [laughs] Well, the fighting was over then so we relaxed in some ways.
BW: So, you’ve been driven out to dispersal and you’ve had a look around the aircraft and a hand over’s taken place. Can you remember what you would then be doing as flight engineer once you get in the aircraft and you’re walking up or clambering over the main spar to get up to the flight engineer’s position? What kind of things would be on your list to do?
HF: Well, you get to know the aircraft which you know you probably hadn’t seen all that much in spite of the training.
GB: But did you have little checks that you had to do like checking dials or levers?
HF: Oh yes. That, by it’s —
GB: What would you have to do?
HF: Well, first of all you’d walk around the aircraft from the outside and check all the places that you can get at. When you’d done that you go inside the aircraft and check the things that were the responsibility of the engineer. For example, you wouldn’t interfere with the navigator and he wouldn’t interfere with your job. Should be. And once they were satisfied that the aircraft was serviceable then off you’d go on some exercise.
GB: Did you have to write anything down though? As a flight engineer did you have to check certain things and say yes that’s safe. Yes, that’s, did you have anything like that?
HF: Yeah. We did to some extent.
GB: And so what —
HF: I can’t remember them though [pause]
GB: Yeah.
BW: The flight engineer’s position in a Lancaster you’re almost off the, just off the right shoulder of the, of the pilot.
HF: Yeah.
BW: Was that any different in the Lincoln?
HF: No. No.
BW: So, you were in the same position whichever aircraft you flew and —
HF: Yes, I’d been certainly.
BW: And can you recall what you would be doing? Would you have to help the pilot during take-off or anything like that?
HF: Yes.
BW: What would you do?
HF: You’d be, bear in mind this is an aircraft, quite a largish one to us then and we’d got to get it flying. So you’re checking with the pilot on all his checks as well. Calling back to one another until you got ready for flying. In the meantime, we taxied out to the edge of the airport and off you go. Then the navigator would to some extent take over to put down where you were going to go to and see some of these on here.
BW: And there’s a mix in your logbook of day sorties and night sorties as well. And even on your first one I think air to sea firing on the first —
HF: Yes.
BW: Sortie there. So presumably you were out over the North Sea.
HF: Yes. Yes.
BW: And what were your night time sorties like?
HF: Boring [pause] We just had to do our exercise which probably lasted five hours or something like that. These long exercises were in many ways more interesting than the short ones.
BW: And you’d still be carrying out fighter affiliation or bombing exercises even though the war had finished.
HF: Yes.
BW: Did they brief you as to what your sort of longer term role was? Bearing in mind that Germany had been defeated and by this stage, 1947 the war with Japan had long been over as well. Did they, although you are still carrying out, let’s say typical training sorties that were appropriate to wartime did they give, did you get a sense of what your purpose was in the immediate post-war years? What your role was?
HF: I’ve no recollection of that. We were doing odd jobs back at Hemswell and Scampton hoping one day we’d go somewhere interesting. But what happened is that a high percentage of the blokes who had done their time, their Service and went back to Civvy Street and we probably wouldn’t see them again.
BW: Were you able to meet or interact with any of the veterans? And I say veterans, from those who had been on missions over Germany while you were on the squadron. You were fairly new. Were you able to meet any of those who’d been on the squadron and were being demobbed after wartime service?
HF: I thought we would have but I can’t remember any.
BW: When you look back at some of the missions or the sorties that you were tasked what can you recall of them? Are there any memorable ones that, that you can recall from there?
HF: I don’t think there were any real interesting memorable ones at all. You probably saw some of the air sea, air to sea firing [laughs] and dropping bombs in the Wash and things like that.
BW: Can you recall what the targets were in the Wash? Were they perhaps disused ships or were they —
HF: I think they were disused ships. Certainly made to look like ships. There’s an interesting one. Four hours familiarisation flying and three engine flying. Three engines, had obviously had some trouble in one of them and had come out of order so we were flying back on three which was no problem on a big plane.
BW: Did that happen often for you? Did you practice it?
HF: Yes. Oh, yes.
BW: And as an engineer can you recall any particular steps you had to take or difficulties involved in flying with only one engine on, available on one wing and two on the other because you’ve got double to power on.
HF: Yeah.
BW: What kind of problems would that cause you?
HF: Well, the main thing was trying to keep the power up on the other three to balance on the one that was out of order. And seeing as there was no bombs, no problems. We were, almost enjoyed it.
BW: And of course you weren’t, you had the advantage of not being shot at.
HF: True [laughs]
BW: There’s one note in here about Naval exercise. Presumably you’d coordinate with the Navy at some point.
HF: Yeah. I imagine so. I can’t remember it.
BW: And another one there where you’ve got noted power plant in the bomb bay.
HF: Ah, now there was a base near, in Egypt and they were reliable on us in Britain for their maintenance more and wanted a Lancaster to fly out in its bomb bays and then come back of course with the defective engine. And that was for some reason they sent me as engineer there. But planting the bomb bay, you know obviously then brought the bomb bay back, brought the bomb back with us. Have to confirm that.
BW: And there’s a few cross-country flights.
HF: Yes. [laughs]
BW: Pamphlet dropping. And air sea rescue.
HF: Over Lancashire and places like that.
GB: What was the pamphlet dropping, dad? What were you doing?
HF: This was just after the war to keep people cheered up.
BW: All your exercises, or all your sorties are going around the UK. There aren’t any recorded for going overseas except one which we see here going to —
HF: [unclear] just in to.
BW: Saint Quentin.
HF: Germany. Yeah.
BW: Saarbrücken.
HF: Saarbrücken. Yeah. [ Benebruck. Benebruck?]
BW: Osnabruck.
HF: Osnabruck, is it? Yes. So, it is.
BW: That looks like your first time over, over Germany.
HF: Yeah. It probably is.
BW: Can you recall anything about that particular one?
HF: I can’t. No.
[pause]
BW: This one sounds an interesting one. In fact, there’s two. This is late November 1947 and one daylight sortie is formation and fighter affiliation and the other is low level cross country. So which was that? Formation and fighter affil.
HF: Fighter affiliation. Yeah.
BW: Oh that. Yeah.
HF: And then a day or two after low level cross country.
BW: What did it feel like? Flying at low level.
HF: Great. Super it was.
BW: Were there any height restrictions at that particular time?
HF: Yes, I’m sure there were. I can’t remember. I can’t remember anything special about it.
BW: I think they might have been a lot more relaxed then they were. Than they are now.
HF: Yes. A combination of both. Of being relaxed and being bored.
BW: Was a Lincoln alright to handle at low level?
HF: Yes. Oh yes [pause] How’s that for a long flight? Scampton. Ten. Ten minutes [laughs]
[pause]
BW: So, by this stage late 1947 your time on 100 Squadron appears to be coming to an end and I believe you joined 97 Squadron after that. Can you remember?
HF: Yes, I was there for a month or two. I don’t remember a lot about it. Of course, if we were in the right places it was quite famous.
BW: It had been a Pathfinder Squadron.
HF: That’s right. Yeah.
BW: At one time.
HF: Yeah.
BW: But there’s no record of any flights that you took with that, with that squadron.
HF: Not at all.
BW: No.
HF: Perhaps at that yeah. That time they wouldn’t have heard of us [unclear]
BW: Can you recall what your CO was like at 100 Squadron? Did you see much of him?
HF: No. I didn’t. Just made sure he had his salute if he passed you.
BW: What was the social life like in the RAF at this time?
HF: In our case we used to drive in to Lincoln for our social life. Any other direction if you look at your map you’ll find there’s nothing that way, nothing that way.
BW: Lincoln is the nearest big city, isn’t it? [pause] Did it feel any different for you having lived through the war years and the rationing and the blackouts and things was there a palpable difference when you were in the RAF and going into Lincoln let’s say for social events?
HF: No. I can’t say that there was.
BW: There’s a photograph here of you in uniform and it looks like you’re on, you’re on the seafront.
HF: It probably is Skegness or somewhere like that. Or Cleethorpes.
BW: Did you get much time off at all from from duties?
HF: Oh, yes.
BW: And did you socialise as a crew or did you have any particular other friends that you, you met up with in there for instance?
HF: Well, I would socialise. Yes. Not necessarily in the same crew, in fact. You know.
BW: And did you get to know any of the other crews?
HF: Yes. Must have done. Flying with them. But I can’t remember much about it.
BW: There’s another picture here.
HF: That’s a Lincoln, isn’t it?
BW: That’s a Lancaster.
HF: Is it?
BW: And it looks, there must be at least three of you in formation because you’re in one aircraft and there’s two others in the, in the picture. That must be when you’re at 100 Squadron.
GB: Can you remember taking that picture or did somebody else take it and give it to you, dad?
