Leonard Cheshire speech at RAAFA dinner in Brisbane 27 September 1981
Title
Leonard Cheshire speech at RAAFA dinner in Brisbane 27 September 1981
Description
After opening remarks and thanks states that he would offer a personal reflection on the war. Tells story about rapid promotion in the air force in wartime. Tells of the lessons he learned in wartime. Reflects in his first operational posting and continues talking of lessons he leaned. Concludes with requirement for a goal which would make the sacrifices of WW2 not in vain. Talks of pacifism and anti-nuclear campaigners and compares this to the alternative of actively working for peace. Goes on the define peace. Submitted with caption 'On original insert "Gigi Cheshire Turramurra / Leonard Cheshire RAAFA Brisbane". Side 1: Talk by Elizabeth Cheshire (Leonard Cheshire's daughter) to a Youth Club at Turramurra, Sydney, Australia about her parents' Foundations 20/9/81. Address by Leonard Cheshire at RAAFA dinner in Brisbane 27/9/81. Leonard reminisces about the war with some members of his crew who are present'.
Creator
Date
1981-09-27
Language
Type
Format
Audio recording 00:30:21
Publisher
Rights
This content is property of the Leonard Cheshire Archive which has kindly granted the International Bomber Command Centre Digital Archive a royalty-free permission to publish it. Please note that it was digitised by a third-party which used technical specifications that may differ from those used by International Bomber Command Centre Digital Archive. It has been published here ‘as is’ and may contain inaccuracies or culturally inappropriate references that do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the University of Lincoln or the International Bomber Command Centre.
Identifier
SCheshireGL72021v20015-0001, SCheshireGL72021v20015-0001-Transcript
Transcription
Leonard Cheshire Resonate Project
File Title: Address by GLC to RAAFA in Brisbane 27.9.81
Duration: 30:23 mins
Transcription Date: 28/04/20
Archive Number: AV-S_227_1_S2
Start of Transcription
00:01 Group Captain Leonard Cheshire: Mr President, and gentleman. First and foremost, I must try and tell you how much I appreciate the trouble that you've been to, to invite me as your guest here tonight. I count it a very great privilege indeed for all sorts of reasons, to be your guest. And I also thank you for giving me the opportunity of talking to you with some of my own thoughts about the war.
00:40 I think I also want to thank you for putting up with me improperly dressed [laughter from audience]... By accident not by design. I'm very conscious of the fact that amongst you are many... old friends. And it is a tremendous pleasure to know that I am in a room with so many people who represent those who came over from different parts of the world to help fight our war. A number of whom I've known for a long time.
01:25 I have to admit that at approximately 350 degrees from me - looking the way I'm looking - there is a somewhat dubious table [laughter from audience], at which 3 of my friends, at least, are sitting. One of them came to me one day - in 617 - came into the office, stood up right and said, 'Sir'. The moment he said that I knew that either trouble, or something peculiar was happening. [Laughter from audience]. He said, 'I want 3 days leave.' I said, 'What for, Ross?', 'Play cricket' he said. Well, we'd never seen Ross with a cricket bat in his hand. I said, 'Ross, I've been asked for leave for all sorts of reasons, but never to play cricket for 3 days.' Well he said, 'Can I have it?', I said, 'Yes'. When I picked up the paper the day afterwards - or two days later - I'd found there'd been a test match between the MCC, and a commonwealth team. And this fellow, Ross, had made - as I remember - 17 not out in the first innings. And sitting next to him, is another member of that commonwealth team - though whether you've heard of him, I don't know - Keith Miller.
[Laughter and clapping from audience 2:54 to 03:04]
03:04 And to make it worse, at the very same table, is my old Bomb Aimer, Keith Asbury.
[Clapping 03:09 to 03:16]
03:17 Ross is Ross Stanford. [Laughter from audience] And Keith and Ross... know me too well to allow me to get away with anything in the way of... a flawing reminiscence... at this microphone, so I'm very conscious of that - Keith.