HF: I think the latter but I can’t remember. So —
BW: There’s another picture here which shows the other members of the crew and I’m guessing that that is the navigator who’s the officer. There.
HF: Oh, most certainly, yes. Yes.
BW: Second left.
HF: Yeah.
BW: And that’s by the rear turret of what must be a Lincoln.
HF: [unclear]
BW: Can you recall any of the people in the, in the photograph at all?
HF: Yeah. Sparky there. Willy, the wireless operator there. You mentioned the navigator.
BW: Think that’s him. Yeah. Isn’t it?
HF: In the middle.
BW: Second left.
HF: Flat cap.
BW: Yeah.
HF: Then me. Then the rear gunner. I must have missed somebody out because there’s another navigator there.
[pause]
BW: But none of their names come back to you.
HF: Every now and again. And there’s our navigator down in the, or our bomb aimer down on the floor.
BW: What happened to when you left 97 Squadron? Were you then demobbed? Was this the beginning of National Service? Were you then demobbed after that or did you continue in the RAF for a little while longer?
HF: No. I [pause] yes, I got demobbed or I took demob and that was either from [pause] what’s the place near Doncaster?
BW: Finningley. Finningley?
HF: No, the —
BW: Hemswell.
HF: Hemswell. Yeah. I can see it now. Going over Hemswell and then we signed up all our papers and what have you at Scampton. No. That was at Hemswell. And from Hemswell I was taken to Blackpool and released.
BW: Presumably that was Squires Gate. That’s where they had the big —
HF: Yes. That’s right.
BW: Big Reception Centre. And what happened from there? Did you have a job to go back to or did you just go home to South Yorkshire?
HF: Well, in the latter there was no job as such. I was accepted by the people I worked with at the time, the Prudential and started working there.
BW: And how long did you work —
HF: In Civvy Street.
BW: How long did you work for the Prudential for?
HF: Not long. One year. Two year.
BW: And what, what did you go on to do after that?
HF: Rent collecting.
BW: But not with the Prudential. With another company.
HF: No. Well, Prudential didn’t have many accommodation now for —
GB: So, it was the local council, was it that you —?
HF: It was the local council. Yeah.
GB: Council housing.
BW: And when, when did you get married?
[pause]
HF: About [pause] was it in nineteen —
GB: I remember it was in July. I don’t know which year though. I can’t remember. I wouldn’t. I don’t know.
HF: Well, well, well. I would have laid my money on her remembering that.
BW: Did you stay in South Yorkshire?
HF: Yes. For a couple of years. Then went to Harlow in Essex.
BW: What prompted you to move down there?
HF: Plenty of opportunity. They were building what, eight big towns. In the south mainly. So, I thought it would be best of new opportunities down there. And so I worked there. At some stage I moved up to Harlow in Essex and up to the east. To Doncaster, wasn’t it?
GB: No. After Harlow dad you moved up to Nuneaton because I was born in Harlow, wasn’t I? And we left Harlow in 1972 when you got that job as a housing manager.
HF: Yes.
GB: At Nuneaton Council.
HF: Oh, [unclear]
GB: The date sticks in my mind because that’s when I did my O levels and I remember —
HF: Yes.
GB: Us just moving up just after that.
HF: Oh aye.
BW: And then from there you obviously moved up to Manchester, or Greater Manchester.
HF: Well, that's by accident if anything.
GB: Yeah. It’s only a couple of years ago when dad —
HF: Yeah.
GB: Couldn’t live on his own anymore in Nuneaton.
BW: Yeah. Did you manage to keep in touch with any of your crew mates after, after leaving the RAF or did you just all go your separate ways?
HF: We all went our separate ways. I don’t remember any of them because we all got demobbed as it were in any number. You know, in our number but in my experience.
BW: You were demobbed individually.
HF: Yes.
GB: You know John Whitlock, in Harlow. He was in the RAF. Did you know him when you were in the RAF?
HF: No.
GB: So, you just met him in Harlow and he just happened to be in the RAF.
HF: Yes.
GB: Right.
BW: And the, how did you hear about the Memorial for Bomber Command?
HF: I was in RAFA, so you got all the bumph and publicity for some of the activities. And I remember going to Coningsby. To the, that’s not Bomber Command, is it? That’s —
BW: It was. It was a bomber base.
HF: Yeah. But since then.
GB: Are you thinking of the reunions of Project Propeller that you’ve been to occasionally?
HF: No. But that does come in to it though, love. Yeah. Did you know of that?
GB: Project Propeller is when local pilots take you to your reunions isn’t it?
HF: Yes. That’s sums it up.
BW: Have you managed to get to the Memorial site at Lincoln? At Canwick Hill.
HF: No.
BW: Or not.
HF: Is that where the new site is?
BW: That’s yeah. That’s where the new site is.
HF: Is that in Scampton?
BW: It’s not far from Scampton. It’s probably five or six miles. Something like that.
HF: Yeah. Towards Lincoln.
BW: Yes.
HF: Yeah.
BW: Yeah. Scampton’s just north of Lincoln isn’t it. So, as you, as you come south you actually go —
HF: What did you actually call it?
BW: Scampton. So, as you go towards the city and then go up the valley at the other side and that is Canwick Hill and that’s where the Memoria is.
HF: Oh right.
[pause]
BW: Well, I think I’ve gone through all the questions that I, that I had for you.
HF: Ok.
BW: So it just leaves me to say thank you very much for your time, Harry and thank you for doing the interview.
HF: Pleasure.
BW: Thank you very much.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Interview with Harry Fearns
Creator
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Brian Wright
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
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2017-07-24
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
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Sound
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AFearnsH170724, PFearnsH1701
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00:59:54 audio recording
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eng
Coverage
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
Description
An account of the resource
Harry Fearns was born and lived in Barnsley South Yorkshire. He left school at 16 and joined the Prudential Insurance Company as a door to door premiums collector before joining the Royal Air Force in 1944 as a flight engineer. Following initial training at St John’s Wood London and Newquay, Harry completed his training at RAF Stormy Down and RAF St Athan. During training he worked on Lancaster Mk1 and Mk3 aircraft being modified to operate in the Far East, although the war ended before Harry joined an operational squadron. Harry was posted to No 230 Operational Conversion Unit at RAF Lindholme in 1947 where his main recollection was clearing the runways of snow and ice during the very severe winter of 1946/7. From there he was posted to 100 Squadron at RAF Hemswell where he converted to Lincolns although he recalled a preference for the Lancaster. During 1947 the squadron carried out a number of night and daytime exercises, live firing and bombing range practices. After a short period with 97 Squadron, Harry was demobbed late in 1947 and returned to The Prudential Insurance Company before commencing a career in local housing.
Contributor
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Jim Sheach
Julie Williams
Spatial Coverage
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Great Britain
Wales--Bridgend
Wales--Vale of Glamorgan
England--Yorkshire
England--Lincolnshire
England--Cornwall (County)
Temporal Coverage
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1944
1945
1946
1947
Conforms To
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Pending revision of OH transcription
100 Squadron
97 Squadron
aircrew
flight engineer
Lancaster
Lancaster Mk 1
Lancaster Mk 3
Lincoln
RAF Hemswell
RAF Lindholme
RAF St Athan
RAF Stormy Down
Tiger force
training
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/497/10707/BCopusPJCopusPJv.1.pdf
3b4590afce6b1c8ba1a3d4a0cfb2e9a3
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Copus, Jim
P J Copus
Copus, James
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Identifier
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Copus, PJ
Description
An account of the resource
Nine items. Two oral history interviews with Warrant Officer Percy James Copus (1922 - 2016, 1430308 Royal Air Force) who flew operations as a mid-upper gunner with 97 Squadron. The collection also includes photographs of himself and family, and account and maps of his last operation of the 27 March 1943 on Frankfurt, when his Lancaster was shot down and he became a prisoner of war.
The collection has been donated to the IBCC Digital Archive by James Copus and catalogued by Nigel Huckins.
Date
A point or period of time associated with an event in the lifecycle of the resource
2016-02-24
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. Some items have not been published in order to protect the privacy of third parties, to comply with intellectual property regulations, or have been assessed as medium or low priority according to the IBCC Digital Archive collection policy and will therefore be published at a later stage. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal, https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collection-policy.
Transcribed document
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Transcription
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A few minutes before 7 o’clock in the evening of 22nd March 1944 I took off on my last operational sortie as the mid-upper gunner of Lancaster OF-P ND351. By the end of that night I was a prisoner of war having bailed out of the aircraft as it fell crippled and burning, the victim of a German night-fighter.
This is the story of that night and the year in captivity that followed..................