03:39 I would like if I may, in view of... the trouble that you've taken to bring me here. To make a kind of reflection - a personal reflection - upon the war. With particular reference to the meaning of that war. And what it means today... that, you, RAF Europe, have established this strong, lasting bond. To me that is something very meaningful, and something that is outstanding in your great country. Exemplified above all by Anzac Day. Which has a dimension and a meaning beyond anything that I have seen anywhere else in the world.
04:43 First, just as a little digression, and since your president talked about promotion, in the air force - war time air force - and about it's speed - in some cases. May I tell you something about the system... by which it worked. By recounting the story of a certain flying officer, who was one of those people who absolutely longed for promotion. Most of his time was devoted to seeing how he could get promoted. It happened that he was posted to Gibraltar, given a Hurricane, and entrusted with the aerial defence of that Bastian of the British Empire. He soon discovered that there was a system that operated - a warning system - and it had 3 phases. The first, the siren went off and he had to leap out of bed, get dressed, run up to flights. When the second siren went, he had to run out to his Hurricane, jump into the cockpit, and sit and wait. And when the third one went off, he had to take off. Well he found that siren 1 and siren 2 frequently went, but siren 3 never went. So being a very resourceful fellow, he managed to train one of the... 'rock monkeys' [laughter from audience]... to perform actions 1 and 2 for him. [Laughter from audience] While he lay comfortably in bed. Unfortunately, one night, siren 3 went off... [laughter from audience] well he got out of bed in remarkably quick time, got into his uniform, dashed out to flights... only to discover the Hurricane trundling down the runway [laughter from audience]. Which ended all hope of promotion for that particular flying officer. [Laughter from audience] But to make it worse, the monkey managed to land the Hurricane back safely, and ended up the war Group Captain.
[Laughter and clapping from audience 07:11 to 07:25]
07:25 Things have changed hey Vice Marshal, have they? [Laughter and clapping from audience]
07:26 Man: Oh I'm not sure! [laughs]
[Laughter from audience 07:28 to 07:34]
07:34 G.C: Well if I may come to my, personal reflections. I think the first... remembrance I have, of the war time RAF. The first lesson that it taught me, was the need to be professional. We were young then, and I don't think we took our studies particularly seriously. But once war had broken out, and once we arrived at our training station, I think we realised that we were going to have to devote ourselves to becoming a true professional. And of course, I think all of us will have found, in different walks of life, that there is no success unless you are totally professional in whatever your job is. Of course, luck can come into it. And I remember well, being at my EFTS on Ansons... and one of the things we had to do was fly under the hood - if any of you remember that experience. A very pleasant instructor on the port side, pulled down the hood so that you could see nothing but he could, and you flew on instruments. And at the end of this little part of your course, he'd pull the hood down, told you he's going to give you a series of courses and times to fly, and that at the end of it he would ask you where you were. Very nice of him. [Laughter from audience 09:22 to 09:26 ] In this instance, he suddenly pulled the hood up, and said, 'Now I give you 30 seconds to tell me where we are', and I lifted up the map and squinted out of the... right window. Just in time to see my favourite pub - the Half Moon - appearing under the starboard wing, which of course he couldn't see. So I said, 'We're 3 miles north north-west to the village of Kington Langley, Sir'. [Laughter from audience 09:57 to 10:02] First time I've ever known an instructor temporally lost for words [laughter from audience 10:08 to 10:10]. And the first time I'd ever gotten an above average rating [unclear] [laughter from audience 10:14 to 10:20].
10:20 When I arrived at my operational station, having wanted anything rather than Bomber Command, having put down on my form - we were given 3 choices then as to what operational command we went to - and I put 3 down that were not Bomber Command, and got posted at Bomber Command [laughter from audience]... It was typical [laughter from audience]. I had a New Zealander, as my first captain, Lofty, a pre-war pilot. And if ever there was a professional, it was he. And any time he saw me sitting down to have a cup of coffee, or start playing a game of cards or something, he'd pull me up, send me up to flights, say, 'Get into the Whitley, blindfold yourself, and spend 30 minuets going round the cockpit until you know where everything is'. I didn't like it. But I was soon to learn the meaning of it. And when... 3 and a half years later, I went to 6 1 7 - I was an interloper really, in 6 1 7 - I think, Keith will remember this - people wondered, 'Who was this fellow coming from outside the squadron, to take over'. I had to learn - in a way that I'd never learnt before - low flying. I had done low flying but I'd not done it in the way that 6 1 7 had. Fortunately for me, I like low flying. I didn't like being high up and looking over the edge and seeing the ground a long way away. I just liked the feel of trees going past and so on, and what is more, I enjoyed the fact that the man in the nose, who was seeing everything the closest, [laughter from audience] Keith, would be wondering whether I was gonna pull up just in time or whether I wasn't gonna pull up just in time. [laughter from audience 12:37 to 12:40].
12:43 Everybody in this room who... flew in... the war time air force. Will agree with me, that if you are going to succeed in an operation, you have to know your flying so well that no part of your mind is devoted to the action of flying. Your whole mind should be concentrated solely on what you are going to do. I've met other people - outside the war, at the top of their profession - they all say the same thing, that you must polish everything possibly can polish, what you can't polish you just have to leave to providence. We, in 6 1 7, when we were doing our low level marking - and it was low level, it was below tree level, at night, well with the moon light, or under flares. If we had - and we were flying 2 or 3 hours a day, every day - if we had a weekend off, when there was an op that night, we would take the aircraft up and do an hour and half or 2 hours practice. Just to make up for those 2 days off. I think that's a lesson we can carry forward into the future, that where there is to be achievement, there has to be total commitment and total dedication and professionalism.
14:31 The next thing that I learnt, in the air force, and that's remained with me ever since... is the fact... that we were all members of a team. We talk about individual achievement, even in war, but I don't believe there is such a thing, really, as individual achievement. Some people are lifted up, I know, and put into the lime light, but those who are, know only too well in their hearts, how much they owe to other people. That had it not been for the team of which they were a part, it would never have been possible. And I mean not just a team of your own aircraft, not just your ground crew, who waited for you all night sometimes, in the rain and the cold out at dispersal, waiting to welcome you back. And if you did not establish a warm relationship with them, relate to them, you couldn't really expect them to do their job completely. I mean right through every rank on the station, down to the very lowest. We all depended upon each other. I even take it further than that, to those who built the aircraft, who kept the nation going. Nowadays - in a war like World War 2 - it's the entire nation that fights. And, that feeling of solidarity when you knew that everyone was behind you, when you knew that everyone had a part to play... I'm sure has made an impression on all those who went through that experience. And I think that we need to carry it forward, to today. I think of course that war, for all its horror, is easier than peace, because the objective is clear, you know. You are a nation that's united with a common goal, and a common purpose, and a common knowledge that if you don't win, you sink. And therefore, we the allies, faced in 1939, with overwhelming odds, did in fact win through. In peace time it's much more difficult to see what the goal is.
17:40 But before I sit down, I want to assert that there is a goal, and that if we don't keep it in mind, and determine that we are going to reach it, then the victory of World War 2 may perhaps have been in vain. There is something that has to be said about World War 2. It's tragedy to me, is not so much the war itself, in which - you may know - 55 million lives were lost, and out of those 20 million in the concentration camps. Nothing to do with war at all. The first was set up in 1933 at Dachau. That is what would have happened to the world, had the war not been won. The tragedy is, that had Britain and France… had… the necessary political will, that war would never have happened. I think one also has to say that had the peace treaty of World War 1 - the Treaty of Versailles - not had a certain gross injustice to it, Hitler would never have had the power base on which to get where he did. If you win a war, in my view, you have to be very certain that you are then just… in the treaty that you enforce. Hitler got to the position he did by bluffing. in 1938 at Munich, he was completely outnumbered for the reason that on his southern flank was the Czech army. The strongest army in Europe in terms of efficiency and determination, but we gave that away.