[Hand written signature] W/O James Copus 97 Sqn. POW STALAGLUFT 1. 2011. Love from Daddy. [/hand written signature]
[page break]
TARGET – FRANKFURT
By P.J. Copus
An extract from 97 Flight Operation Records 22-23 Mar 1944 :-
TARGET – Frankfurt Lancaster III OF-P ND351
P/O R.E. Cooper, Sgt. F.S. Witcher, F/Sgt. McFayden, Sgts. H. Lunt, H.A. Smith, P.J. Copus, R.R. Hinde.
Op 18.50 aircraft missing (4 x TI, 1 x 4000lb, 2 x 1000lb, 600 x 4lb incs, 40 x 4lb incs).
TARGET AHEAD!
We have made our turn to the south of Hanover at 18,000 feet. The target, Frankfurt, is now directly ahead of the aircraft and already burning. My attention is elsewhere, however. The Flak, which we can do nothing about anyway, has stopped, a sure indication that fighters are up. An “own goal” by the Flak crews would mean a double-quick transfer to the Russian front. Any night-fighter attack will come from the rear of the aircraft. Only the rear gunner and myself, the mid-upper turret gunner can offer return fire and so we are a fighter’s primary targets in the hope that he can silence our guns and finish off the aircraft without risk. We are well-aware that the odds are stacked heavily in his favour:
each of our Lancaster’s four Merlin engines produces a double row of exhaust flames
we have shiny turrets which can reflect any stray light
the fighter pilot can quickly re-position his aircraft to improve his view of anything suspicious whereas we have a full bomb-load and can only manoeuvre very gently for fear of tearing the wings off the aeroplane!
Should we be spotted then we [italic] must [/italic] see the slender, head-on fighter profile he gets within range, a very tall order indeed considering that we have to search all that volume of the night sky within our range of vision to the rear of the aircraft. Our rifle-calibre machine guns mean that the best we can hope for, should we be attacked, is to put the fighter pilot off his aim or maybe even make him break off his attack and perhaps lose us again in the darkness. However, since it is possible that the fighter was equipped with radar that he used to find us a second time. In an exchange of fire, we are at a severe disadvantage since the fighter has 20mm cannon as well as machine guns and the resulting weight of fire exceeds our own. Taking all these factors into account means that our chances of survival depend almost entirely on the size of the night sky which although apparently empty contains our friends and our foes in unequal proportions; there are many more of the latter, ground-based as well as airborne, who are as determined to prevent our
[page break]
reaching the target as we are to get there. The element of surprise is no longer a factor. Other aircraft in front of us have already released their bombs and the target is literally sprinkled with fires. The fighters will be more concerned with preventing additional attacks than shooting down aircraft that have already bombed. The chances of being seen in silhouette against the ground fires by a fighter pilot increase as we draw nearer the target. Our course, height and speed were all fixed before we took off in order to reduce the chances of not only of a collision over the target but also of bombs falling on aircraft flying at a lower level. In spite of these precautions, instruments inevitably have minor calibration tolerances and variations of a few hundred feet are number of occurrences is impossible to quantify since survivors of such an eventuality are improbable.
It is as well that we are all too preoccupied to think too carefully about the multitude of situations quite apart from enemy action that could kill us in the blink of an eye.
THE BEGINNING
Our training as a complete crew had involved many 8-hour flights around the UK almost always at night on what were primarily navigation exercises. However, their indirect purpose was to get us all functioning as a team. Apart from that we gunners were just along for the ride. On completion of training in Lancasters we were posted to ....... a Stirling station! In that remarkable manner which it seems only the Military can achieve, we had been wrongly directed and no-one knew anything about us. Our pilot, F/O Cooper told us to stay put and that he would arrange something. He disappeared for two days. On his return he announced that he had fixed us up with a Pathfinder Squadron, No.97.
This is how, one day in late December, we arrived at Bourn in Cambridgeshire. Only a fortnight previously, on the night of 16/17th. December, known as “Black Thursday”, Bomber Command has experienced its worst bad-weather losses of the war, a tragedy which cruelly emphasises the fact that the enemy lurks not only in human form. We were posted to Bourn as a contribution towards making up 97 Squadron’s share of the losses.
THE ATTACK
That night 22nd./23rd. March no-one saw the fighter, a Messerschmitt Bf110, in time. His first attack was probably at the end of a gentle climb from behind and below. The climb reduces the speed differential that the fighter needs to catch the target thereby avoiding the risk of an overshoot or even a collision. This tactic also meant that the bulk of the Lancaster on top of which I was sitting, hid the fighter from my view and even the rear gunner’s view downward is restricted enough to hide the approaching fighter. In any event that initial attack knocked out the hydraulics which operated the turrets. I was then in the embarrassing position of being able to do nothing
[page break]
but watch the ‘110’ flying alongside, straight and level, slightly below us and 200 to 300 metres off our starboard wing. The ‘110’s relative position enabled the gunner, facing aft in the rear of the cockpit to fire bursts from his machine gun with zero deflection into our fuel tanks and number three and four engines. The results were exactly what one would expect; both engines burst into flames. Some of his rounds, passing within inches of my head shattered my turret at about the same time as our pilot ordered over the intercom “Prepare to abandon aircraft” and then very quickly afterwards “Abandon aircraft”. All members of the crew acknowledged the order including the rear gunner who by some miracle had survived the initial attack. The bomb-aimer jettisoned the bomb-load. We were on our way down, both starboard engines blazing furiously.
THE ESCAPE
I tear off my oxygen mask, intercom leads and harness and folding my small seat upwards and out of the way manage to drop from my turret into the aircraft’s fuselage, where it is pitch dark. Although we gunners wear the parachute harness at all times in the aircraft, there is no room for the parachute pack itself in any of the turrets and my own is stored on the port side of the aircraft, aft of my position and opposite the rear fuselage hatch. It takes only a few seconds to find my parachute and clip it onto the harness. The rear hatch is now my emergency exit and I begin wrestling with the release handle. The door is jammed! More determined wrestling. The handle breaks off in my hand! I now have to scramble forward virtually the whole length of the Lancaster’s fuselage encumbered by parachute, heavy flying suit and boots. In pitch blackness! Although the entire fuselage is extremely confined and packed with equipment, this is nothing compared to the gymnastics required to wriggle over the wing-spar. All this must be achieved in the dark making sure that the parachute’s rip-cord does not get snagged and cause premature deployment and with the knowledge that at any moment the aircraft could steepen its dive, suddenly flip into inverted flight or simply explode as the engine fires touch off the fuel tanks in the wing. It is also possible that the fighter could attack again. Any chance of hiding in the night is now gone, our demise highlighted by sheets of flame. There are numerous other scenarios none of which is likely to improve our chances of survival. I dismiss these thoughts and continue floundering towards the under-nose hatch, now the only means of escape. The hatch is in the very forward part of the aircraft and access to it is achieved crawling under the pilot’s instrument panel to the right of his seat. The manoeuvre can be likened to crawling through the knee-hole of a writing desk. The pilot is still at the controls. I can see him clearly. This forward part of the aircraft is illuminated by way of a hole in the fuselage and indicate that I am about to go. He nods briefly in acknowledgement. There appears to be no-one else in the aircraft because I am able to walk upright towards the nose, still in pitch darkness of course, until I simply plunge feet-first through the open hatch! None of us is well-prepared for the experience which follows. Training for bailing out had been limited to little more than a few minutes’ jumping from a bench in the gym and attempting a landing-roll. After all, we all knew for certain that it was only some of the
[page break]
other crews who would have to face the experience. That sort of thing happens only to the other chaps..........
This night, however, it is not the ‘other chaps’. It is us. Our lucky mascots, our youthful confidence in ourselves and each other, our training, all now useless. What happens next is uncharted territory!
The slipstream seizes me and whirls me around furiously and noisily. During one of my violent gyrations, I catch a glimpse of the aircraft as I free-fall away from it. I have kept hold of the ripcord handle and knowing now that I am well clear of the aircraft, haul on the handle. The parachute explodes out of the pack as the airstream seizes it. The opening shock is immediate and extremely violent and I am wrenched into an upright position, completely winded and in some considerable pain from the contraction of the parachute harness. The sudden peace and quiet is extraordinary. The only noise is my own laboured breathing. I am hanging apparently nearly motionless. It is cold. Very cold! We were flying at 18,000 feet when attacked and I imagine the aircraft was down to 15,000 feet when I bailed out.
Surprisingly, my all-consuming thought is that it will take a long time to get back home from this operation!
[photo from R.A.F. Museum’s Lancaster September 2010]
The descent takes an enormous but unquantifiable amount of time. I know the ground will be covered in snow and therefore easy to see. Straining my eyes I can see a vague brightness below. I brace myself and wait for the shattering crash of the landing. Nothing happens! What I take to be the ground is a thin layer of low cloud. Just cloud. As I begin to relax a little, comes the landing; surprisingly gentle. I am in a ploughed field covered with snow. My only injury is some bruising and scratching on my face as a result of pitching forward on impact with the ground.
[page break]
To borrow the Germans’ own favourite expression in these circumstances “For me, the war is over.”
A PRISONER OF WAR
The field in which I had landed was only yards from a row of houses. Their occupants were on me immediately I landed and I was dragged into one of the houses amid much shouting and bravado. It was widely known that German civilians were not exactly welcoming towards aircrew who fell into their hands and I was very nervous about the whole situation. They shoved me into one corner of the room. My ‘chute has been gathered into an untidy bundle and was dumped beside me. In the other corner were grouped a cross-section of the neighbourhood. They were gesticulating and shouting at me in unintelligible German. Some of the shouting, however, needed no translation! In the circumstances I did not feel at all like a ‘Terrorflieger’ as the Nazis called R.A.F. bomber crews. Some young wide-eyed children were among the crowd. As a gesture of goodwill I took some chocolate from my flying-suit pocked and offered it to them. They recoiled hastily, either not knowing what it was or suspecting it was poisoned perhaps. To prove it was safe I ate a little myself and returned the rest to my pocket but the atmosphere was tense and I hoped that some sort of authority had been alerted and would remove me before something unpleasant happened.
Fortunately, the civil police (they were referred to as ‘gendarmes’) arrived promptly and I was hauled off on foot to the local police station where I was thrown unceremoniously, without food or water, into a damp cell in which the only piece of furniture was a bed. There was not even a blanket. I attempted to sleep but it was extremely cold. In an attempt to keep my feet from freezing I managed to squeeze both into one flying boot.
At some point during the night I was dragged out of the cell and upstairs to an office where I was confronted by the local Bürgermeister (Mayor). There were, he told me, the bodies of several aircrew in the mortuary. If I would tell him the names of my crew he would let me know if any of them were among the dead. I felt unable to cooperate in this ‘kind offer’ which was, of course, a fairly transparent ruse to get more information out of me. My response was perhaps equally transparent but served well enough to show that I knew what he was up to. The crew I had been a last minute arrangement as a substitute. However, I added helpfully, I would be prepared to go to the mortuary and point out anyone I recognised. This offer was refused and I was returned promptly to my cell.
In the morning, after an extremely uncomfortable night, I was brought a cup of ersatz coffee and unidentifiable to eat. Shortly afterwards I was dragged out of the cell and outside where a horse cart was waiting. Surprisingly my ‘chute was returned to me and as I flung it
[page break]
into the cart saw Lund, the bomb-aimer, already aboard. He had a leg wound. As I started to climb up into the cart with him, I was pulled back and told that I must walk along behind thus presenting the entire populace who had turned out to watch, with another opportunity to shout and scream abuse as we plodded slowly through the town.
We arrived eventually at some sort of holding area, a single room in an official building into which we were directed. Shortly, after, Lund was taken off to hospital. My parachute was not returned to me and I imagine provided some luxury under-wear for a “Hausfrau” or mistress somewhere. It was not for many years that I discovered that the rear-gunner, Ron Hinde, whom we all knew as “Slick”, although he had acknowledged the order to bail out, had been killed. Exactly what had happened remains a mystery. Clearly something had gone wrong after his acknowledgement of the order to bale [sic] out. As I had discovered there was ample capacity for The Unexpected! The aircraft crashed in woodland outside Hanover and Ron Hinde is buried in Hanover War Cemetery.
It appeared that when the holding areas reached a certain number of inmates, they were moved out for transfer to a permanent camp (Stalag). The first step in the transfer process was to get to Frankfurt. Accompanied by two guards, I was shoved onto a train and began the two-day trip. Progress was very slow, the timetable upset by Bomber Command’s constant rearrangement of the rail network! The guards were pleasant and pointed out landmarks along the way. During one of halts one of my guards announced that he was going to get some water. In due course he returned and sat down, sipping at his water bottle. After a while he offered me the water bottle. “Wasser?” he asked. I took a gulp. Schnapps!
Thus I was delivered to Frankfurt station where a large number of weary and disconsolate aircrew were already gathered. The station was a mess! There were hardly any buildings standing, just several platforms. I did not feel the need to point out that this had been our handiwork! We were crammed into cattle-trucks, thirty per truck. We had no idea where we were going or how long the journey would take. We travelled day and night. There were occasional stops when we were given food and water.
Three days later we arrived at Stalagluft 1.
[page break]
[Sketch of location and layout of camp]
The POW camp, Stalagluft 1 was close to the Baltic coast near a town called Barth. There were British and American aircrew there numbering nearly 10000 in total. The days were spent walking about, playing football perhaps, talking, reading. There was a lively black market trade based on Red Cross food parcels. It was not unknown for the guards to join in, running the risk of joining short-sighted Flak crews and other defaulters in Stalingrad!
It can be imagined perhaps that for young men used to an active, adrenalin-fuelled life, the resulting boredom was a particular form of torture. The reader must remember too, that we had no idea no long this would go on and how it would end. One of the original inmates of the camp had been shot in the middle of September 1939 only a few weeks into the war. How were we new arrivals to know that our own confinement wouldn’t be just as long..... or longer!?
[page break]
[photo of the camp]
But for the resilience of youth and the comradeship, it would have been easy to fall into hopelessness and despair.
One of the first people I met on entering the camp was a chap who had been on the same gunnery course as me on the Isle of Man. A fortnight after my arrival, our pilot F/O Cooper turned up. Although I was unaware of it at the time, he had been wounded in the back when we were shot down and had been in hospital since that time.
The most senior German officer whom we saw regularly during his “rounds” of the camp was a Major Mueller. He was a decent chap, clearly one of the “old school” bearing a duelling scar across one cheek. He was not above joining in and on one occasion, after watching some Americans fencing; took over one “foil” (actually a stick) to show them how it was done. Of course, the camp was run entirely by the Luftwaffe, much preferable, we all felt, to Wehrmacht personnel who not doubt gave their prisoners a much harder time. There was the empathy of airmen albeit on different sides.
The Germans routinely produced their version of The News riddled of course with propaganda: a rain of V.1’s and V.2’s had reduced London to rubble: the Wehrmacht was pushing the Red Army back into Russia: an attempted Allied invasion had been thrown back into the sea while a German invasion was imminent and so on. Fortunately we had our own sources – the BBC via an illicit
[page break]
radio hidden somewhere in the camp. It was not therefore entirely unexpected one night, 30th April 1945, after we were locked up as usual, all the Germans fled! We already knew, as they did, that the Red Army was approaching. We were not overjoyed at the prospect of being liberated by the Russians and were somewhat concerned by what might happen. Had we known then what is known now about how the Russians sometimes handled these situations, we would have been even more concerned!
LIBERATION
For some days after the departure of our guards the only signs of our liberators were in the distance. In the meantime our own officers advised us not to venture outside the camp confines. Free to explore the entire camp we discovered a hoard of Red Cross parcels which the Germans had stopped distributing since December. This windfall allowed us to celebrate in some style. The Russians’ eventual arrival was marked by an hour-long speech , delivered in Russian by a senior officer. Since hardly anyone understood a word we were obliged to follow the speaker’s lead and applaud or cheer at what seemed to be suitable pauses in his oratory. Thereafter we saw very little of the Red Army, a situation which suited us very well!
It was two weeks before we were picked up. Our removal from the camp had been expedited we found out much later, by the highest possible authority. The Russians had apparently revealed that they intended to move us all to Odessa from where we could be shipped home. Or so they said. The British and American Governments did not believe at least the latter part of this stated intention and the mission to pick us up was put together in something of a hurry and without consultation with our liberators. The suspicion was that the Russians intended to hold us hostages to improve their bargaining position when it came to dividing up the spoils of war.
We were marched in batches to the airfield on the southern outskirts of the town. On the way we passed within yards of the perimeter of a concentration camp. The occupants did not appear “liberated”. It is probable that they had simply swapped one captor for another. We knew of the existence of this camp because several of the inmates having presumably escaped in the chaos after the Russians’ arrival had turned up at the gates of our camp begging for food and sanctuary. To have rendered any form of assistance, not that there was much we could have done, would have meant the end of all of us had the Russians discovered that we had helped them.