[Silence 20:00 to 20:08]
20:08 The reason I say that... is that... in our world, no matter how much we advance, there is always a danger of an aggressor. To suppose there will never be an aggressor again, would be naive. An aggressor is given his opportunity in the face of weakness, or lack of resolution. I think Hitler might quite fairly have turned round and said, 'If you told me you were going to fight, I wouldn't have done that', because he always swore he would never fight on two fronts.
20:58 Today - it's certainly in Europe - we are faced with an ever growing pacifist movement. Now it’s quite clear that a country that's not united in its resolve to stand up to aggression - if an aggressor should march - is as vulnerable as a country that isn't armed. So, I claim, that this is a problem that vitally concerns all of us in this room. Because we have been through a war, and we know what it means, and we know what it means to start a war without the necessary weapons, insufficiently armed. What I think we all need to do, is to be equipped in our own minds to meet the pacifist - or perhaps the unilateralist who is not actually a pacifist but he thinks we should throw away our nuclear defence - that we should be able to meet his arguments in a reasoned, intelligent way, and show him that we are men of peace. Show him that his belief, that by throwing away your nuclear weapons you do away with a threat of a nuclear war, is wrong. To do that, in my mind, would be the most dangerous thing that we could do. But unfortunately, in some of the arguments you hear, the unilateralist appears to be a man of peace, and the man arguing the other side appears to be a man of war. I have learnt that it is very important, right at the beginning, to establish 2 things - if you'll allow me to say this - First, we must respect the sincerity of his view, however wrong. He's usually a young person, he can't see why one should go to war - neither could we - and he thinks that he is doing humanity a good service. We must respect his sincerity. Secondly, we must establish that we are first and foremost men of peace. If we propound the argument that we need to be adequately defended, that is only because we know that that is the best defence against possible aggression. And what is happening in Poland today - a country with which I am very closely associated, through my wife who has built a number of hospitals and little homes there - should alert us to the danger of being weak. One thing is quite certain, an aggressor never marches unless he thinks he can get away with it. So I would like to... suggest, that we have a duty to those who laid down their lives... in the war. To be equipped in our minds to meet the unilateralist, and to show him with calm, reasoned, informed arguments, that he's wrong.
25:03 But that's only one side.. of the picture. The other side is that we need actively to work for peace. Now, people talk about peace... but when you come to stop and think, what is peace? Peace is not the absence of armed confrontation. If you were living in Uganda under Amin, there was no war, but you were not living in peace. Peace presupposes justice. Without justice and freedom there is no peace, it's just an illusion. So in other words, the way that we work for peace is by working for justice, at all levels and in all forms in all parts of the world. Everything that we do, that helps remove a gross injustice, or that improves the quality of justice, is a positive act and contribution towards peace. I submit, that the greatest threat to peace today - apart from the danger of an aggressor - is the... gross injustice of the gap between the very poor of the world - I mean the poor sections of the world - and those of us who live in relative security. There can be no peace so long as that gap exists. For one thing, those who have a political motivation will use it as a power base. For another thing, if we don't help the developing countries to become economically viable, there's no prosperity. Our economy is inextricably linked with theirs, because we all make... we all are members of one single human family. It’s an organic whole, it’s not an artificial whole like a... bowl of flowers, it's organic like a tree, so any part that's injured of incapacitated affects the rest. So we should be seen, if we're going to be true, to the memory of those whose laid down their lives in the last war, and all wars, if we're to be true to their memory, we must, in our little way, each according our opportunity, work for peace.
28:10 I believe that every ex-service organisation, and yours especially here in your county, have a special role to play in this way. Because you know what it is to stand shoulder to shoulder against a common threat and win. Today, however obscure, however difficult to define, however complex in its solution, we do face a threat. And that threat is both the danger of aggression, and the consequences of paying too little attention to the gap between the rich, the richer, and the poor. That was our fault in the 30's, we didn't want to know, we waited too late. My hope and my prayer, is that we won't, in a different way, make the same mistake now.