I returned to England in a USAF B-17. We were eventually taken to Biggin Hill where we were told that none of us would fly again with the R.A.F. and given two weeks’ leave to make up our minds whether to stay on or not. In a “Land Fit for Heroes” there was little on offer in the way of employment and so I elected to stay on in the R.A.F. and chose[sic] to join a transport unit. Here I learned to drive and acquired my driving licence which stood me in good stead for my eventual transfer to “civvy street”.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Target Frankfurt
Description
An account of the resource
Account of Jim Copus's last operation to Frankfurt during which his 97 Squadron Lancaster was shot down by a Me 110 night fighter. Includes the task of air gunners, the engagement by the night fighter which disabled all hydraulics including those to his turret. His difficulties in escaping from the aircraft, parachuting and capture by hostile civilians before being handed to civil police. His treatment as a prisoner and his journey to prisoner of war camp at Stalag Luft 1 at Barth. Life in camp, liberation by the Russians and repatriation by United States Army Air Force B-17 to England. Includes photographs of Jim Corpus as a wartime airman, prisoner of war and at the RAF Museum in 2010 as well as one of the prisoner of war camp. In addition there are hand drawn maps of north Germany and the Baltic locating Barth and a diagram of the Stalag Luft 1 camp.
Creator
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James Corpus
Format
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Eleven page printed document
Language
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eng
Type
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Text
Text. Memoir
Map
Photograph
Identifier
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BCopusPJCopusPJv
Coverage
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Royal Air Force
Royal Air Force. Bomber Command
United States Army
Civilian
Wehrmacht. Luftwaffe
Spatial Coverage
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Germany
Great Britain
Germany--Frankfurt am Main
Germany--Barth
England--Kent
Temporal Coverage
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1944-03-27
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Contributor
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Gemma Clapton
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
97 Squadron
air gunner
aircrew
B-17
bale out
final resting place
Lancaster
Me 110
prisoner of war
RAF Biggin Hill
RAF Bourn
shot down
Stalag Luft 1
-
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/993/10624/PKettleboroughML1801.1.jpg
efc647dc6becbc47519bf8e76f1d5de7
https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/files/original/993/10624/AKettleboroughML180905.2.mp3
a1f21b78fd5d4533acef476141e5645c
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Kettleborough, Mick
Michael Kettleborough
M L Kettleborough
Description
An account of the resource
An oral history interview with Michael 'Mick' Kettleborough (b. 1936). He grew up in Woodhall Spa.
The collection was catalogued by IBCC Digital Archive staff.
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
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2018-09-05
Rights
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Identifier
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Kettleborough, ML
Transcribed audio recording
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Transcription
Text transcribed from audio recording or document
DK: That’s alright. Don’t worry. You’d be surprised. Some interviews have barking dogs and cats jumping on me and all sorts of things so don’t worry about that. What would be useful if that’s, if you’re all going to chip in at some point, you’re all quite welcome to, if you could all say your names. Is that ok?
AH: I won’t say anything.
[laughter]
MK: Yeah.
DK: Just, just for future references as to who was there. So, I’ll just start this. I’m David Kavanagh working for the International Bomber Command Centre interviewing do you mind me calling you Mick?
MK: Correct.
DK: Yes. Ok.
MK: I’m known as Mick.
DK: Mick Kettleborough, at his home on the 5th of September 2018 and with me I have —
AH: Amanda Holland, which is Mick’s daughter.
VK: Valerie Kettleborough. That’s Mick’s wife.
LH: Lucy Holland, Mick’s granddaughter.
DK: And the dog?
LH: Is Merlin.
AH: Merlin.
DK: Merlin, the dog. Ok. Well, I’ll, I’ll put that there. If I keep looking over, I’m just making sure it’s still going.
MK: Yeah.
DK: Yeah. So, if we can start off then perhaps you could recap what you were saying. Where you were born and —
MK: I was, I wasn’t born in Willoughby House. My father, my stepdad bought Willoughby House when I was about three.
DK: Right.
MK: He had a, he had a little practice in Woodhall. Down, down Witham Road and he moved from Witham Road to Willoughby House when I was about three and then it’s all a bit hazy for a start. And then when I was about four years old, we, my mum had the choice. She could either take Army or Air Force which was the Air Force was like a Lancaster pilot. She could, and she chose to take the RAF boys.
AH: Because she had a spare room, hadn’t she?
DK: Right.
MK: Because we had a spare room you see. Now, the thing is I can vaguely, we had one or two come and I can vaguely remember they didn’t last long so you can imagine what happened to them poor devils. We had one I can remember called Len Swire. I can’t remember what he did but mum’s favourite was Jack Gibson.
DK: Right.
MK: He was a, he was Canadian.
DK: Right.
AH: And he’s on the Bomber Command Memorial.
DK: Oh right. Ok.
MK: Yes. He’s on the Memorial. He’s also, he’s buried at Coningsby.
DK: Do you know where he was based then? Which airfield he was based at?
MK: Pardon?
VK? He was based at Woodhall, wasn’t he?
MK: He was based at Coningsby.
VK? Yeah. Coningsby.
DK: Right. Ok.
MK: Yeah. Based at Coningsby.
DK: So, the airmen that stayed with your, your mother then they were mostly from Coningsby?
MK: They would be all Bomber Command.
DK: Yeah.
MK: All what they called Bomber Boys and Jack Gibson, he was, I think he was mum’s favourite. And as far as I can remember I was told afterwards that sometime in November, what was it? 1942 would it be? Jack Gibson was shot. He was killed when? Nineteen forty —
AH: Lucy can tell you that.
LH: I’m just trying to look —
MK: Yeah. Just, just let Lucy have a —
LH: Carry on. You carry on.
MK: And he was, he came and asked our mum, mum told me years after, he came and asked our mum if he could have an early Christmas.
DK: Right.
MK: And she said, ‘Why do you want an early Christmas?’ He said, ‘There’s something big coming off. We’ve not had a briefing yet but something big is coming off. I’m not allowed, I don’t know so I can’t say but I shall be confined. I shall be confined to the aerodrome for quite a period.’ And apparently, it all came out afterwards that they were knocking the hell out the Ruhr Valley.
DK: Right.
MK: And the bomber boys went to concentrate at that time on the Ruhr Valley and, when was Jack killed?
LH: The 18th of December ’41.
MK: 18th of December 1941.
LH: That’s what we got. [Coningsby was said?]
DK: Right.
MK: So, Mum said yeah, so will remember everything was rationed in them days. Everything was rationed strictly.
DK: Yeah.
MK: So anyway, mum rustled up what we, what she could get and he had his Christmas.
DK: Right.
MK: And then he went. He went, he went back to Coningsby or where ever he was and mum never saw him again.
DK: So —
MK: But —
DK: Sorry. Go on.
MK: The thing is this he gave mum some of his that what they called valuables. Perhaps a watch, ring.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Maybe he had, I don’t know a wallet and such thing anyways. And then he was, a telegram came as far as I can remember being told that, saying that Jack had been killed in action.
DK: Right.
MK: And the story is after, the story afterwards what my sister told me I think my sister was very sweet on, on Jack Gibson and apparently, he came back badly shot to bits. Apparently, his radio, the radio was still working, so the radio operator got in touch with Coningsby. Asked him to land on Woodhall landing ground.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Because they didn’t want to blow up the main runways and he was coming back over the North Sea and he said to his crew, ‘As soon as you hit land,’ he said, ‘Jump. They said, ‘No way. We’ve done so many missions with you.’
DK: Yeah.
MK: ‘We’re sticking with you.’ And apparently, he put the plane down. It blew up.
DK: And was all the crew killed as far as you were aware?
MK: No. They was all killed. But I don’t know the names of the rest of the crew.
DK: No.
MK: I don’t know their names.
AH? That would be found outable.
DK: We should be able to find that. I’ll have a look in a minute because it should be on the IBCC’s database of the losses.
MK: Yeah.
DK: If we find his name it will actually list the rest of his crew.
MK: Yeah. Well, he, he, that’s the story I can remember. And then of course Jack, apparently the, well my sister told the story. Told it, that the MPs came to collect his things and they said to our mum, ‘Where are his valuables?’ Mum said, ‘I haven’t got any.’ He said, ‘You’re lying.’ She said, ‘I’m not lying.’ ‘He’s minus —’ this, that and the other, ‘And we want his diary.’
MK: Yeah.
MK: Mum said, ‘I’ve got nothing.’ And they said to my dad, ‘You realise we can search your house.’ Dad said, ‘No way.’ And that’s it. ‘You’re not searching the house.’ And they said, ‘Well, we can do.’ They said, ‘Well, you’d better come up with his valuables.’ They said, ‘We haven’t got any. We haven’t got any.’ And time progressed and mum wrote to his parents in Canada because you’ve got to remember everything was censored.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
MK: That’s why she daren’t tell them.
DK2: Right.
MK: That she’d got some of his artifacts.
DK: No.
MK: She had got the diary and they were hidden somewhere away. She got it. She wrote to his parents in Canada. They wrote a lovely letter back saying fair enough and after, after things, after the war time mum did send them his things.
DK: Right.
MK: And they did write back and said thank you very much. And then there was no more contact made. No more contact made at all. But we used, Jack’s the one. Jack Gibson’s the one that stands out.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Because being Canadian he used to take me up to his bedroom and he’d go, he’d got tins of salted nuts. Salted peanuts.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And he had, sometimes he had a bar of chocolate [laughs] because we didn’t. I didn’t know what chocolate was because it was rationed.
DK: Yeah.
MK: You didn’t get that sort of thing.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And that’s, that’s the story of, he is buried in Coningsby cemetery. Down the bottom end.
DK: Right.
MK: And he’s on, he’s on the Memorial at Woodhall Spa.
DK: Right. Yeah.
MK: Not that he took part in the Dambusters raid but he was, it’s got the list of names, hasn’t it?
DK: Yes. Yeah.
MK: Not that, he wasn’t attached to that. That was a, we don’t, we never had anybody, Petwood Hotel was the officer’s mess as you know.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Do you want me to carry on?
DK: Yeah. I was going to ask. His personal possessions then. Were they then sent to his family in Canada? Or did your mother hang on to them.
MK: My mum, my, you see my mum knew she, my mum knew that because she wouldn’t tell them.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Or made out she didn’t know and they apparently said, well he had got no wallet on his body. He’d got no, no rings, no watches. Well, they just say that sort of thing.
DK: Yeah.
MK: But mum had. He left them with mum.
DK: Right.
MK: Mum daren’t post them in the wartime because she knew she was being watched.
DK: Yes. Yeah.
MK: And she knew she’d be censored.
DK: Yeah.
MK: She knew that all post in them, most of the post in them days you had to be very careful what you wrote.
DK: I’m sure. Yeah.
MK: You had to be very careful what you said over the telephone if you had a telephone and that sort of thing. But after the war, after the war mum did get in touch with his parents and they was, his, what he left with our mum was sent.
DK: It was sent to Canada.
MK: Yeah. It was sent.
DK: I’ll just pause there.
[recording paused]
DK: So, for the recording then I’ll just speak to this from the Losses Database it’s Jack Lloyd Gibson. He was twenty nine years old. He died on the 18th of December 1941 flying on board Avro Manchester L7490.
MK: Yeah. That’s the one.
DK: Coded OFU, from 97 Squadron and is now buried in Coningsby Cemetery and all the crew were killed including Wing Commander DF Balsdon. So, he’s on the Memorial there in [pause] Lincoln.
MK: Yeah.
DK: On panel number 39. And his service number is R60253, Royal Canadian Air Force. So, the reason for loss is damaged by flak during a daylight raid and on return the aircraft stalled and crashed trying to land.
VK: Sad. To have done all those miles and then come home to that.
DK: Yeah.
AH: To get killed on home soil.
DK: So, he actually came from Edmonton, Alberta, Canada.
MK: That’s right.
DK: Ok. Thanks for that.
MK: You see the thing is with Woodhall, around there we was, Lancasters was all over the place because they used to be doing air tests. You had Spitfires, Hurricanes doing all the bits and pieces.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And —
DK: So, you can personally remember all the aircraft then all flying about.
MK: Well, you got you didn’t take any notice of the Lancasters.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Because they was, they was all the time doing air tests. They were doing low level flying across the fens and I mean bloody low. Pardon my language. They were doing low flying across the fens because, like practicing.
DK: Yeah.
MK: You didn’t take any notice of them. I mean, you might, you see my dad being, being a dentist he was allowed extra petrol because a lot of people in the outlying fens couldn’t get to him if they had raging toothache or —
DK: Yeah.
MK: So, he had to go to them. So, he was allowed extra petrol. And sometimes if I was lucky, he would take us with him. Take me with him and it was daunting to see a Lancaster coming about two or three hundred feet above the fens but you took no notice and you, because —
DK: You got —
MK: At night time —
DK: You got so used it.
MK: On a quiet night when they was all, I mean Coningsby is a fair way from Woodhall and I’m not exaggerating.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Especially on Woodhall landing ground on a still, on a still winter’s night you could hear them revving up to take off.
MK: Not one. Not two but perhaps thirty, forty of them and if the wind, the wind was a certain way they used to take off over Woodhall and I tell you what, they were scraping the house roofs because they were fully loaded. I mean two thousand gallons of aviation fuel on board.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Plus bomb load and so sometimes when we went out around about I mean the woods in Woodhall right down to Kirkby on Bain were absolutely, well they’re still finding things. It was absolutely full of ammunition. Crates and crates of bombs. Not detonated. Crates and crates of bombs all all with, all camouflaged netting on them.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Over them and they’re still finding bits and pieces down in some, down the wood near the cemetery. I can’t remember now the name of that wood. Down near the cemetery where my brother is. Where my brother is buried.
VK: I think it’s still cordoned off isn’t it? For some reason. I think.
MK: Yeah.
DK: Yeah. They keep finding various things.
MK: They’re finding stuff.
DK: They found some mustard gas.
VH: That’s right. That’s right.
MK: They’re still finding stuff down there.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Yeah. And a lot of the, a lot of the roadsides. Dad used to go and visit a family called Eldon’s in New York. Their daughter was in service with mum and as you went down there and back all the road sides were stacked. Crates and crates and crates. Bombs. One of the woods in Woodhall, back of Coronation Avenue. That was at one point that was absolutely full of petrol cans. Thousands. And they seemed to come and then they disappeared because we used to go and play. I used to go to play in the wood.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And all of a sudden, ‘Oi boy. Boy. Out. Go on. Off you go. Go and play somewhere else.’
DK: Right.
MK: So we, we used to run off. And then —
DK: So, looking back on it and obviously that time you’re looking at it from a child’s point of view. Was it, for a child an exciting time or could you really understand what, what the dangers were and what was really going on?
MK: No.
DK: Or was it just a lot of fun?
MK: You see the, no because it was [pause] it’s like when you’re young you, life’s a play.
AH: It’s like it’s your way. You’ve never known a different way of life really.
MK: No. You see it was —
AH: That you could remember before, could you?
MK: You see, we had, we had the Gordon Highlanders was based in Woodhall. Army. We had the Enniskillens. We had the, the Arnhem boys went from the Royal Hotel.
DK: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
MK: Which got flattened. Which got bombed. We used to go and play in the rubble which we never, I mean we never should have done but we use to play.
DK: Is that the hotel where the Memorial is now? On the corner.
MK: Yes.
DK: Yeah.
MK: That was the Royal Hotel.
DK: Yeah. Right.
MK: The Victoria Hotel got burned down. The Royal Hotel took a direct hit.
DK: Right.
MK: To get to know more about that that what’s his name [unclear] . The chap who writes about Woodhall.
DK: Yeah. I know who you mean.
MK: Yeah. He’s got the story of all that, but anyway, we used to, the Royal Hotel, that took a direct hit. I don’t think there was a window left down the Broadway. All our windows got blew out. My bedroom ceiling come down. I screamed because I couldn’t get the bedroom door open. So, my mum and dad at that particular time was in London. Dad was on business in London so there was only me and my sister. She come and barged the door open and snatched me and we went downstairs. The next thing some of the Army boys were there. One was called Tom. A big fella. They brewed some tea up and went out to clear the glass up. And we couldn’t shut the doors because they’d, they’d blown open.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And the Army boys I can remember the Army boys coming in and Tom was there. They brewed tea and they helped us and my sister clean the glass up and then it all quietened down and she said, ‘We’d better go to bed.’ I kept saying, ‘Pat.’ ‘What?’ ‘There’s a bit of glass in the bed.’ So, we had to go around picking glass out of the bed. And then the next morning we found out that Dr Armour’s, are you interested in this or not?
DK: Yes. Yeah. Keep going. Keep going. I’m just making sure it’s —
MK: Dr Armour’s place was badly damaged. Sleight’s house next door. I can’t remember now. Sleight’s house next door was very badly damaged and I think Mr Sleight was killed.
DK: Right.
MK: And apparently his wife died a few months later of a broken heart.
DK: Oh dear.
MK: That’s and there was Goodyear’s, A Churches, the butchers over the road. A Churches. Well, the whole of Broadway. I don’t think there was a pane of glass left.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Because they really shook Woodhall they did but that’s, there was no there was only, I think there was only one person was killed.
DK: Right.
MK: Which was lucky enough.
AH: And Auntie Pat, dad’s sister, she did tell me that after that particular night Lord Haw Haw went on the radio and apologised to his friends in Woodhall Spa.