29:25 Once again, I do thank you with all my heart, for having given me the privilege and the enormous pleasure of being with you tonight. I can say in all truthfulness, I've never come to Australia - as I often come in connection with the foundation that bares my wife's and my name - The Ryder Cheshire Foundation - two of whose members are here today - without going away feeling better and stronger for the help and the encouragement, and the kindness - and at times being told a few home truths which we all need - and that is true of this occasion too. So, with all my heart, thank you.
[Clapping 30:21 to 30:24 ]
30:21 Speech ends
30:24 End of recording
End of Transcription.
File Title: Address by GLC to RAAFA in Brisbane 27.9.81
Duration: 30:23 mins
Transcription Date: 28/04/20
Archive Number: AV-S_227_1_S2
Start of Transcription
00:01 Group Captain Leonard Cheshire: Mr President, and gentleman. First and foremost, I must try and tell you how much I appreciate the trouble that you've been to, to invite me as your guest here tonight. I count it a very great privilege indeed for all sorts of reasons, to be your guest. And I also thank you for giving me the opportunity of talking to you with some of my own thoughts about the war.
00:40 I think I also want to thank you for putting up with me improperly dressed [laughter from audience]... By accident not by design. I'm very conscious of the fact that amongst you are many... old friends. And it is a tremendous pleasure to know that I am in a room with so many people who represent those who came over from different parts of the world to help fight our war. A number of whom I've known for a long time.
01:25 I have to admit that at approximately 350 degrees from me - looking the way I'm looking - there is a somewhat dubious table [laughter from audience], at which 3 of my friends, at least, are sitting. One of them came to me one day - in 617 - came into the office, stood up right and said, 'Sir'. The moment he said that I knew that either trouble, or something peculiar was happening. [Laughter from audience]. He said, 'I want 3 days leave.' I said, 'What for, Ross?', 'Play cricket' he said. Well, we'd never seen Ross with a cricket bat in his hand. I said, 'Ross, I've been asked for leave for all sorts of reasons, but never to play cricket for 3 days.' Well he said, 'Can I have it?', I said, 'Yes'. When I picked up the paper the day afterwards - or two days later - I'd found there'd been a test match between the MCC, and a commonwealth team. And this fellow, Ross, had made - as I remember - 17 not out in the first innings. And sitting next to him, is another member of that commonwealth team - though whether you've heard of him, I don't know - Keith Miller.
[Laughter and clapping from audience 2:54 to 03:04]
03:04 And to make it worse, at the very same table, is my old Bomb Aimer, Keith Asbury.
[Clapping 03:09 to 03:16]
03:17 Ross is Ross Stanford. [Laughter from audience] And Keith and Ross... know me too well to allow me to get away with anything in the way of... a flawing reminiscence... at this microphone, so I'm very conscious of that - Keith.
03:39 I would like if I may, in view of... the trouble that you've taken to bring me here. To make a kind of reflection - a personal reflection - upon the war. With particular reference to the meaning of that war. And what it means today... that, you, RAF Europe, have established this strong, lasting bond. To me that is something very meaningful, and something that is outstanding in your great country. Exemplified above all by Anzac Day. Which has a dimension and a meaning beyond anything that I have seen anywhere else in the world.
04:43 First, just as a little digression, and since your president talked about promotion, in the air force - war time air force - and about it's speed - in some cases. May I tell you something about the system... by which it worked. By recounting the story of a certain flying officer, who was one of those people who absolutely longed for promotion. Most of his time was devoted to seeing how he could get promoted. It happened that he was posted to Gibraltar, given a Hurricane, and entrusted with the aerial defence of that Bastian of the British Empire. He soon discovered that there was a system that operated - a warning system - and it had 3 phases. The first, the siren went off and he had to leap out of bed, get dressed, run up to flights. When the second siren went, he had to run out to his Hurricane, jump into the cockpit, and sit and wait. And when the third one went off, he had to take off. Well he found that siren 1 and siren 2 frequently went, but siren 3 never went. So being a very resourceful fellow, he managed to train one of the... 'rock monkeys' [laughter from audience]... to perform actions 1 and 2 for him. [Laughter from audience] While he lay comfortably in bed. Unfortunately, one night, siren 3 went off... [laughter from audience] well he got out of bed in remarkably quick time, got into his uniform, dashed out to flights... only to discover the Hurricane trundling down the runway [laughter from audience]. Which ended all hope of promotion for that particular flying officer. [Laughter from audience] But to make it worse, the monkey managed to land the Hurricane back safely, and ended up the war Group Captain.
[Laughter and clapping from audience 07:11 to 07:25]
07:25 Things have changed hey Vice Marshal, have they? [Laughter and clapping from audience]
07:26 Man: Oh I'm not sure! [laughs]
[Laughter from audience 07:28 to 07:34]
07:34 G.C: Well if I may come to my, personal reflections. I think the first... remembrance I have, of the war time RAF. The first lesson that it taught me, was the need to be professional. We were young then, and I don't think we took our studies particularly seriously. But once war had broken out, and once we arrived at our training station, I think we realised that we were going to have to devote ourselves to becoming a true professional. And of course, I think all of us will have found, in different walks of life, that there is no success unless you are totally professional in whatever your job is. Of course, luck can come into it. And I remember well, being at my EFTS on Ansons... and one of the things we had to do was fly under the hood - if any of you remember that experience. A very pleasant instructor on the port side, pulled down the hood so that you could see nothing but he could, and you flew on instruments. And at the end of this little part of your course, he'd pull the hood down, told you he's going to give you a series of courses and times to fly, and that at the end of it he would ask you where you were. Very nice of him. [Laughter from audience 09:22 to 09:26 ] In this instance, he suddenly pulled the hood up, and said, 'Now I give you 30 seconds to tell me where we are', and I lifted up the map and squinted out of the... right window. Just in time to see my favourite pub - the Half Moon - appearing under the starboard wing, which of course he couldn't see. So I said, 'We're 3 miles north north-west to the village of Kington Langley, Sir'. [Laughter from audience 09:57 to 10:02] First time I've ever known an instructor temporally lost for words [laughter from audience 10:08 to 10:10]. And the first time I'd ever gotten an above average rating [unclear] [laughter from audience 10:14 to 10:20].
10:20 When I arrived at my operational station, having wanted anything rather than Bomber Command, having put down on my form - we were given 3 choices then as to what operational command we went to - and I put 3 down that were not Bomber Command, and got posted at Bomber Command [laughter from audience]... It was typical [laughter from audience]. I had a New Zealander, as my first captain, Lofty, a pre-war pilot. And if ever there was a professional, it was he. And any time he saw me sitting down to have a cup of coffee, or start playing a game of cards or something, he'd pull me up, send me up to flights, say, 'Get into the Whitley, blindfold yourself, and spend 30 minuets going round the cockpit until you know where everything is'. I didn't like it. But I was soon to learn the meaning of it. And when... 3 and a half years later, I went to 6 1 7 - I was an interloper really, in 6 1 7 - I think, Keith will remember this - people wondered, 'Who was this fellow coming from outside the squadron, to take over'. I had to learn - in a way that I'd never learnt before - low flying. I had done low flying but I'd not done it in the way that 6 1 7 had. Fortunately for me, I like low flying. I didn't like being high up and looking over the edge and seeing the ground a long way away. I just liked the feel of trees going past and so on, and what is more, I enjoyed the fact that the man in the nose, who was seeing everything the closest, [laughter from audience] Keith, would be wondering whether I was gonna pull up just in time or whether I wasn't gonna pull up just in time. [laughter from audience 12:37 to 12:40].