MK: Yeah.
DK: Really?
MK: Lord Haw Haw didn’t.
DK: Yeah.
MK: He didn’t want any damage on Woodhall.
DK: Yeah.
MK: But he used to, he used to preach propaganda. I mean —
DK: Yeah.
MK: I can’t remember what was said but what, what I can remember was my dad he brought a sophisticated wireless for that particular time.
DK: Right.
MK: And on a nice night Churchill’s speech on a nice night he would turn it up loud, open the windows and all the soldiers used to sit on the lawn.
DK: Yeah.
MK: We had a lawn full of soldiers sitting and standing listening to Churchill’s - —
DK: Speeches. Yeah. Yeah.
MK: Speeches. And I can remember one particular night my dad come to fetch me up for some reason and he took me out, he took me down the stairs on the front lawn and there was wave after wave, after wave of enemy bombers and I heard my dad say to my mum, ‘By God, Lincoln’s copping it tonight.’ But it wasn’t. It was Coventry.
DK: Oh right.
MK: Wave after wave of bombers.
DK: Yeah.
MK: The ack ack guns were all, on the coast were all opening up. The ack ack guns on Coningsby and Woodhall. They were all, they were all barking away. You could hear them. Whether they hit anything I don’t know.
DK: Yeah.
MK: But that was, that was the night that Coventry copped it.
DK: Right. And you can well remember that then and vividly remember the aircraft going over.
MK: Oh, God. I can remember the aircraft. The aircraft. Yeah. And you see at night time it was dense blackout. I went [pause] My, I went to, I was, I think it was a chap, I can’t think of his name. Clive. His first name was Clive. He was my age and I think he had a birthday party and I think I was invited to the birthday party and that would be after school.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And my sister came to fetch me and I was terrified because Woodhall, you couldn’t see. I couldn’t see you. Blackout. It was, November. Pitch black. And I was frightened because you couldn’t see.
DK: Yeah.
MK: There was the odd Army lorry going by with the dipped lights. There was people about but you couldn’t see. You couldn’t see who they were. And thank God my sister knew where she was going because I wouldn’t have done. I just got disorientated because it was that, that pitch dark. That was the blackout.
DK: Yeah.
MK: You, you didn’t show. If you had the slightest chink of light in any, you got a bang on the door. The ARP. ‘Get that bloody light out. There’s a war on.’ And you did as you [laughs] You did.
DK: Did it. Yeah. Yeah.
MK: And that was the sort of thing that happened and we used to play. We used to have games. One of, one of the favourite games was when we saw a train coming, we used to run down to the station and then in those days there was a bridge over the Broadway.
DK: Right.
MK: So, we used to run up on the bridge and hang over the rail so when the train came by you got covered in smoke. So, you got all smuts. You’d got all the, well that was the highlight of the day that was. Things like that.
DK: Not like that now though, is it? Kids, kids don’t entertain themselves like that.
MK: Yeah. If you think I’m going off course.
DK: No. No.
MK: You just let me know. And —
DK: And if I could take you back a bit you said your parents obviously took in the RAF men as, as lodgers there. After Gibson died there, did they take in any more?
MK: I don’t think mum did. I think, I think mum put her foot, I think, I think, I think mum was very very fond of Jack Gibson.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Because he was, what I can remember of him he was a lovely chap. He was because he gave me salted peanuts [laughs] And you see things like that, things stick in your mind. We lived in Willoughby House. Across the road was the Methodist Church. This end of the Methodist church was an Army cookhouse.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Was an Army cookhouse. And I went home for a meal one day and I said to mum, ‘I’m not hungry.’ And my mum said, ‘Why?’ ‘I’ve had my dinner.’ Where?’ ‘In the cookhouse.’ ‘You’ve had your dinner in the cookhouse.’ ‘Yes.’ ‘What did you eat it off?’ ‘They put an oilcloth down. A bit of rag down for me. Like a dishcloth.’ ‘You did?’ ‘Yeah.’ And anyway, that got stopped. I wasn’t allowed to do that anymore.
DK: You didn’t do that again.
MK: No. And when, when the cookhouse got a delivery of canned meat, tinned meat, sort, sort of corned beef, Spam and all that sort of thing coming in tins Tom used to come across with his apron on and he was holding his hand like that. ‘Here you are mam. Here’s a tin of bully beef. Here’s a tin of Spam. Keep it quiet. Don’t, not a word.’ And off he’d go and they’d bring us this and then the bread lorry used to come. A big lorry full of bread and they used to have a chain. A chain across inside. And in, in the actual cookhouse there was a massive coal range that they used to cook on and there was some field kitchens outside.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Where they used to put all the vegetables in and stir it around with a stick. And yeah, it was, it was good. It was good times and it was, it was good times actually. Well, it was. It was good times for us.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Because we didn’t know.
DK: [unclear]
MK: And you know, any different.
DK: When the war’s come to an end and I know rationing went on for a bit longer but do you think that period that you were growing up has in any way affected you? About how you feel about food and waste and that sort of thing. Do you —
MK: Well, you see you ate what you was given.
DK: Do you think about that now?
MK: You ate what you was given because of rationing. I had a gran, my grandad he was head forester and gamekeeper on the Hotchkins estate.
DK: Right.
MK: So we had plenty of rabbits. You had plenty of rabbits because meat was rationed.
DK: Yeah.
MK: If you got a bit of beef, if you got a bit of beef you were lucky. So therefore you only had, everything was rationed. Tightly rationed. So if you had, if grandad shot some rabbits we were lucky.
DK: Yeah.
MK: If someone killed a pig it was shared. In those days it was shared out. So we actually, I’ll put it this way you ate what was you was given and if you didn’t you went without. There was not like there was today. If you go in, ‘I don’t want that, mum. Can you cook this?’ No. It was was put on your plate.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
MK: You either ate it or you went without so you actually ate it.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Whatever it was and you and it was like you had a lot of greens. Everybody grew greens. Eggs were very very scarce. But people had the black market. People had chickens and the black, and you used to say perhaps, ‘I’ll give you half a dozen eggs for a bit of corn for the chickens.’ And all that sort of thing went on. But no, you didn’t actually. No. It didn’t. The war didn’t actually worry me. You got, you got used to seeing the Army about and the big Army lorries and I tell you we had the Gordon Highlanders. That was the highlight because on a, some Sundays they had a full parade with full pipe band. Am I boring you?
DK: No. No. I’m just making sure it’s still going. Keep going. Don’t worry.
MK: We had. We had that. They used to come down Woodhall with a full pipe band.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Drums and band. And that used to be the church parade.
DK: Right.
MK: Well, I used to run like hell to the end of Iddesleigh Road to watch them coming. You’d stand and wave to them you see. Not that they acknowledged you because they couldn’t. And that used to be church parade. And I can’t think who was billeted in the Golf Hotel. I can’t remember who it was. Anyway, I got to know one or two. I got the Golf Hotel car park as it is now.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Was the parade ground and I used to get woke in the morning because the blasted bugler used to stand right at the end of our garden blowing Reveille. So, some days I used to get up some times and draw the blackout back and peep out in the daylight and you’d see them out there doing their PT. As time progressed, they’d be on there doing rifle, rifle drill and all that sort of thing. I got to know one or two of them and I got, I used to sneak in to the Golf Hotel up in to the bedrooms and the soldiers took no notice of me. They used to show me how to clean a 303 rifle.
DK: Yeah.
MK: I didn’t get, and they used to show me how to polish the buttons. Put those things on a button.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
MK: Polish all the brass buttons and blanco the belts and spats. You know the —
DK: Yeah.
MK: Spats. And how they used to bull the boots up. They used to go, I learned that at a very early age. I used to say to mum I’ve been to watch them bulling their boots and spit and pad. I used to go up and they’d be sitting out. The only thing was if somebody important was coming, an officer or a sergeant, ‘Scarper boy, quick.’
DK: Yeah.
MK: ‘Go and hide.’ So, I used to go and hide and when they’d gone I’d go back again [laughs]
DK: So —
MK: I’d go back again.
DK: So, when the war has ended did it seem a bit strange that all this life ended without all the soldiers there and the bases closing and —
MK: Well, it was surprising how quick Woodhall changed.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Back of St Hugh’s School, to the side of St Hugh’s School there was loads of, loads of Nissen huts with slab paths for the Army boys, and there was a lot more stationed up Horncastle Road.
DK: Right.
MK: That’s where the prisoner of war camp was. Up Horncastle Road on Tor o moor, on Roughton Moor. That was where it was. No. It was, you sort of, it’s funny really. No. It never made any impression on us but you were sorry too. I mean you’d been used to seeing a mass of khaki.
DK: Yeah.