12:43 Everybody in this room who... flew in... the war time air force. Will agree with me, that if you are going to succeed in an operation, you have to know your flying so well that no part of your mind is devoted to the action of flying. Your whole mind should be concentrated solely on what you are going to do. I've met other people - outside the war, at the top of their profession - they all say the same thing, that you must polish everything possibly can polish, what you can't polish you just have to leave to providence. We, in 6 1 7, when we were doing our low level marking - and it was low level, it was below tree level, at night, well with the moon light, or under flares. If we had - and we were flying 2 or 3 hours a day, every day - if we had a weekend off, when there was an op that night, we would take the aircraft up and do an hour and half or 2 hours practice. Just to make up for those 2 days off. I think that's a lesson we can carry forward into the future, that where there is to be achievement, there has to be total commitment and total dedication and professionalism.
14:31 The next thing that I learnt, in the air force, and that's remained with me ever since... is the fact... that we were all members of a team. We talk about individual achievement, even in war, but I don't believe there is such a thing, really, as individual achievement. Some people are lifted up, I know, and put into the lime light, but those who are, know only too well in their hearts, how much they owe to other people. That had it not been for the team of which they were a part, it would never have been possible. And I mean not just a team of your own aircraft, not just your ground crew, who waited for you all night sometimes, in the rain and the cold out at dispersal, waiting to welcome you back. And if you did not establish a warm relationship with them, relate to them, you couldn't really expect them to do their job completely. I mean right through every rank on the station, down to the very lowest. We all depended upon each other. I even take it further than that, to those who built the aircraft, who kept the nation going. Nowadays - in a war like World War 2 - it's the entire nation that fights. And, that feeling of solidarity when you knew that everyone was behind you, when you knew that everyone had a part to play... I'm sure has made an impression on all those who went through that experience. And I think that we need to carry it forward, to today. I think of course that war, for all its horror, is easier than peace, because the objective is clear, you know. You are a nation that's united with a common goal, and a common purpose, and a common knowledge that if you don't win, you sink. And therefore, we the allies, faced in 1939, with overwhelming odds, did in fact win through. In peace time it's much more difficult to see what the goal is.
17:40 But before I sit down, I want to assert that there is a goal, and that if we don't keep it in mind, and determine that we are going to reach it, then the victory of World War 2 may perhaps have been in vain. There is something that has to be said about World War 2. It's tragedy to me, is not so much the war itself, in which - you may know - 55 million lives were lost, and out of those 20 million in the concentration camps. Nothing to do with war at all. The first was set up in 1933 at Dachau. That is what would have happened to the world, had the war not been won. The tragedy is, that had Britain and France… had… the necessary political will, that war would never have happened. I think one also has to say that had the peace treaty of World War 1 - the Treaty of Versailles - not had a certain gross injustice to it, Hitler would never have had the power base on which to get where he did. If you win a war, in my view, you have to be very certain that you are then just… in the treaty that you enforce. Hitler got to the position he did by bluffing. in 1938 at Munich, he was completely outnumbered for the reason that on his southern flank was the Czech army. The strongest army in Europe in terms of efficiency and determination, but we gave that away.
[Silence 20:00 to 20:08]
20:08 The reason I say that... is that... in our world, no matter how much we advance, there is always a danger of an aggressor. To suppose there will never be an aggressor again, would be naive. An aggressor is given his opportunity in the face of weakness, or lack of resolution. I think Hitler might quite fairly have turned round and said, 'If you told me you were going to fight, I wouldn't have done that', because he always swore he would never fight on two fronts.
20:58 Today - it's certainly in Europe - we are faced with an ever growing pacifist movement. Now it’s quite clear that a country that's not united in its resolve to stand up to aggression - if an aggressor should march - is as vulnerable as a country that isn't armed. So, I claim, that this is a problem that vitally concerns all of us in this room. Because we have been through a war, and we know what it means, and we know what it means to start a war without the necessary weapons, insufficiently armed. What I think we all need to do, is to be equipped in our own minds to meet the pacifist - or perhaps the unilateralist who is not actually a pacifist but he thinks we should throw away our nuclear defence - that we should be able to meet his arguments in a reasoned, intelligent way, and show him that we are men of peace. Show him that his belief, that by throwing away your nuclear weapons you do away with a threat of a nuclear war, is wrong. To do that, in my mind, would be the most dangerous thing that we could do. But unfortunately, in some of the arguments you hear, the unilateralist appears to be a man of peace, and the man arguing the other side appears to be a man of war. I have learnt that it is very important, right at the beginning, to establish 2 things - if you'll allow me to say this - First, we must respect the sincerity of his view, however wrong. He's usually a young person, he can't see why one should go to war - neither could we - and he thinks that he is doing humanity a good service. We must respect his sincerity. Secondly, we must establish that we are first and foremost men of peace. If we propound the argument that we need to be adequately defended, that is only because we know that that is the best defence against possible aggression. And what is happening in Poland today - a country with which I am very closely associated, through my wife who has built a number of hospitals and little homes there - should alert us to the danger of being weak. One thing is quite certain, an aggressor never marches unless he thinks he can get away with it. So I would like to... suggest, that we have a duty to those who laid down their lives... in the war. To be equipped in our minds to meet the unilateralist, and to show him with calm, reasoned, informed arguments, that he's wrong.
25:03 But that's only one side.. of the picture. The other side is that we need actively to work for peace. Now, people talk about peace... but when you come to stop and think, what is peace? Peace is not the absence of armed confrontation. If you were living in Uganda under Amin, there was no war, but you were not living in peace. Peace presupposes justice. Without justice and freedom there is no peace, it's just an illusion. So in other words, the way that we work for peace is by working for justice, at all levels and in all forms in all parts of the world. Everything that we do, that helps remove a gross injustice, or that improves the quality of justice, is a positive act and contribution towards peace. I submit, that the greatest threat to peace today - apart from the danger of an aggressor - is the... gross injustice of the gap between the very poor of the world - I mean the poor sections of the world - and those of us who live in relative security. There can be no peace so long as that gap exists. For one thing, those who have a political motivation will use it as a power base. For another thing, if we don't help the developing countries to become economically viable, there's no prosperity. Our economy is inextricably linked with theirs, because we all make... we all are members of one single human family. It’s an organic whole, it’s not an artificial whole like a... bowl of flowers, it's organic like a tree, so any part that's injured of incapacitated affects the rest. So we should be seen, if we're going to be true, to the memory of those whose laid down their lives in the last war, and all wars, if we're to be true to their memory, we must, in our little way, each according our opportunity, work for peace.
28:10 I believe that every ex-service organisation, and yours especially here in your county, have a special role to play in this way. Because you know what it is to stand shoulder to shoulder against a common threat and win. Today, however obscure, however difficult to define, however complex in its solution, we do face a threat. And that threat is both the danger of aggression, and the consequences of paying too little attention to the gap between the rich, the richer, and the poor. That was our fault in the 30's, we didn't want to know, we waited too late. My hope and my prayer, is that we won't, in a different way, make the same mistake now.
29:25 Once again, I do thank you with all my heart, for having given me the privilege and the enormous pleasure of being with you tonight. I can say in all truthfulness, I've never come to Australia - as I often come in connection with the foundation that bares my wife's and my name - The Ryder Cheshire Foundation - two of whose members are here today - without going away feeling better and stronger for the help and the encouragement, and the kindness - and at times being told a few home truths which we all need - and that is true of this occasion too. So, with all my heart, thank you.
[Clapping 30:21 to 30:24 ]
30:21 Speech ends
30:24 End of recording
End of Transcription.
Collection
Citation
G L Cheshire, “Leonard Cheshire speech at RAAFA dinner in Brisbane 27 September 1981,” IBCC Digital Archive, accessed April 29, 2025, https://ibccdigitalarchive.lincoln.ac.uk/omeka/collections/document/40153.
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