MK: I mean if you were lucky enough if there was [unclear] film on at the Kinema in the Woods because that kept going.
DK: Yes. Yeah.
MK: Mam said, ‘Would you like to go?’ ‘Yes, please.’ So, and you sat in deck chairs and there used to be all the Army boys in there. I mean, you could hardly see the screen through fag smoke and some of them were sleeping and some of them were smoking. It was, yeah it was good fun.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Good fun. It was. No, it didn’t have any, no it was, it was surprisingly quick how things seemed to get back to normal.
DK: Yeah. Although it wouldn’t, it wouldn’t be a normality that you would have been used to.
MK: No, because rationing was still on after the war, yeah. I think it was 1950 before proper rationing was stopped.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And we used to have to make our own entertainment. I mean I had a whip and top and I got a hoop from somewhere. A bit of a stick and a hoop so you played with that. You’d spend hours playing with that because there was no traffic about. Used to go up the Broadwalk. Up and down the Broadway. You wouldn’t today. With a hoop and your whip and top.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And then living down Iddesleigh Road there, there was some railway gates. I was out there one day and this woman was struggling to get through the hand gates with a wheelchair so of course I went and helped. ‘Oh, you are kind.’ She gave me a penny. I thought, Christ I’ve got a penny. So, I went and told my mum, ‘I’ve just been given a penny.’ ‘How?’ ‘A lady gave me a penny.’ So, I thought, right, I’d wait for the old dears to come down from the Spa baths and I used to open the gate for them. Sometimes I got a penny. Sometimes I got tuppence so, and I used to scoot around to Waterhouse’s bakehouse and get two ha’penny buns and they were like that. Two ha’penny buns. And things like that all stick in your mind. I mean Johnny Wield. He lived in that, he lived in what is now the Woodhall Museum.
DK: Right.
MK: And he used to loan out bath chairs for the people at the Spa baths and things like that. He was also a watch repairer so I used to, and I used to go around to see him and if I was good, he would let me stand and watch him repair a watch. And then you’d go outside and he’d be greasing, and you’d go outside and he’d be greasing the wheels on the wheelchairs in places like. A very, very nice chap, Johnnie Wield. A very well read, very clever man and things like that stick in, stick in your mind.
DK: What do you feel now? Presumably you’ve been back to Woodhall Spa since. What do you feel when you go back there now?
MK: Nostalgia. Woodhall always had a pull on me.
DK: Right.
MK: I live in Barnet. I married a Barnet girl. This is my home.
DK: Right.
MK: But when I used to go back to see my brother and relations at Woodhall I wanted to go. I wasn’t made to go. I wanted. I still want to go.
DK: Does it —
MK: Amanda still, my daughter very took up with Woodhall.
DK: Yeah.
AH: We like going to Woodhall.
DK: Yeah. Does it feel like home?
MK: And Amanda —
DK: Does it feel like home then?
MK: No. Because it’s not like home there.
DK: No. No.
MK: It’s not like home anymore because there’s nobody I know.
DK: Right. Yeah. Yes. Yes.
MK: I mean all my uncles, I mean my mum was one of, my mum was one of one, two, three, four, five. My mum was one of eight. There was four, five, six. I think there was four boys. Or was it five boys and three girls? There may have been five boys. Anyway, there was eight. So, they’ve all passed away. Moving away from Woodhall I mean I was out with my brother one day. We were going to the [unclear] for a drink and this posh car stopped and my brother went across and was talking to him. So when, when my brother come back, I said, ‘Who the hell was that?’ He said, ‘That’s your cousin.’ Cousin so and so. You see, you don’t know.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
MK: Because you’ve moved on.
DK: So, you moved to Barnet then.
MK: No. I moved to Stamford.
DK: Stamford. Right. Ok.
MK: Dad sold up. Dad sold up in Woodhall.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And he bought a place in Bourne.
DK: Right.
MK: He didn’t like it. So apparently this little shop down the High Street became vacant in Stamford. He went and bought it. My mum, she wanted a wool and baby linen shop.
DK: Yeah.
MK: So he bought this. It was called Rs and Lee, and they did babywear, knitting, all that sort of thing. So my dad bought that for mum.
DK: Right.
MK: And it kept him occupied. It kept mum occupied. My sister, she used to work for [unclear] the chemist in Woodhall.
DK: And what, what career did you go into then? What were you doing?
MK: And I left, when I was, what? I was eleven and a half when I came to Stamford so I did my last four and a half years at Stamford School.
DK: Right.
MK: And then I never [pause] I hated school. On my report it was lack of attention. You know, if somebody were playing football outside I used to sit and watch it.
DK: I think I’ve got something similar.
MK: Never mind. As we and so I finished and I went into I always wanted to go in to poultry.
DK: Right.
MK: I fancied poultry. So, when I left school, I went into, I worked on a big poultry farm and then the boss, I was there seven years. Thoroughly enjoyed it, and the boss decided to sell up. He wanted, he wanted to retire. Then I went on different farms.
DK: Right.
MK: And then I got eventually went in to the, got in to the building trade.
DK: Oh right. Ok.
MK: And I spent the rest of my life in the building trade but no its, I’ll tell you there’s a lot of things that if you really sit and think about it in Woodhall you could, certain things come to your mind.
DK: I was going to say we’ll probably wrap up there. I think we’ve got most of that period. I’ll ask finally how do you look back on your childhood now in Woodhall Spa, and all that you saw and the experience of the change of wartime?
MK: I enjoyed it. I knew there was a war on. I know things were tight but I had a carefree youth because there was no, no pressure like today. I mean you made your own entertainment.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Dark nights you only had one fire to sit around. There was no central heating. You had. You had a, you sat around a coal fire.
DK: Yeah.
MK: Or whatever you got hold of to burn and you played games. You played Snakes and Ladders. You played, you played Lexicon and you played Draughts. Your parents played with you.
DK: Yeah. Yeah.
MK: It was a family concern and then some nights I mean good God I mean right up to being ooh nine, ten you was in bed by 7 o’clock and your bedroom was pitch dark because it was all black out. You couldn’t, you couldn’t see what was going on outside. I mean, you see in those days, in the 1940s you had double summer time.
DK: Yes. Yeah.
MK: The men were still working in the fields at 11 o’clock at night.
DK: Yeah.
MK: And that, as I say you went to bed early. You played games and if it was, if it was summertime you were allowed to play out on the lawn a little while. You weren’t allowed outside the gate. I was allowed to play on the lawn a little while and then you went in. You was washed, night clothes on and bed. That was you settled for the night. You woke up occasionally. You heard the planes. You heard Lancasters taking, you heard Lancasters going over and that sort of thing. We used to take no notice.
DK: Yeah.
MK: It was part and parcel of life. I mean as I said you’d be playing outside and you’d see Lancasters doing an air test but you never, you never looked. Now, Christ if you see one it’s an event.
DK: Yeah.
MK: You’d go miles to see a Lancaster now.
DK: Yes. That’s true. Ok then. I think we’ll pause and stop it there. That’s marvellous. Thanks very much for that. I’ll stop the recorder now but thanks. Thank very much.
[pause]
MK: I mean, I could tell you little bits and pieces.
Dublin Core
The Dublin Core metadata element set is common to all Omeka records, including items, files, and collections. For more information see, http://dublincore.org/documents/dces/.
Title
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Interview with Mick Kettleborough
Creator
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David Kavanagh
Publisher
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IBCC Digital Archive
Date
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2018-09-05
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This content is available under a CC BY-NC 4.0 International license (Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial 4.0). It has been published ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre. For more information, visit https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc/4.0/ and https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/legal.
Type
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Sound
Identifier
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AKettleboroughML180905, PKettleboroughML1801
Conforms To
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Pending review
Format
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00:38:24 audio recording
Language
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eng
Coverage
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Civilian
Spatial Coverage
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Great Britain
England--Lincolnshire
Description
An account of the resource
Michael Kettleborough lived in Woodhall Spa during the war. His mother billeted RAF crew members in her home. One of them Jack Gibson asked for an early Christmas as there were some big operations coming up. Shortly before Christmas 1941 the Manchester in which he was flying was hit by flak and crash landed at RAF Woodhall Spa and he and his crew killed. Jack left personal items and valuables with Michael’s parents who duly returned them to Jack’s parents in Canada after the war. One night in August 1943 an enemy landmine was dropped on the town damaging properties, destroying the Royal Hotel and causing casualties.
Temporal Coverage
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1941-12-18
1942
1943-08
Contributor
An entity responsible for making contributions to the resource
Julie Williams
97 Squadron
bombing
childhood in wartime
crash
home front
killed in action
Lancaster
military living conditions
RAF Coningsby
RAF Woodhall Spa